Home Forums Birds & Dogs Shotguns I need a new shotgun tax returns around the bend

Get the new Remington V3, when you can. In 12 gauge of course.

Semi-Autos will never have the reliability of a double. They also don't swing as well, and you only get you one choke. I can't tell you how many times I've hunted with guys who were carrying Semi-autos and had feeding problems. I've got a beautiful Beretta 20 391 that stays there. Nice gun, but it's fussy about shells and doesn't hold a candle to a decent double. The Miroku in the link is a PHENOMINAL gun, and much better than any of the single barrel guns being suggested. I only wish Miroku wouldn't have agreed with Browning not to important their own branded guns when they started making guns for Browning. Many people will tell you the Miroku branded guns are nicer than the Brownings they also produce. There is a reason hard core upland guys carry doubles, and it's not because they wear Barbour and Dubarry.

Well, I guess here in the heart of upland and waterfowl heaven, we don't have many "hardcore guys" then.

I've only seen two doubles in the field in the past decade. Oh yeah, both were broken and unusable by the end of one day's hunting.

Oops, I also remember the really serious guy from Alabama that was up here using a Win Mod 21--that one broke also but it took 3 days.

I guess you don't...... When we were in SD this year, not only were all of the guys shooting doubles, most of the doubles were 100+ years old. I'm betting those guns have worked perfectly for each of those 100 years as well. If you ever get a chance to hunt wild quail on one of the really nice plantations in the South, don't bring your single barrel gun unless it's a break action, since they don't allow guns that aren't break action.

Consensus on the campfire is as likely as 12 women agreeing on laundry detergent. Your best bet is to try as many guns as you can get your hands on, that still appeal to you. Make your decision on what you like personally and you will be surprised at how well something will work that someone told you wouldn't....

I'm wondering if Jetjockey's brother is a doctor in Utah...

I'm about as hard core as it gets when it comes to upland hunting, and bird dogs. I expect my dogs, and my guns to work perfectly every time I hit the field. It's why my dogs go to summer camp every year, why they get trailed in the offseason, and why I stress over the little things in shotgunning. I don't put up with guns that jam and can't shoot light loads, heavy loads, and everything in between. When guns are marketed as "reliable", you know they aren't that reliable. It's why I dumped a Beretta 391 12 ga that kept jamming for my 20ga O/U when bird hunting in SA this year after the second or third flock of Egyptians came into our blind. Supposidely the 20 isnt enough for Egyptians, but our PH changed his mind that night after we started dropping passing geese at 40-50 yards. The Miroku I gave the link to is a far superior shotgun and will be much more reliable than any semi-auto. Pumps can be very reliable, and I still love my 870 Wingmaster, but it doesn't get hunted anymore. It's too big and clunky and doesn't should or swing anywhere close to a decent double. But opinions very!

I don't consider 3-5 shots during a mid-morning hour of walking behind pointing dogs on a private pheasant farm only to return to the cleaning comforts of a lodge in the middle of October to be much of a test of any shotgun. Though it is an enjoyable time.

Try August 15-January 4, stored on the floor of a pickup, shooting light dove lead through magnum goose steel, dragged through dry dust wheat field stubble onward to mud pit blinds and finally into snow, ice, and below-zero cold in a trapping sled, with no cleaning until season is over, THEN get ready for the abuse of spring snow goose season. The shotgun gets cleaned to bare steel once per year in the summer. Your 100-year old double wouldn't cut it. Neither will most current shotguns.

Each of us has our own hunting experiences and expectations, and ours are certainly different.

As an aside, your quote "I'm betting those guns have worked perfectly for each of those 100 years as well" is almost certainly false, by a long shot. Rather, those doubles have been maintained well for 100 years and repaired as needed to keep them running, which is enjoyable to many.

Sounds like exactly what I did with my 686 this year, with the exception of throwing it on the floor of the truck on a regular basis. You can add many rounds of trap to the equation as well. I think the final talley for the year was 12 flats of shells while hunting, and a couple more playing games. In Africa alone the gun was drug through goose blinds, duck blinds, dusty peanut fields, dry crop fields, and a bunch of other stuff in temps over 80 degrees. I think I went through 8 flats of shells in 4 days, and the gun was never cleaned. When I got back state side it was drug through the snow and sub zero temps on all day hunts in SD for late season roosters with heavy loads. On the way home it went to NE and the loads were lightened up for wild quail and pheasants. I finished up on a wild quail hunt in GA in 100% humidity and temps in the upper 70's, with light rain. I finally cleaned the gun after the GA hunt because of the water and humidity. Not only did the gun perform perfectly, I EXPECTED it to! What you describe is normal use, with the exception of throwing the gun on the floor, for me. I know my Semi autos wouldn't be able to handle that, and I'm not 100% positive my 870 could. I'm 100% confident in any of my doubles to do that, even though I don't treat the classic guns like I do my meat guns. I hunted with my FIL on most of those hunts, and his doubles perceived flawlessly as well, as should be expected.

I have friends in the dog training world who have doubles they use for training that have probably never been cleaned. They are dented, pitted, rusted, have never seen a spec of oil, and have been thrown in horse trailers, trucks, tractor, scaboards, and everything else you can think of, and they still function perfectly.

Good to know. I'll add the 686 to my list of useful shotguns.

This may need to be shared with all the dove shooters in Argentina as they don't know how problematic a Benelli shotgun really is. It seems they shoot millions of rounds a year through Benellis, not realizing how worthless they really are...

My 686 20ga 29.5" barrels is my favorite gun but my inertia guns serve just as well and I like synthetic in rough weather and around water.

Just get one that fits you and that you like. Most of the semi's are easy to adjust via spacers. A double can be adjusted but it's usually a larger and more expensive task.IMHO fit trumps action as long as we are talking good well known dependable guns.

They basically shoot one load and clean their guns every night. Where semi-autos run into trouble is when you shoot a large variety of loads. The nice thing about semi-autos is the reduced recoil. For Argentina dove shooting, they aren't a bad choice at all.

Guy I know had over 100,000 thru a Beretta 686. Broke a couple ejectors and had a locking lug replaced.

Myself ran around 12-15,000 thru a Beretta A400. For end cracked. Have an extra trigger for a little over a $100 because eventually something will let loose.

So far on a Perazzi around 20,000. Firing pins are getting a little burnt on the ends and will be replaced this summer along with hammer springs. Should go another 20 plus unless a top lever spring goes down. Probably should replace it also.

However, there is no way over the long haul a semi will hang with a Beretta, Perazzi, Krieghoff, Browning etc when it comes to breaking. Advantage to the semi it will be cheaper and an easier parts swap to get it back running quickly.

As far as hard core upland hunters only using a SxS or O/U. BS+ Same with respectable BS++

I have an Ithaca 37 28a that has lost its new shine in two years. It's been snowed on rained on and laid in the dirt more than once. A couple model 12 16a's that have been thrown on the truck floor and bounced around. Who knows what they went thru before I acquired them, but the stocks have been refinished and bluing is a thing of the past. An 870 that I bought back in the late 70's. Shot a bunch of trap with it, hunted Grouse for years with it with a shorter barrel and have used it for pump gun sporting events. Used when I bought it and all the same parts are still with it.

I have some SxS and O/U I use also. I guess I'm only respectable when carrying them.






Unfortunately more BS, since I've been there and used a Semi. However, you were only allowed two shells in the shotgun. It was the owners and he often uses it also. He can use a Fabbri, but usually doesn't.

Yeah, those Benelli's are losers...

"Tom’s Old Benelli
Benelli M1 Super 90
Tom Knapp finally retired his old Benelli M1 Super 90 last year when he donated it to the Buffalo Bill Historic Center in Cody, Wyoming, where it will be put on permanent display next to the guns of other great exhibition shooters like Herb Parsons and Annie Oakley. Tom's old Benelli wasn't worn out, in fact it had never let Tom down, but it was after Tom sent his faithful Super 90 to the museum that he sat down and figured out how many rounds the gun had fired. Buffalo Bill Historical CenterWith over 140 live shows per year, the total number of rounds put through the Benelli was over half a million. Well, it's a good thing Tom retired that gun, because at that pace he would have worn it out... in another hundred years or so."

Most do not! Many don't allow 12ga guns either.

A quick look at the gallery photos of the pay to hunt plantations-and all wild Quail are few and far between there-will show that most do.

I disagree! I live here, and have hunted several of the plantations that don't allow pumps or autos. Many of the guides require them as well as they want to be able to see the gun is safe. I get to hunt one place because my father in law was the surgeon who put one of the guides feet back together after a 12ga from 2 feet that was loaded, pointed at the ground, and tried to take it off. That guide requires breech guns now as well, and will never get all the bb's out.

"SAFETY IS OUR TOP PRIORITY – only breach shotguns are permitted on hunts (12 gauge shotguns will not be permitted for quail hunting). Prices are per person. Guns and ammunition not included unless otherwise stated."

"Breach loading guns are required in the field and can be supplied at no charge."


There's plenty of wild bird plantations. The problem is getting on them, and being able to afford them. They aren't nearly as commercialized as the ones who advertise all over Covey Rise and Shooting Sportsman. They offer far fewer hunts so as not to hurt the bird numbers, and they are ridiculously expensive!

Maybe on that place, but it isn't the norm. Correction:The semi is just as safe if they only allow 2 shells when walking into the point. 2 shells in a shotgun are the same wither break action or semi. Only shoot one and you have to open either to remove the live one. Shoot two and it makes no difference. On top of that someone will be watching and know how many times you pulled the trigger. Walk back with a break action after shooting two and don't have it open and you will be told. Shot two with a semi and it will be open. Which is why they only allowed two in a semi.


Place I'm talking about, you can't pay to get on even if you wanted to. The owner doesn't need any money other than his own to keep the place running.