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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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Did Pete ever mention to you why he won't work on Weatherby Vanguard actions? Too lazy to cut metric? Doesn't know how to cut metric? Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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I'm not trying to be a smartass, but I figure Bansner, Brown, etc know way more about it than 99.9% of the people here that always bitch and moan about twist rates. Obviously not. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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These clowns would be better off buying RARs, coating them, putting them in a good stock and selling them as "legendary". ha Good one haha
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle. I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
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JD from Legendary called today to update me. He said they are still working on my rifle to figure out the cause of the bad accuracy.
I will update you all when I am updated.
Brian With all the trouble this rifle has generated it seems like they would have had their best machinist fit and chamber a Krieger, Bartlein, Broughton, or whatever barrel, had their best bedding man put it in a new stock, and sent it back with some smoking test targets and a heartfelt letter of apology by now. I know he's a bit of a showman, but look at what Kenny Jarrett does with rifles like that. He has them mounted on his wall, in pieces, cut up by a chop saw. And, no matter who you are and how good you are, you don't always hit a home run. Legendary need to buy a chop saw and do some Jarrett type showboating, plaster that video all over the social media. Kenny is saying in all that, he has his standards and if a rifle doesn't measure up, doesn't suit him, no one gets it. It's cut up, the pieces hung on the shop wall. That does make quite a statement. Legendary need to take note. DF
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Campfire Tracker
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Didn't know that about Jarrett but he just went up a notch in my book.
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle. I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Didn't know that about Jarrett but he just went up a notch in my book. His stuff's not cheap, but crap never leaves the Jarrett shop... DF
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Joined: Mar 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I was one of the first people to put one of the early LAW Professionals in 300 Win mag on layaway. I have the belief that I better put together a new sheep rifle every year. So for this year, I figured the LAW.
I have read many of the different accounts of accuracy problems and issues with bedding. The accuracy issues seem to be bedding based with good accounting of everything else.
I have called the PA folks several different times. I eventually reached Bob who is the COO and shop administrator. He explained to me that there have been 16 rifles out of the 354 that had been sold up to that point returned. This is less than 3%. This is not perfect but LAW knew what was causing their problems.
One of the eight machines that worked on molding the stocks was having difficulties. They said that about 1 in 4 or 5 rifles with stocks built on his molding machine has this issue. They are trying to take care of this as quickly as they can.
One thing that JD noted is that when they are doing accuracy work that they shoot a string of 3 shots with little time for cool down. This means that the third shot sometimes walks a bit because the barrel even if fluted has a petite contour.
I am going to try it but I probably won't get the scope for it for about a month.
Sincerely,
Thomas
Last edited by kaboku68; 09/26/15.
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20-25% defect rate is dog schit.
Less than 3% returned means a lot of shooters with a crap gun. Maybe they are to dumb to figure it out?
Regardless, still doesn't excuse the OP getting jerked around.
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle. I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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Campfire Regular
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One thing that JD noted is that when they are doing accuracy work that they shoot a string of 3 shots with little time for cool down. This means that the third shot sometimes walks a bit because the barrel even if fluted has a petite contour.
That's BS. A properly bedded rifle w/ a stress relieved barrel won't do that. It's understandable when you buy a factory rifle for $500, but not for what this rifle costs. David
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So David, let me get this straight... A barrel with a more slender contour that heats up is not going to produce more deviation in its groups and wander than a the same exact rifle thicker barrel. I always thought it was the other way around that the heavier a contour of a barrel and the more time allowed between shots would make the deviation less and the groups better.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
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Think I know what David means....SOME light, stress relieved barrels don't walk;some do.
I know Dober had a bitch of a time with a light contour custom which is very popular and has an excellent reputation for accuracy. They are stress relieved far as I know.I won't say the name of the maker....no point in it.
I've had very good luck with light contours in 270/7mm made by Kreiger and Douglas. Both are stress relieved pretty extensively at various points of manufacture.
I expected great results from the Kreigers;have to admit the Douglas tubes I've had caught me off guard...better than expected.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
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I hear you Bob, I had a 92 Chevy S10 that was a great truck. Sometimes in the really hot weather when pulling a load it would vapor lock, but that by in large I've had great luck with it.
PS: I like eggs.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I was one of the first people to put one of the early LAW Professionals in 300 Win mag on layaway. I have the belief that I better put together a new sheep rifle every year. So for this year, I figured the LAW.
I have read many of the different accounts of accuracy problems and issues with bedding. The accuracy issues seem to be bedding based with good accounting of everything else.
I have called the PA folks several different times. I eventually reached Bob who is the COO and shop administrator. He explained to me that there have been 16 rifles out of the 354 that had been sold up to that point returned. This is less than 3%. This is not perfect but LAW knew what was causing their problems.
One of the eight machines that worked on molding the stocks was having difficulties. They said that about 1 in 4 or 5 rifles with stocks built on his molding machine has this issue. They are trying to take care of this as quickly as they can.
One thing that JD noted is that when they are doing accuracy work that they shoot a string of 3 shots with little time for cool down. This means that the third shot sometimes walks a bit because the barrel even if fluted has a petite contour.
I am going to try it but I probably won't get the scope for it for about a month.
Sincerely,
Thomas So, they know what the problem is but keep producing it and instead of replacing the faulty rifles they try to "fix them"? "Legendary"...
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Oct 2011
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So David, let me get this straight... A barrel with a more slender contour that heats up is not going to produce more deviation in its groups and wander than a the same exact rifle thicker barrel. I always thought it was the other way around that the heavier a contour of a barrel and the more time allowed between shots would make the deviation less and the groups better.
I didn't say a slender barrel won't produce more deviation in its groups. It shouldn't start throwing shots just because its hot. David
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From what I have seen, a light contoured barrel can walk shots after the barrel really heats up. This is why we shoot a 3 shot group not a 5. With a much larger countour barrel like a sendero, a guy can shoot a 5 shot group before you see any walking. From what I have seen. A rifle put together with less stress shoots inconsistently and a barrel installed to a action and then fitted to a stock with stress or not all put together with out stress will shoot very bad or inconsistent. This rifle shot really bad. Shot 3 shots and point of impact would be at 11:00 of point of aim. Let the barrel totally cool and shoot another 3 shot group with the exact same ammo. The group would hit at 3:00. So a six shot group at 100 yards would be an average of 6" and each 3 shot group averaged 2.25" With this perticulary rifle. I would expect there are a few issues not just one.
Brian
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Kobuko68
I was told as well, that only so many rifles had been sold. So Bob state 300, JD just 2 days earlier stated 600 and Mark 3 days after Bob said 1000. When I talked with Mark a few weeks ago. He said he has been at the range a lot. He said that he has been confirming accuracy with a little over 100 repairs over the last month. It maybe just me, but I am hearing conflicting numbers from different people. One would think Hmmm?
JD said that all of the 300 Whichesters and 280AI of the 400 rifles, they think have the stock problems. I do know that all the rifles in these chamfering locally have had to go back after bought. I have been pm'd by 7 different guys that have had to send their rifles back due to really bad accuracy. 5 of those six had to send their rifles back after receiving back from Legendary arms just like me.
Talked with Bob last Wed.. He said they are continuing to shoot my 280AI trying to figure out how to get the rifle to shoot as their gurantee of 1" or less at 100 yards with factory ammo.
Continuing to just wait on a rifle.
Brian
Last edited by brianc74; 09/27/15.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Didn't know that about Jarrett but he just went up a notch in my book. His stuff's not cheap, but crap never leaves the Jarrett shop... DF Just went out to his site 7400 bucks on average.. 4 times the price  I know exactly 2 people that own them and they are tickled with them
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Joined: Oct 2011
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Campfire Regular
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From what I have seen, a light contoured barrel can walk shots after the barrel really heats up. This is why we shoot a 3 shot group not a 5. With a much larger countour barrel like a sendero, a guy can shoot a 5 shot group before you see any walking.
Brian Brian I've seen the same thing, owned rifles that behaved like that. I had a Rem Model 7 that would keep 5 shots in an inch if you were careful not to over heat it. Get it hot and the groups opened up to 3". I didn't think that was so bad for what I paid for the rifle. The Kimber Montana I replaced it with wouldn't shoot as accurately 5-shots were generally 1.5", but it didn't make any difference how hot you got it. From stone cold to too hot to touch the shots didn't walk. Had it rebarreled w/ a Hart barrel and now it will put 5 shots inside an inch (most groups are less) as fast as you can pull the trigger. This is a considerably lighter contour than a #3. David
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How hot do you think this barrel was by the time Larry was done shooting? http://youtu.be/TRRahHX9ZkgSee any light barrel heat induced POI walking? David
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I think in this case. The issue has nothing to do with a skinny barrel. I think it has many issues. I think the action to stock fit, and possibly barrel, and barrel to action fit. But I won't know till I get it back again.
Brian
Last edited by brianc74; 09/27/15.
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