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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805 |
Mackey, if going into a fight would you rather have a Glock, M4 or a shotgun? I would prefer to have friends. Friends that brought their M4s/rifles. And an exit strategy. 
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Mackey, if going into a fight would you rather have a Glock, M4 or a shotgun? I would prefer to have friends. Friends that brought their M4s/rifles. And an exit strategy. Yep, but you forgot explosives and CAS. 
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805 |
While you may think carrying w/o a holster is not any more precarious than with one, even when fighting, this leads me to believe that perhaps you have not actually been in a physical fight while trying to retain a loose gun. It has very little in common to changing the oil on a car.
If the price of admission to this discussion is having fought someone while carrying a gun, I'll have to beg off. I understand what you are saying and appreciate the advice as it's always good to reconsider the way you do things. I think I usually try to calculate my percentages conservatively. But based on my own experience, and being the only one here who knows how tight my belt is, I haven't heard anything in this thread that's going to make me abandon my clipdraw anytime soon. No price to this conversation my friend. We are just debating/discussing merits and points of view. I seriously doubt you are going to change your way of doing things because some total stranger has a different perspective.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805 |
Just for clarification, if I am dinking around at my cabin, (which is fairly remote, and I am going to hear or see most folks coming across the flats for a while before they get there)or house, I have no issue with slipping whatever in the waistband.
I just prefer to have a handgun in a proper holster if I am going to be driving/going to town/interacting with the general public.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
What pocket holster do you use for the .38 snub? Digging on the "sticky" holsters at the moment for that. Milt Sparks for IWB.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 8,520
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 8,520 |
I seriously doubt you are going to change your way of doing things because some total stranger has a different perspective. I will actually probably turn it over in my head for a while and think about trying an IWB again at some point down the line. I'm in no hurry to change but I'm not resistant to it either. I do use an OWB for my other main carry gun so I'm not opposed to leather.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,805 |
What pocket holster do you use for the .38 snub? Digging on the "sticky" holsters at the moment for that. Milt Sparks for IWB. I am running one of the new Milt Sparks Manta pocket holsters. Once I get a full year of pocket carry with it, I will give it a straight up review. There are some really good synthetic/sticky pocket holsters on the market these days. Quite honestly I don't think I "need" Milt Sparks quality in a pocket rig, but i definitely like it. The craftsmanship is typical Sparks. I am betting a daughter or future son in law will inherit this one.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Good enough, and appreciate that.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,669
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,669 |
Any of you mex carry guys ever have the gun work its way upward when sitting down? Years ago I experienced that. Getting in and out of my truck, sitting down at a restaurant I've felt the gun come loose. Never had it fall out but I did have to reposition the gun and that draws attention.
If you ever had the need to pull the gun and then immediately needed your hands, it's pretty tough to quickly shove it back in the jeans - safely.
As Mackay mentioned, going hands on with an attacker is more than likely going to unseat your shooter from your waistband. Years ago while in uniform I had a serious scrap with a tough sumbitch that saw us tearing hell out of the interior of a crowded and unfriendly to me biker bar. We went to the ground and I gained an edge by climbing this big dudes back like a tree and applying a "vascular neck restraint." Frankly I was riding him down like a bucking horse as we rolled around back and forth and I suddenly realized my S&W M686 had fallen out of the thumb break holster and clattered onto the floor about a foot from this guys hands. I was in there by myself with him and about forty mostly drunk guys and gals who didn't have any love for LE. I had a M38 Airweight on my ankle but I would have to let go of my hold to get to it. I realized anyone in there could reach down there and grab my .357. It was a really bad feeling fellows. Loosing your shooter presents a whole bunch of new troubles.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Any of you mex carry guys ever have the gun work its way upward when sitting down? Years ago I experienced that. Getting in and out of my truck, sitting down at a restaurant I've felt the gun come loose. Never had it fall out but I did have to reposition the gun and that draws attention.
If you ever had the need to pull the gun and then immediately needed your hands, it's pretty tough to quickly shove it back in the jeans - safely.
As Mackay mentioned, going hands on with an attacker is more than likely going to unseat your shooter from your waistband. Years ago while in uniform I had a serious scrap with a tough sumbitch that saw us tearing hell out of the interior of a crowded and unfriendly to me biker bar. We went to the ground and I gained an edge by climbing this big dudes back like a tree and applying a "vascular neck restraint." Frankly I was riding him down like a bucking horse as we rolled around back and forth and I suddenly realized my S&W M686 had fallen out of the thumb break holster and clattered onto the floor about a foot from this guys hands. I was in there by myself with him and about forty mostly drunk guys and gals who didn't have any love for LE. I had a M38 Airweight on my ankle but I would have to let go of my hold to get to it. I realized anyone in there could reach down there and grab my .357. It was a really bad feeling fellows. Loosing your shooter presents a whole bunch of new troubles. That'd be a pucker factor of about +11...
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
And that is the point about all of this. I'd pick an M4 or a shotgun over a handgun any day of the week, but we make concessions. A handgun is a concession as is sticking a handgun in you swim trunk waist band whilst stopping at the 7-11 for a Big Gulp.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,601
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,601 |
Mackey, if going into a fight would you rather have a Glock, M4 or a shotgun? I would prefer to have friends. Friends that brought their M4s/rifles. And an exit strategy. Good point. Agreed. I'd not want to clear any building alone. Coordinated teams (friends) are essential. An exit plan is essential as well. But if alone and jumped by thugs or thug in the course of life, in a parking lot or alley, we will be using a handgun... edit: kinda the point Steelhead makes above. 
Last edited by 1Nut; 02/03/16.
Nut
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.
Thomas Jefferson
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
And if all gunfights end up on the ground, how does one fight and hold on to his rifle/shotgun?
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454 |
Enough good holsters on the market today that I see absolutely no reason not to use one.
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,245
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,245 |
Enough good holsters on the market today that I see absolutely no reason not to use one. Meh....time. Unless you carry continously, sometimes expediency calls for stuffing the gun in the wasteband. Those of us who can do so at times without it being unreasonably less than secure are admittedly more likely to do so. It's not something to strive for, but for some of us, it's not something to completely dismiss.
Lunatic fringe....we all know you're out there.
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454 |
Yeah, I'd hate to lose the five seconds it takes to put a holstered pistol in my waistband.
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,364
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,364 |
Occasionally, Colt SAA with loading gate open to retain position ........
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920 |
...anyone ever see a badguy with a holster. In the almost 30 years I did LE work I never once arrested someone with a handgun who also had any kind of holster on them. Always in a pocket, waistband or purse. I think once in a paper bag.
Reasons seem to be that a) holsters are bulky and tend to print. b) It is easy to ditch a handgun...not so if you have a holster you need ditch also. Get patted down and you have a empty holster the police will search till they find the gun that goes in it.
While visiting a friend with a big security officers school in Durban, SA, the law stated that one must carry a concealed handgun in a holster. "only bad people carried guns without holsters"....and they didn't even know any Mezkins...
Once in a while I still do carry without a holster but ever since Mr. Chamberlain posted about the REMORA IWB holsters and I bought a couple I don't really have an excuse any more...they slip right in and stay put with no straps or clips...
Bob
If you can not deal with reality, reality will deal with you....
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