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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
A guy over at OpticsTalk just bought a Professional in 6.5 Creedmoor and reported around 1' groups with factory Hornady 120 SST's and around 1/2" groups with factory AMAX's. Only issue was a very heavy trigger pull.
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,926
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
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I think in this case. The issue has nothing to do with a skinny barrel. I think it has many issues. I think the action to stock fit, and possibly barrel, and barrel to action fit. But I won't know till I get it back again.
Brian I agree, just following up with my discussion w/ kaboku68 and the comments he got from LAWS. I sincerely hope you get your rifle back soon and that it exceeds your expectations when you do. David
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
Didn't know that about Jarrett but he just went up a notch in my book. His stuff's not cheap, but crap never leaves the Jarrett shop... DF Just went out to his site 7400 bucks on average.. 4 times the price  I know exactly 2 people that own them and they are tickled with them They are overpriced, IMO. But, Kenny is obsessed with putting out a top product. His crew works up loads, spends a lot of time breaking in and developing loads for each gun. If a gun makes it past the chop saw and out the door, it shoots. I guess you can do that for 4X's the price. I'm thinking it could be done for less than that. Just me, just saying. And, as mentioned earlier, these aren't $500 factory guns, churned out in great numbers. Customers paying more than factory deserve more than factory. DF
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,774
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2006
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,926
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
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If a rifle strings shots because the barrel gets hot it means there's something wrong. The truth is a 3-shot MOA guarantee is really a 5-shot 1.5MOA guarantee - I note he didn't say that you can expect 5-shots in an inch if you wait 20 minutes between rounds. Firing hand loads voids the warranty. I stopped watching there, I've seen enough. Thanks for the link. David
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,235
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,235 |
Firing hand loads voids the warranty. I stopped watching there, I've seen enough.
David
That's the craziest thing I've heard. I was once interested in these, but not so much anymore. I hope the OP gets his rifle sorted out too. Seems the LAW guys are taking their merry time with it though.....I know I would not operate that way, especially when bringing a new product to the market.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 |
I was one of the first people to put one of the early LAW Professionals in 300 Win mag on layaway. I have the belief that I better put together a new sheep rifle every year. So for this year, I figured the LAW.
I have read many of the different accounts of accuracy problems and issues with bedding. The accuracy issues seem to be bedding based with good accounting of everything else.
I have called the PA folks several different times. I eventually reached Bob who is the COO and shop administrator. He explained to me that there have been 16 rifles out of the 354 that had been sold up to that point returned. This is less than 3%. This is not perfect but LAW knew what was causing their problems.
One of the eight machines that worked on molding the stocks was having difficulties. They said that about 1 in 4 or 5 rifles with stocks built on his molding machine has this issue. They are trying to take care of this as quickly as they can.
One thing that JD noted is that when they are doing accuracy work that they shoot a string of 3 shots with little time for cool down. This means that the third shot sometimes walks a bit because the barrel even if fluted has a petite contour.
I am going to try it but I probably won't get the scope for it for about a month.
Sincerely,
Thomas If you were trying to do LAW a favor, you didn't. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 38,914
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 38,914 |
When LAW was on here completely ignoring the advice of shooters here who've actually shot out barrels in multiples about what they want in a rifle, I knew they weren't really destined to be the next amazing thing.
A quick perusal of this thread has me asking this.
If they knew - specifically that they had problems with stocks on 2 specific cartridges (which doesn't make sense as would a stock be cartridge specific and not action length) why wouldn't the "repair" to simply be - replace the stock and go about your day? Surely what they've spent in bad press and multiple returns on rifles has exceeded their production/product costs on a new stock.
Unless of course - the excuse is complete BS. Which I'm more inclined to believe...
Me
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
.......This rifle shot really bad. Shot 3 shots and point of impact would be at 11:00 of point of aim. Let the barrel totally cool and shoot another 3 shot group with the exact same ammo. The group would hit at 3:00. So a six shot group at 100 yards would be an average of 6" and each 3 shot group averaged 2.25" With this perticulary rifle. I would expect there are a few issues not just one.
Brian That IS pretty bad....more than a light barrel contour. Something else is going on.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
I saw that. My light rifles don't start moving at the third shot like that. My Kimber .308 with 23" Broughton will stack three under a half inch almost every time, occasionally 3/8". But, I bedded that one...  DF
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
Firing hand loads voids the warranty. I stopped watching there, I've seen enough.
David
That's the craziest thing I've heard. Pretty arrogant attitude when they can't seem to keep their third shot in the group. They know everything, handloader know nothing... Thanks, but no thanks...  BTW, that .308 barrel can't be blazing hot after three rounds. I know mine gets warm, not smoking hot after three. Now, my 26 Nos with a #2 contour gets pretty hot after three...  But, this is a .308! DF
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,686
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,686 |
I am pizzed that my POS $1000, 6# 270 Win Montana only averaged 3 in a shade over an inch at 100 on its first outing with the 140 gr TSX. Dearly hoping I can manage to hit an elk with it in a few weeks.
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,917
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,917 |
Unless you shoot 10 shot groups and measure them with a caliper down to the nearest .0001 you're doomed on hitting an elk
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
Yep, minute of an elk is pretty big...  Loonies like tight shooting rifles. And, they'll still kill an elk. Plus shoot very small groups... DF
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,638 |
Yeah this ain't no "stock" problem me thinks. If they knew where the problem was coming from, they'd fix it and give the OP his rifle back.
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle. I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 15
New Member
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New Member
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 15 |
I purchased the Professional in 280AI a couple of months ago as well... the rifle is currently on its second vacation to PA. They didn't fix the problem the first go round. Thing still shot like crap. Had some 3 round groups where I could stack the first 2 and the 3rd would land 3" off the mark. Other groups where rounds would land in no particular pattern into an awful 4-5" group. Not sure what's going on with my rifle, but let's just say I'm not confident the problem is going to be addressed this trip either. This will be it's last trip to PA. If it does not shoot I will take it to one of the many competent smith's in this area to have it bedded properly and, if necessary, rebarreled. Seriously regretting this purchase. How's that saying go? If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
A $300 Ruger American will shoot better groups than that.
DF
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 15
New Member
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New Member
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 15 |
Agreed. I had one in 6.5 creedmoor that was quite a shooter. Bought the wife a tikka t3 to fill the void left by the legendary arms works rifle. That tikka is a nice shooting rifle. Less than half the cost of the LAW and no comparison in the accuracy department. That tikka does live up to its sub moa guarantee.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,637
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,637 |
I would like to thank the folks here that have apparently taken one for the team. I was all-in on one of these but thought I'd hold out to hear some initial reports.
Sorry you gents have had to deal with the frustration.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/X0n16mr.png) WWP53D
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,066 |
I would like to thank the folks here that have apparently taken one for the team. I was all-in on one of these but thought I'd hold out to hear some initial reports.
Sorry you gents have had to deal with the frustration. Yep, that's a big disappointment. Those guys need to stay on Legendary until they get satisfaction or their money back. Information/knowledge is power and thanks to the Fire, we get a lot, some of it actually useful... DF
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