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Like most folks I started with corelockts after one penciled through a doe at 60 yards I switched to the brand new ballistic tips and started reloading. So far I've used NBT's, accubond, partitions, and Barnes TTSX on elk. The ballistic tip that turned into shrapnel on a big bull convinced me to go with the Barnes. My sample size is not scientific evidence but I'm convinced that on an animal that can go over 800 lbs. like a Rocky Mtn elk, that tougher bullets that can break bone and penetrate a long way are worth a premium of a few extra dollars.

I'd be content with most bullets for deer sized game and really prefer the BT for that DRT factor but elk are a different ballgame. We tend to hunt within a couple of hundred yards of a public / private boundary so stopping them quickly is important to me and the TTSX has done that in my experience better than any other bullet.

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I guess we can guess who wrote this one:

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Just as there are endless debates about rifle models and calibers, so are there many discussions about bullets. In a lifetime of hunting, I've basically used four types of bullets for bears: Nosler's Partition, Winchester's Silvertip, Remington's Core-Lokt and Federal's Trophy Bonded Bear Claw. None has failed me when I placed it where it had to go. Of the four, the Core-Lokt has accounted for more than half the bears I've shot


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I'm always interested to hear first-hand accounts. Which ballistic tip was it that turned to shrapnel? Did you recover the bull, and how did he react to the shot?



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Originally Posted by logcutter
I guess we can guess who wrote this one:

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Just as there are endless debates about rifle models and calibers, so are there many discussions about bullets. In a lifetime of hunting, I've basically used four types of bullets for bears: Nosler's Partition, Winchester's Silvertip, Remington's Core-Lokt and Federal's Trophy Bonded Bear Claw. None has failed me when I placed it where it had to go. Of the four, the Core-Lokt has accounted for more than half the bears I've shot


laugh


I don't doubt this, and I don't doubt that toad and others have seen examples of bullets not doing what they're supposed to do. Human nature being what it is, when you see it with your own eyes, it leaves an impression. I had a friend show me a recovered TTSX from a big bull shot at 60 yards. It killed the bull because he drilled it through the heart, but the bullet looked like it was new, minus the tip.

That was enough to give me pause, but it doesn't mean the TTSX isn't a good bullet for elk.



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I don't doubt this, and I don't doubt that toad and others have seen examples of bullets not doing what they're supposed to do. Human nature being what it is, when you see it with your own eyes, it leaves an impression. I had a friend show me a recovered TTSX from a big bull shot at 60 yards. It killed the bull because he drilled it through the heart, but the bullet looked like it was new, minus the tip.

That was enough to give me pause, but it doesn't mean the TTSX isn't a good bullet for elk.


I don't disagree with any of that and am not saying premium bullets are bad or any better or worse than some of the old standards not pushed above there intended velocity,basically factory velocities.

Core-Lokts can come apart and sometimes it a good thing if the bullet went where you wanted it to go.Noslers can also come apart or loose there front core,again a good thing if you put it where you wanted,Solid copper bullets can fail to expand and again,take the Berger bullet, OMG, but some very experienced elk hunters swear by them as some of the old timers swore by the Sierra bullet in the same manner...

All bullets,premium or standard can fail,whatever the definition of a bullet failing on game is.I have a cute little picture of a .375 260 grain Nosler Accubond and a .375 270 grain Core-Lokt both shot at factory type velocities and both dug out of the same target..The Core-Lokt,believe it or not was picture pufect,one you would want to show anyone while the Nosler,not so much!

And the search for the perfect bullet continues for some.

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A few years back I tried the 140 grain nosler/winchester silver tips and 162 grain Amax with some reloads out of my 7RM on Pennsylvania whitetail deer. I harvested 3 deer that year, two with the ballistic tips and one with the Amax.

All three were DRT

The two does I shot with the Silver tips were blown to pieces and I caught alot of hell from my wife and father-in-law when we were butchering them on all the meat ruined

I got a buck with the Amax and i don't remember how that one looked I ended up butchering that one myself at our family camp at the time.

I've been using the gmx bullets ever since they came out in the 7mm-08 and Swede and all my kills have been DRT with them thus far as well.

My choices came down to not wanting the wife or little ones consuming all the lead fragments in the meat I was getting from the explosive like bullets and harvesting three deer a year.

I might have to try them again I guess for my own results out of the 08 and swede to see how bad they're there. I will never use them out of the 7 mag again though. The one doe I shot that year was on the run through a thicket and I hit it a little high and center. Looked like I hit it with a hand grenade is my father in laws exact words were. Literally blew intestines out the side in between softball size and basketball size hole.


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Originally Posted by MolonLabe41
A few years back I tried the 140 grain nosler/winchester silver tips and 162 grain Amax with some reloads out of my 7RM on Pennsylvania whitetail deer. I harvested 3 deer that year, two with the ballistic tips and one with the Amax.

All three were DRT

The two does I shot with the Silver tips were blown to pieces and I caught alot of hell from my wife and father-in-law when we were butchering them on all the meat ruined

I got a buck with the Amax and i don't remember how that one looked I ended up butchering that one myself at our family camp at the time.

I've been using the gmx bullets ever since they came out in the 7mm-08 and Swede and all my kills have been DRT with them thus far as well.

My choices came down to not wanting the wife or little ones consuming all the lead fragments in the meat I was getting from the explosive like bullets and harvesting three deer a year.

I might have to try them again I guess for my own results out of the 08 and swede to see how bad they're there. I will never use them out of the 7 mag again though. The one doe I shot that year was on the run through a thicket and I hit it a little high and center. Looked like I hit it with a hand grenade is my father in laws exact words were. Literally blew intestines out the side in between softball size and basketball size hole.


No wonder you had to butcher the last one yourself. Your father in law probably said "screw you as he shook his head and walked away", "Next time buy a real bullet, like a damn Partition!!!!!!"... Is that kind of how it played out? whistle


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.

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The ballistic tip that turned into shrapnel was a 150 grain 7mm RM with an MV of about 3000 fps on a 250 yard quartering away shot. It contacted 2 ribs and made a palm sized entry wound then the fragments pierced portions of the near side lung. The bright spray in the snow every 20yards apart at most was great the first 200 yards as he head toward the trail down the mountain. The next 300 yards after he crossed the trail had me doubting my marksmanship and wondering if this really was lung blood. When the trail quit a little shy of 600 Yards from bullet impact he was done and drained.

The entry was exactly where i had aimed trying to hit the off side shoulder. These weren't new bullets but shouldn't have been too old a lot either. Since my switch to ttsx i haven't found any bullets but I have found dead elk.

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Thanks.



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Was at the range yesterday with Daughter #1, who will be going on her first elk hunt, and settled on rifles and loads.

Daughter #1 will be using a .308 Win with a 130g TTSX starting out at 3010fps.

I had planned to use my .280 Rem with a 140g TTSX but after taking an antelope at 373 yards with it last week, that rifle will now be my backup, with a 2901fps 140g AccuBond load.

Primary rifle will be a stainless/boat paddle Ruger MKII .30-06 with a 150g AccuBond at 2991fps.


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Originally Posted by logcutter
I guess we can guess who wrote this one:


Still waiting for the blue tarp instructions. If I don't get an elk this fall I'm going to need something to photograph and tell people contains an elk quarter even though nobody can see it.

In the meantime, please tells us more about your vast experience with core loss ammunition and how great it is for dropping all of those imaginary elk you have killed inside of your head.


Originally Posted by shrapnel
I probably hit more elk with a pickup than you have with a rifle.


Originally Posted by JohnBurns
I have yet to see anyone claim Leupold has never had to fix an optic. I know I have sent a few back. 2 MK 6s, a VX-6, and 3 VX-111s.
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As soon as I post this imaginary comparison of the mighty Core-Lokt on the right and the two imaginary Nosler Accubonds why don't you show us ummm anything outdoor/hunting/shooting related instead of all talk and BS with nothing at all to show other than what a child you are for douching up threads with your off topic inferior complex.

[Linked Image]

Bellyjelly..Got anything at all to add to the topic of this thread?

Didn't think so!!!


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As long as people are posting pictures of recovered bullets, here are a few of mine, recovered from animals, dirt, steel and water jugs.

A side note, over the years I've frequently been ridiculed for choosing premium bullets over standard cup-and-core construction because of their added expense. Often the people doing the ridiculing are sucking down crappy coffee while smoking a cancer stick. One was virtually addicted to soft and energy drinks and more than one has been borderline (or more) alcoholic. While I have an occasional glass of wine or a beer, I don't drink coffee, soft or energy drinks and I don't smoke. Nor do I chase other women or spend time in bars. My preference for premium bullets costs me far less than those addictions and habits. If you are one who is thinking about criticizing me for my choices and do any of these things, your criticism falls on deaf ears.

For that matter, if you shoot factory ammo my handloads with premium bullets often cost no more and often less than whatever ammo is on sale at your local Wally World. Be happy with what you shoot but once again any criticism of my choices will fall on deaf ears.


Every North Fork bullet I've recovered has looked like these, with the exception of the one I recovered from 200-yard steel (see below). Left to right:
30-06, 165 grain @ 2800fps, recovered from dirt
(500 yards, 145.0 grains retained weight)

.30-06, 165 grain @ 2800fps, recovered from second cow elk after breaking front leg and near and far ribs
(~25 yards, 133.2 grains retained weight)

7mm 140 grain @ 3200fps, recovered from buck mule deer after penetrating from right ham to sternum
(~150 yards, 131.2 grains retained weight)

[Linked Image]

Left to right again:
Hornady 162g InterLock (elk),less than 49% weight retention, hit just one rib of spike bull, broadside, about 110 yards
Speer 160g Grand Slam (elk), same presentation and range as InterLock above, destroyed both shoulders of 5x5 bull elk, over 70% weight retention
North Fork 165g (elk), Broke front leg and near and far rib
North Fork 350g (elk), obliterated sections of the near leg and rib, shattered a far rib
North Fork 180g (200 yard steel) Note that every other bullet I tried against that steel disintegrated. The Barnes X bullets made beautiful copper plated craters. The North Forks consistently made a crater and were caught inside it. This was the only one I could remove.

[Linked Image]


This photo speaks for itself. Note that due to an uncorrected copy/paste error made when creating the photo, the Sierra bullet is listed as an XTP. Obviously it is not. It is a GameKing. Hornady SST anyone?
[Linked Image]



From left to right:
4 jugs == Sierra 200g FP .375" @ 2390fps, 81% weight retention (left group of five, front row center) (Marlin 375, .375 Win)
6 jugs == Speer 300g Uni-Cor .458" @ 2247fps, 59.6% to 72.5% weight retention, 68.8% average (remainder of left group) (Marlin 1895, .45-70)
8 jugs == Speer 350g FP .458" @ 2147fps, 87.6% weight retention (Marlin 1895, .45-70)
6 jugs == North Fork 350g .458" @ 2189fps, 97.4% weight retention (Marlin 1895, .45-70)
9 jugs == Cast Performance 460g WFNGC .458" @ 1812fps, 76.5% weight retention (Marlin 1895, .45-70)
5 jugs == Hornady 220g FP .375" @2230fps, 65.7% weight retention (Marlin 375, .375 Win)
7 jugs == Barnes 180g MRX .308" @ 3100fps, 93.4% weight retention (Ruger MKII, .300 Win Mag)

[Linked Image]





Last edited by Coyote_Hunter; 10/12/15. Reason: Add missing photo

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How could the OP ask such an unreasonable question and narrow the choices to only two bullets given all the helpful advice he can expect from this august group of experts on anything hunting related and just about everything else. Any guesses how many times this question has been asked and the myriad ways it has been answered?

Just to stay on topic, I think she should shoot a 338 with 225 grain Hornadies.


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Be happy with what you shoot but once again any criticism of my choices will fall on deaf ears.


laugh..Your computer talks?

I'm glad you brought up the North Fork.I also have a bunch of them and they are tough.Trying to give Mike a hard time I shot everything I could think of trying to destroy the bullet..I couldn't do it and one in particular became a avatar.Photobucket is hard to get into anymore so I can't get at that one yet to post it.

Naw,sometimes we get carried away on the net with bullet talk and bashing.I have a ton of premium bullets around ready to reload.I just haven't reloaded in quite some time for my own personal reasons.

So with the new to me '06 with probably 200 180 grain Noslers on hand,I picked up a box of loaded 180 Core-Lokts..Brought back old memories from way back..Hey,they work and there cheap.Same with the .375 H&H..Picked up some Core-Lokts although I have a ton of Nosler Accubonds to be loaded..

If I was into hunting like I used to be,no doubt I would load up the premiums I have,but I'm not anymore.I just throw in a rifle when I go wood getting and if I see something,Bam..And the Core-Lokts do there job as would the Noslers or North Forks if I would get off my azz and start back reloading..Lost the lust for it after I lost my hunting buddy but it's a com'n back.

Always liked your recovered bullets and the penetration test you did and the occasional debates we had back when,CH.

Try a "Game Ear" for your deaf ears and trade that 7MM for some Core-Lokts plus a few bucks ofcourse! laugh

Jayco's box out.






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Nothing wrong with either of the OP's choices...either would be just fine on elk.

I'm a small bore aficionado but recently picked up 150 of the old style (amber colored plastic box) 200 grain .308 Grand Slams. They'll straight up knock an elk's dick in the dirt based on past experiences...

I'll be turning my .300 Win Mag into a .300 H&H soon as an elk slayer so I am saving them for that project. It's almost enough excitement for me to safe queen my 6mms and 6.5mms and go back to .30 cals...




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T Inman, that project should be a good one.. I could do without my .300 Win.'s, but have a #1 in .300 H & H that is going to be my main rifle in a few years.. Figure, when I turn 70, it is time for a lighter rifle weight wise.. Looking forward to the .300 H & H project..


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I meant to say couldn't do without my .300 Win.s.!! typo!!


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Originally Posted by Sheister
How could the OP ask such an unreasonable question and narrow the choices to only two bullets given all the helpful advice he can expect from this august group of experts on anything hunting related and just about everything else. Any guesses how many times this question has been asked and the myriad ways it has been answered?

Just to stay on topic, I think she should shoot a 338 with 225 grain Hornadies.



Yes and I always tell them Nosler partition..... Generally 180 gr.... laugh oh and 30-06 too... laugh


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.

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Originally Posted by T_Inman
Nothing wrong with either of the OP's choices...either would be just fine on elk.

I'm a small bore aficionado but recently picked up 150 of the old style (amber colored plastic box) 200 grain .308 Grand Slams. They'll straight up knock an elk's dick in the dirt based on past experiences...

I'll be turning my .300 Win Mag into a .300 H&H soon as an elk slayer so I am saving them for that project. It's almost enough excitement for me to safe queen my 6mms and 6.5mms and go back to .30 cals...



Those Grand Slams should work great. I used them in my 7mm RM for 20+ years. Didn't recover one until the last year as they kept punching through. The one I recovered destroyed both shoulder joints of a 5x5 bull and still retained over 70% of its original weight. My hunting buddy still uses them in his 7mm RM, no complaints.

Good luck on your H&H conversion.


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No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
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