Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting Bad idea

OK if you can hit them hard.
'Breaking the tripod' is a well established method for taking deer, but elk aren't deer.
A scapula provides a better opportunity for a deflected bullet than other placement. I've been on hunts with a couple of close calls involving shoulder deflections (.06 and 7mag).
I'm trying to think of a scenario where it is a better option than double lung shot but haven't thought of one yet.

I've killed a few bulls. I aim for tight behind the shoulder, 1/3 up from the bottom of the chest. I avoid the shoulder knuckle. They don't go far and I don't have the nightmare of bloodshot and bone fragments all through the shoulders and into the rib meat.
Two years ago I broke the left scapula right along the ridge with a 140 Partition from a 7mm-08. The bullet lodged under the hide on the opposite side. Very little mess and DRT.
This year's bull with the same combo I hit behind the shoulder, the bullet exited, still DRT. Hardly any mess at all.




P

The dorsal ridge of the scapula? I believe that would lie dorsal to the spine and the dorsal 1/3 of the chest almost directly above the junction of the scapula and humerus. Remember how tall the dorsal processes are of the vertebrae are in the thoracic region of the elk. This is how they have the ability to carry the shoulder in such a powerful sling.The scapula also has quite a spinous process where the two muscles are divided on outside (lateral ) the thoracic region.. It is quite a skeletal structure with a lot of thick bone ....even the ribs.

"The shoulder" is a large area consisting of the scapula and a series of bones that run down and forward and then down and back and then finally hook into the legs. Hitting the scapula is one thing but I don't think many people could hit that series of bones running from it down to the leg. Such a shot at range would be luck for most people. The other part of the shoulder is shoulder muscle only. This is what you are most likely to hit if you take the non-scapula shoulder shot. I have no idea how effective hitting that muscle is as compared to hitting the lungs behind the shoulder.

I usually try for double lung, or heart hits- but a high shoulder hit, on all kinds of game, is an instant stopper if placed properly.

I guess it depends on why someone is killing the animal. Personally I am doing it because I like elk meat.So I go for a double lung. I can't see wasting half an elk. If the elk is about to fall off in some God awful canyon or jump over a private fence,I guess that would be a reason.
I think guides and outfitters tell their clients to do it because they don't want long tracking jobs and time is money to to them .
But that is my 2 cents worth and probably worth a lot less

Saddlesore summed up my thoughts!

You shoot them were they allow you too

I prefer the shoulder crease....

But I would drive a good stout bullet through the shoulders without losing any sleep

Just for reference
I have hunted Africa just one time....the double shoulder break down is what they preach across the big pond

First of all, the SHOULDER is not a series of bones. Elk do not have a clavicle. A series of bones is called a front leg. Second, and I am sorry saddlesore, one half of the mass of a elk to pack out.....butcher .....or eat is not in the front quarter. Third, on a 90 degree angle straight broadside shot, explain to me how shooting through the scapula in the lower half of the animal would not involve a DOUBLE LUNG. Fourth, how could a DRT episode in a harvest NOT involve Central Nervous System breakdown. Fifth, If one envisions a pie plate I.e. 9 inches as the point of impact of the projectile ......if one puts the center distal to the shoulder.....a portion of the plate if not a SUBSTANTIAL part would be covering the liver, small intestine, or the rumen. In essence the Scapula covers most of the lung field in the Cervidae. How would you feel if invited to a game feed.....I am sorry I shot it in the shoulder so there ain't as much as I hoped.....Or I got this one in the guts! Let's eat! I ask everyone to study the Anatomy of what they choose to harvest and make their own decisions. It is personally my conclusion that a DRT incident does not occur without CNS involvement and a DOUBLE LUNG distal to the shoulder will increase a risk of a puncture and carcass contamination of the abdomen. Further more a front quarter is no where near HALF AN ELK.

Angus1895,
I have personally seen at least 4 elk shot by myself that were DRT with the double lung shot. The only bones hit were the ribs. I've seen it a lot on deer also.

Also, saddlesore is not talking about a shoulder being half an elk. I believe he is talking about a direct broad side shoulder shot, where the bullet takes out both shoulders as well as damage to the surrounding meat. This shot will lose a significant amount of meat, maybe not an equal half of the elk, but it can amount to a lot.

I also wonder with your 9 inch plate being centered on the shoulder, how tiny of an elk are you shooting that the plate would cover part of the liver, small intesting, or rumen?

I am saying the pie plate center AVOIDS the shoulder(. To save half the elk. )If you truly believe DRT incidence does not require a CNS involvement I cannot comment other than WOW!

And they like it when there's less meat to pack out.

When you don't need to. Less messy, and double lung shots rarely result in the elk running more then 30-40 yds or so--and I've seen lots of double lungers fold up on the spot.

Sure, if the chosen elk is standing on the edge of a thousand foot cliff, shoot him in the shoulders. If all that's available is a shoulder, then take it (provided the hunter is using enough bullet).

Then again, the last 25+ elk my 84 year old dad has killed have all been neck shots--he swears by it. I don't even try to argue with him.......

When he tries to tell my son where to shoot an elk, I just cover my son's ears.......

Casey

I've never figured out why so many guys can't track game.

Once you learn how to track, DRT isn't so important.

Well being red green deficient, really hurts my ability to track game....

As are about an estimated 1-12 males, so that might be part of the problem...

I can see colors just fine, as long as they are separate, but the moment you put blood on the grass.. yup game over

Ok I can understand that. I've tracked a few that a colorblind person may have not found.

On the other hand, a friend of mine is also r/g colorblind and he has never mentioned it being a problem. In fact he also archery hunts and has recovered game after a few long tracking jobs. Ill have to ask him about it next time we talk.

I've seen plenty of DRT elk double lunged, though usually with a frangible bullet I wouldn't attempt to break a shoulder with.

I don't know any of them fancy anatomical terms that Anus is using, but do know a DRT doesn't always require a CNS hit, or at least what we all think of as a CNS hit like the brain, neck or high shoulder.

I read some study somewhere that when a bullet strikes the chest at the top of the heart beat, it causes blood vessels all over to explode and the animal instantly drops...Maybe that's why some double lung hits result in DRT and the other 3/4 or more go 30-50 or so yards before crashing...I dunno.

As far as the OPs question, I try to avoid so much damage to the shoulders, but that's about the only reason I tend to avoid them. That gritty, nasty bone marrow and bloodshotness (if not using a TSX or the like) straight up sucks ass to clean up.

Being in the medical field, I do know there are different grades of it. I know that myself, nor my brother can see blood.

No chit.......

DRT does not always require a CNS hit is a fact.

The problem lies in the fact that you can't always get a DRT without a CNS hit.

You can sometimes. Heck I"ve seen em gut shot fall over and never leave that spot...

This fall I shot a buck, trying for the crease, and hit a bit higher than I wanted. It was a longer shot for my rifle.

I wathced the hit, realized what happend,hit high shoulder, over the spine. Put him on the ground bleeding. As I chambered the next round he flopped behind a bush... never got another shot. Until I all of a sudden see him way out of range, walking off licking himself...

Yep, lots of blood. Well most wouold say lots of blood, but enough to trail him to where he finally came out walking...

Yep, the trauma was there to the spine. but not nearly enough to do a dman thing.

He hung around the next 2 weeks just fine, and I didn't want to reshoot in case he had a mild fever..... was doing just fine a monht later when I checked the cameras the last time. He is a trash buck and I'll shoot him opener this fall again...

Thats a reason I"M not overly fond of a shot thats not giving the most leeway in ALL directions for minor misses... for most folks...high shoulder does not give leeway up or forward mostly.