Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Ruger M 77/357 rebarrel to 256 WinMag?

Would it be a relatively easy job? Bolt face is the same. Might have to work on magazine feed lips? Rotary magazine should allow for "pointy" bullets?

Do the barrels on these swap out easily?

Just an idea I had as I like the cartridge, have a couple of guns so chambered, and would like a bolt action too.

Think the right person could talk Ruger into chambering some from the factory? Assuming they could also talk Winchester into loading ammo it also.

Wow!! I like that idea..

It's a neat idea, but here are a few points to consider:

There's a good chance it would feed OK. It should be easier to get a 25 caliber bullet to fit in the "funnel" of a 357 chamber than a 357. But you'll never know till you try it.

There's a snowball's chance of getting Ruger to chamber it or Winchester to make more ammo. As a factory offering the 256 is dead. You're going to have to make a custom 25 caliber barrel.

It's also going to be hard to find an appropriate bullet. Hornady, God bless 'em, lists a 60 grain FP but like many of its more exotic offerings it's on "temporary suspension". I suspect you might run into bullet length issues with any heavier spitzers.

Best of luck and keep us posted.

Do not forget cast bullets.

I have been thinking about this as a project. Someone out there would be happy to make you a custom mold with about four cavities. Look what NOE might have now.

357 brass will never be a problem. Case forming dies should be easy to turn out from a length of threaded rod by anyone with a lathe.

Barrels of the 77/CF models have, to my knowledge, always been threaded into the receivers. Until recently, the RFs were slip-fit and clamped like 10/22 barrels, but are now also threaded.

Your idea is a good one, actually one I have mulled over at times along with turning a 77/44 into a 77/357 B&D.

The nice lady at Ruger parts sales told me that the plastic stocks for the 77/44 and the 77/357 are the same which leads me to think that a walnut 77/44 stock could be fitted to a stainless 77/357, which would be quite handsome, I think. The main obstacle would be finding a stock as Ruger doesn't have any extras lying around waiting for my good ideas.

Be very careful of your chambering reamer dimensions. I know of one commercial reamerthat is over size in the base diameter and too long from rim to shoulder. Just like the Marlin levergun case life is short.

PM Penndog and see if he ever build his: Ruger 77/256

Thanks djp for that link, somehow in the few years I've been on the 'fire I missed that post. I didn't know if anyone else had a like idea, but figured if there was such a person they'd be around here. I'll take your recommendation and pm Mr Penndog.

Thanks to the rest of you for your input too.

As for some of the "issues" with this round, I'm pretty set with brass. The Marlin I picked up a few years back came with a decent supply, along with dies, bullets and even a couple of boxes of factory ammo (still not fired by me yet :/). I also have some Quality Cartridge brass which I'm not sure I like yet, and I found some more factory brass at a gun show once. If I ever have the need, I'll use some of those forming hints on some of the multitude of 357 brass I've got hanging around.

I've also got various bullets to try from my 25-20 loading. Using the 75 gr Speer flatpoint w/cannelure I took a javelina with my .256 7.5 inch revolver. +/- 15 yd shot. Lungs and liver were mush but exit wounds not overly large (he was still standing after running a bit so he got a second round). I imagine if I'd have hit him in the shoulder I'd have ruined a bunch of meat, but he was hit behind the leg both times. I'd be interested in seeing how an 86 gr gas checked SWC would work out of a rifle length bbl. And as I mentioned the Marlin came with a number of bullets including a box of the hard to find 60gr hp.

I still think someone ( a gunwriter perhaps) should talk to Ruger and try to breathe life back into this interesting little round. Maybe if they'd have come up with a bolt gun the first time around we wouldn't be having this topic to knock around now.

Now that, too, would be a cool gun!

hmmmm? gets me to thinking, could one neck a 44mag down to 25? Has it been done already? Now I have something else to search the innanent for.

Geno

Stan TrozniWhatzit did a piece on the B&D in a TC not long ago. To me, and that platform, a .357 Max makes more sense. My notion about the Ruger pre-dates the 77/357 and regular .357 ballistics are sufficient for me now.

Somewhere I have an article, ( circa 1987) about using saboted .357 bullets in .44s, a .357 B&D on the cheap, but I doubt that outfit is still around.

Your .256 idea is still the best, as that ballistic niche is sorta empty these days and has a lot of practical application. Go for it; I love watching other loonies spend money.

SO do I!

Well, if it'll make a fellow 'fire member happy (you) I could always change course and find a donor Weatherby and chamber it in 25/378 and shoot "everything" from sooper zappers (85 gr special made titanium solids so they don't fly apart!) to #3 buckshot (0.25 in roundball) gallery loads.

Probably stick with the 77/256 idea though.

Have fun today.
Geno

This would be a case of reamer/reloading die conflict.

If you put the sizing die in a lathe and face off a couple or three thousands with a carbide bit, and run some paper over the edge all would probably be well.

Sierra's 70 grain blitzking with the plastic tips removed will cycle through the magazine of my 25-20 with acceptable COAL. Removing tips of the blitzkings is a PITA, but they give good speed and terminal performance.

75 grn Speer's or the Rem 86grn round nose should be available on gunbroker, but they aren't just everywhere, or available any time of year.

Neat project, good luck with it.

Let's keep in mind, Ruger's got a bit of history with the .256. Some of us remember the Ruger Hawkeye pistol. Back in '96 I saw one NIB in a gunshop in Millington TN for, IIRC, $1200.

my marlin 62 LOVES the 70 grain blitzkings, and it pops them out quite nicely. I think it would be a great little load for kids to learn on and could harvest a deer easy enough. a 70 gr bullet moving almost 2600 fps is no slouch. my 6 year old loves shooting it too. I wasn't impressed with the 86 grain bullets, 75's are fine, I have some but haven't played with them too much.

and there is a member here who did a build like you're talking, I'll look and see if I still have his PM from a couple years ago when I bought my 256, he had some good info.

Penndog is the one who did it, this was his advice "I really like the combo....the BIGGEST limitation is C.O.L. in the Ruger magazine - other than that it is great fun! I would keep the C.O.L. in mind with any build and the Martini would allow the greatest flexibility in that department. It would be a really good starter rifle for a young one and with the "right" bullet I would not be afraid to use it for deer sized animals."

probably wouldn't hurt to shoot him a pm if you want more info, he was very helpful for me, I settled on the 62 myself, but I would love to do one like you're talking.

I was never able to get the 75grn Speer or the 86grn Rem bullets to expand at 25-20 speeds. The 70grn blitzkings certainly do expand, but with the low speeds of the 25-20 they hold together just fine. That bullet has a lot of empty jacket that upsets easily enough causing a fairly wide mushroom.

I was re-reading an old John Wooters article (1969) and picked up a good idea for shortening bullets. He said to run them into a bullet sizing die adjusted to expose the part you want to remove, and then cut/file the tip off. A razor knife should do a good job on the plastic.

Would you mind sharing that load info? I have a friend who's father uses his 25-20 on our small deer, and this would surely be better than what he is using now.

You will want to check a loading manual, but I believe it is 11.8grn of H4198. My 75grn Speer load is 10.8 of H4198. The 70 grn Sierra load hits about 1/2" higher at 50yrds, which I consider about max range for deer with my personal 25-20 carbine. Part of that is the open sights leave a lot to be desired, Rem m25 with 17.5" barrel that is 80+ year old, so I don't push max loads.




I said the 70 Blitz has an empty jacket, but to be more exact it has a lot of plastic, the lead only comes up to the ogive.

Thanks folks for all the replies/info.

I did PM PennDog and he replied. Yes, he finished it but seems he's busy with other projects. Sent me a pic of a target and his load w/I4227 seems similar to the one I use except he used a 70 gr bullet and I'm using the 75 gr Speer flat nose. I ran five out of my 7.5" revolver over a chrono got about a 1640 fps ave. The bullet performed "perfectly" (animal died) on a smallish javelina (30lb dressed). Lungs and liver were "mushy" and the bullets exited (yes, bullets plural, He was still standing after the first and a short run so he got #2) That particular bullet designed for the 25-20 might be a bit "soft" at 256 velocities out of a carbine length bbl?

I have not checked that load over a chrono out of my Marlin 62. That's a project for later in the summer. I'm still interested in the 77/256 and waiting to see if PDog replies with some more info for me.

I will look into some of the bullets you folks are recommending. If not for the 256, then for my 25/20.

davet, nice to see the old rifle still takes game. Might have to look for one of those m25's for myself.

Somebody needs to talk Hornady into making us a 25 cal leverevolution soft tip bullet about 70 grs or so that we could use in our 25-20's and .256s.

Thanks again guys,
Geno

Good luck with the project.

Truth of the matter is that the m25 was one of the weaker actions that the 25-20 was chambered in. If I had to do it over again I would go with a single shot and not have to worry about C.O.L. or altering projectiles to make them fit and cycle through a magazine.

Your single shot would be a perfect idea for Ruger to bring back the Model 3?

Probably talk them into that about the same time I get a 77/256, right!

again, thanks for your input.

Geno

Thanks for the info. I dont have any 4198 on hand, but I'll keep my eye out. Powder is getting at least a little esier to come by around here.

My 25-20 is exactly like yours while my buddies Dad's is the rifle version. The carbine is the handiest little thing I've ever messed with.