Home Forums Birds & Dogs Upland Game On which do you score best , clay birds or live birds?

Went quail shooting the other day with some friends and noted how much of my attention and concentration was spent on keeping track of the other hunters, the dog handler and the dogs themselves. Actually shot fairly well but realized I was a bit off my rythym of just picking up the bird and shooting as when you are on a station at the range. I think clays are a bit easier .

Clays re infinitely "easier" as I do not have a 90% or greater average on game. If I could always have good footing, know where the target was coming from, know there is a safe backstop, and have the target appear when I was ready, then I might shoot as well on game as I do on targets.


That said, I am a proponent of target shooting as it will improve your overall shooting ability. If one cannot shoot well on a variety of shot presentations on the range, they will not shoot well overall on the field.

About the same, a little better with clays, except for doves. With clays or upland with a dog, knowing when and where the target or bird's coming from makes a difference. Doves are a small target that show up at any time from anywhere, moving on and changing direction if they see gun movement. I've shot a lot of doves and missed more.

Live birds by far. Clays just don't seem to make me focus.

When was shooting more I found clays easier do to the fact they were consistent. However, when I shot clays a lot the birds were a lot easier too.

What Just said!!

Live birds by a mile, unless I just shoot the box of clays while they are still on the ground

Most people that shoot clay birds know enough to use a gun that fits them, many guys that only hunt shoot guns that are often to long and have way to much drop to come up smooth and give a proper line of sight.

There really is no substitute for burning lots of powder, besides its fun and clay birds make that possible.Besides I hate the look my dog gives me after I miss a big ole rooster cackling up out of the cattails.

Depends on the live birds I'm hunting. I'm averaging in the mid-90s on clays. When I was hunting pheasants (stocked by the State and pvt preserve birds) I kept track of my hit % and it was in the low 90%. On geese over decoys, my hit % was probably even higher than that. Decoying ducks would probably be in the upper 80 to low 90%. Pass shooting ducks I would guess would be somewhere in the 60-70% range. The few times I hunted grouse in my youth, it was a lot less, but then I haven't shot at a grouse in almost 40 years.

What clays, trap, skeet or sporting clays? Shoot any of them gun mounted and they will help field shooting only little. Shoot them gun down and they will. Anyone of normal ability can advance to the 80% plus percentage on all of them gun down. On a hard sporting course most will fall short.

There are only few individuals with many days afield and many multiple opportunities that will bring down 80% plus in the uplands. There are some who will, but they are few and far between.

I agree completely on the unmounted vs mounted gun deal. If you're going to shoot clays of any type hoping to become a better field shot and shooting with the gun pre-mounted, you're wasting your time and money.

When I was actively shooting sporting clays, I would score in the low 40's on my home course pretty regularly. If I travelled to one of the "professional" courses a couple hours away, I'd be lucky to hit 30/50. Sporting clays was supposedly invented to more accurately represent real bird hunting shots, but in my view is rarely oriented toward the real bird hunter these days.

I usually get up to speed for the bird season by shooting sporting clays 1-2 rounds per week from July on. But most of my training is with a partner and a portable trap, practicing the shots I have the most trouble with... fast low left-to-right crossers, falling-away birds, etc. Just do it over and over and over. The point is, for me, hitting clays is harder than hitting birds; so if I'm hitting clays really well, I'm usually hitting gamebirds pretty well too.

Skeet is a good sport for learning, whether as a beginner or a diagnostic tool for the experienced gunner who's got a "bug" he needs to work out. Trap is a waste of time and ammo, but it can be fun with the right folks.

I agree that in prep for hunting, it's best to practice on clays with a low gun. Back when I started there was no sporting clays. The thinking was if you wanted to practice for flushing/upland birds, best to shoot trap. Those wanting to practice ducks over decoys or passing shots, shot skeet. When sporting clays first came out, I shot at some nice courses that really tried to present realistic targets; shooting thru small openings in the canopy, most shots were in the 20-40 yd range. Over time it seemed that it was more about the game itself and less about the original intent. I never saw a bird shoot straight up like a rocket and then fall straight down like a rock, like springing teal. Crossing birds at 70 yds; I would let them pass or try to call them in closer, I sure as heck wouldn't shoot at them. But you will see these at most SC courses now. That's when I went back to skeet shooting as my primary clay game. It's also the game I started with 45 years ago as a 15 yr old. I haven't done any bird hunting in the 5 years since my dog passed, so clay shooting now is just for the pure fun of it.

When sporting clays came to America-Bob Brister and Hal Dupont pretty much deserve the credit-the course owners didn't know how to set good targets and everything was pretty much fluff. Our good shooters here thought they knew the game and could compete on the world stage. They couldn't because the targets were much harder in places like England where the top shooters pretty much came from. And when they came over here and beat us up on our home turf, things started to change. The shooters wanted to win.

Soooo, the "game" evolved. Some think the original intent was to always simulate game shooting. Brister knew different-he was a competitor-but we needed to be educated first. The targets became more technical along with becoming more difficult. No one says you have to shoot the hard stuff. There are courses and ways to get around it. I will say that if you learn to hit the hard targets, it will do more to improve your field shooting than always shooting targets you are comfortable with. Makes no difference if you will not shoot at a 70 yard target in the field. However being able to do so on clays will make a 30yarder in the field seem relatively easy.

Like any skill it is a progression of improving in steps.

And today America is competitive on the World stage in Sporting. Which was the original intent. It just took some time to get there.

Addition: I've also shot events where there wasn't a target over 40yards and mostly they were under. They ate my lunch. A good setter can beat you up close also.

I don't see where leading a clay by the length of a bus would have made me a better field shooter. On upland birds, they rarely got out to 70 yards before both my shots were fired. If they flushed out of range - I watched them fly away. Once I got a clue as to what I was doing, I stopped sky busting of waterfowl. If I couldn't get them to come within a reliably lethal range, I wouldn't shoot. That's why one puts out decoys and spends time learning to work a call. Frankly, I don't see where shooting clays at 70 yds would make one better at shooting them at normal ranges. It makes more sense to me to practice shooting at ranges a, humane, ethical hunter will limit themselves to, based on ballistics. A mallard, goose or pheasant are not as fragile as a clay target. I get the whole "we are doing this as a game" thing of SC, but that wasn't where I was coming from. I came to see the old games of trap and skeet as being better games as practice for most field shooting, or at least just as good. I also liked some 5 stand when I was at clubs that were set up for it. My club is old-school and full of old-timers and so its just trap & skeet. That training was always enough for me to bring home game, when I was hunting. All the games require one to keep, your head on the stock, develop a smooth swing with a good follow-thru and keep your focus on the target. It's the mastery of those shooting fundamentals along with good hunting skills and judgement that will put more game in the pot.

As you wish, but a major league ball player doesn't lean to hit a major league curve by limiting his batting practice to a Pony League pitcher.

Yes, clays are more fragile than game birds and that is why you can break them further away. Nor does anyone suggest you should shoot at game Birds out of range because you can break a clay at that distance. Decoys and calls have no place in clay target shooting, so I can't see the reason to bring them up. Other than obviously they are tools to bring game close. Not what I was writing about, which was becoming more proficient with a shotgun.

I can only tell you that shooting harder targets will make you a better game shot. Why? Someone mentioned focus earlier, and if you can focus on a hard clay it will become much easier to focus on an easy one or an easier game Bird that is closer. Your technique must be better on a difficult target than on an easy one. Much more exact and fluid, and it will carry over to the easier game Birds and your hits will improve. I can't make you believe it and if you are content with where you are at now, then great. You probably could be better.

And yes, most of the old-school/old-timers are content to stay in their comfort zone of trap and skeet. Variety of reasons, one being they don't like not being able to shoot their trap and skeet scores on a sporting course. They don't want to learn anything new. They don't want the challenge. Some of them accept it and few go back.

If your shooting satisfies you, then that is all that counts.

Addition: Stand back from a crossing skeet target and learn to consistently break it at 40yards. Will it seem easier on the peg at 20?

Another:

Who you going to bet on when a Deer is trotting by at 50 yards? The guy who can hit running Jackrabbits with a rifle or the guy who only shoots at paper?

Who you going to bet on when the wind is blowing and the game is out a way. The guy who only shoots his rifle for groups on calm days or the guy who knows how to adjust for the wind.

I have only shot sporting clays a couple times.. Didn't do all that well, but it was fun..

For maybe 8 years, I got into trap shooting.. Made a couple state shoots, and lots of minor ones.. But the reason I got started, I wanted to be a better field shot.. While trap is not the perfect game for that, it was the only game in my area.. So I started shooting.. It did improve my field shooting by a bunch.. I had confidence in by ability to hit a target.. I am sure clays, and skeet would be excellent in helping develop field shooting skills. But some shooting is better than none.. I know it made a difference for me..

We also played a lot of games at local turkey shooting.. They are more like sporting clays.. All fun.. To me every bit helps..

No doubt WCH.

As for hitting running game with a rifle. I've done some of that. Using the same basics of what I've learned with shotgun shooting, I once got a double on running deer that were being pushed during a drive. The last running deer I shot, my then young son was with me, it ran by at a dead run, I fired one shot and it did a somersault. My son just went, "Whoa!" Focus, swing, lead, follow-thru; will work on lots of moving game.

You're comparing shooting running deer, to shooting jackrabbits to shooting a stationary target. I wasn't taking about shooting anything that's stationary, so I don't think your example is valid. I think someone who can consistently hit a clay at 20-25-30 yds can hit a duck at those ranges just as consistently as someone who can hit a clay at 70 yds. I killed lots of game before ever firing a shot at a 70 yd target. I'm also not taking about what it takes to get to the top of the SC heap. I'm talking clay shooting vs game shooting. My opinion, based on my experiences, is that I don't think proficiency at hitting clay target at 70 yds will yield one any more birds than if that same shooter is proficient at shooting clays at normal game ranges. If a shotgunner masters the fundamentals, hits on game will improve dramatically. IMO one can learn those fundamentals shooting a variety of games.

Well said Battue!

As you wish, but a major league ball player doesn't lean to hit a major league curve by limiting his batting practice to a Pony League pitcher.

Yes, clays are more fragile than game birds and that is why you can break them further away. Nor does anyone suggest you should shoot at game Birds out of range because you can break a clay at that distance. Decoys and calls have no place in clay target shooting, so I can't see the reason to bring them up. Other than obviously they are tools to bring game close. Not what I was writing about, which was becoming more proficient with a shotgun.

I can only tell you that shooting harder targets will make you a better game shot. Why? Someone mentioned focus earlier, and if you can focus on a hard clay it will become much easier to focus on an easy one or an easier game Bird that is closer. Your technique must be better on a difficult target than on an easy one. Much more exact and fluid, and it will carry over to the easier game Birds and your hits will improve. I can't make you believe it and if you are content with where you are at now, then great. You probably could be better.

And yes, most of the old-school/old-timers are content to stay in their comfort zone of trap and skeet. Variety of reasons, one being they don't like not being able to shoot their trap and skeet scores on a sporting course. They don't want to learn anything new. They don't want the challenge. Some of them accept it and few go back.

If your shooting satisfies you, then that is all that counts.

Addition: Stand back from a crossing skeet target and learn to consistently break it at 40yards. Will it seem easier on the peg at 20?