Home Forums Gear Knives and Blades Ordered CPM 154

Well, I was not sure if or what I would do next for a batch of blades. Didn't do much last year.

I have settled on CPM 154. I have had good luck with 154CM, but thought the powdered metal version was a good next go round. Will target Rc 60 with cryo cycles for finished blades.

I have a 2'x3' sheet of .140" coming. I will have to pick some patterns for most of the sheet which will be cut out by water jet.
The balance of the sheet will be cut and shaped by hand for "special" patterns.

Other than those blanks water jet cut, all processes will be by hand (band saw, belt sanders, drill press, sharpen, final finish, etc).

I do not think I will be doing a pictoral review of this project as that is a bit of a pain for me to do.
I have really enjoyed the posts by Bob Wills of his process though.

Just thought I would mention it to this group.

Tim

I like to buy it in 6 by 36. I can nest 6 blades across it then cut across the sheet to make it easier to handle.
Sometimes you have to get creative in cutting them out. A1/16 inch drill bit helps to make some easier. Saw to drill portion then break it off.
The CPM version is supposed to have twice as much lateral strength than the CM but costs 25% more.

Mike
Yeah, handling a wide piece in the saw is a pain. I have used the drill hole method also. Sure easy to wipe out the offset of the teeth when not going in a straight line.

The major portion of my sheet will be water jet cut. You cannot come close to the optimization of steel by hand that you can by nesting patterns and water jet cutting.

I don't think I can band saw cut and grind into profile at a per blade total cost (labor and perishables) that is cheaper than the total blade cost and extra blades I get by water jet.
Of course, I keep some of the sheet in a strip as you mention for those onsie, twosie patterns.

I ended up at $17.40 a pound for the CPM154. I hope to net out about 80 blades total. The 154CM was $3 a pound cheaper. The edge should be a bit better with the CPM due to smaller and more uniform particle size to start.

I was going to go with CPM S30V, but find it to be a little bit chippie (due to vanadium???).
So going to try the CPM 154.

But of course the reality is, performance in the field between the different steels will be hard to differentiate if grinds, heat treat and sharpening are equal.

Guess I have something to keep me busy this summer.
Tim

Tim,

I'm very pleased with a hunter/caper set I got from TK Steingass using the CPM 154. It will definitely polish out to a mirror finish.
Would enjoy seeing the patterns you are thinking of!

Best,

GWB

A majority will be made into the classic Loveless guarded drop point and same a little down sized. Also some along the lines of Randall 25 or 26??? pattern. Rest some smaller unguarded stuff and any specific requests.




Or ?????
Tim

I LOVE working with CPM154. The only drawback I've had is the occasional blade with inclusions found only after the final polish. It drives me crazy. I had the grand poobah of Crucible steel contact me about my issue and they ended up replacing my steel. I still run into the inclusions from time to time though....as recently as last week. Had two blades out of nine that required a do-over to get em right.

It is a very high performance steel though! My personal knife gutted and quartered my 6x8 bull elk and four white tails after that...,and still shaved.

I'll keep using it and just deal with the issues if they pop up again.

How about a couple of Mannlicher's Japanese vegetable knives?

I could likely throw down for one of those...it's one that I wouldn't have to hide from the wife!

I can put one in the queue if you wish.
Just need to make sure we have the right pattern in mind. I don't think I kept a pic of Sam's knife. I did make a couple similar ones I have been using and should have a cut out pattern in the pile.
Let me know.
Thanks
Tim

Don't know if it helps, but this was the one I was thinking of. Don't remember seeing any mention of the stock thickness used though. Don't know how 0.140" will work for the design.

Sam's Small Japanese Style Knife

Oh, guess I forgot to say 'Yes.' Please add one to the queue.

OK. It will be a while, so be thinking about handle material. Sam has a love affair with Bocote, but I think micarta might be the ticket in the kitchen.

I don't remember the thickness on Sam's knife.
I have one I use in .100" 440C that works fine for me.
A little thicker should not hurt.

I might have a blade in that pattern heat treated in 440C laying around that is yet to be handled. I had started on a kitchen set, but never finished it.
Tim

hey, it's not just a veggie knife.

Tim,

I want you to think about making me another kitchen knife. This would be more in the way of a French paring knife. Blade 4 inches long, and thin.
The CPM 154 would be perfect for it. Bocote still works well for me. My kitchen knives never see a dishwasher, all carefully washed by hand.
I will get with you on the design. It will be killer.

Sam
We can do that.
Send along a sketch including thickness. I don't know a French paring knife from a french.....

I received the sheet of steel, so will be working towards making blades over the next couple months.
I still have a piece, maybe two of that bocote.

What is the thickness of that Japanese chopper????

Tim

Tim,

I am in the Miami condo until the first week or so of June. The knife is up in the North Florida house. When I get back, I'll measure it, and let you know. The info is probably on the card you sent with the knife.
I will send you a detailed drawing for the French Tickler, er, French paring knife. Thin is better for that one. Bocote would be good. I always hand wash my knives, and the Bocote has held up well for me.

Tim

I just noticed your signature line. I helped set up and run the first versions of the Navy PBR's from 65 to 66 in the People's Paradice. Khe Sanh was the year after I got out, so I don't know anything about it other than what was reported at the time. But it is interesting that the sign you reference as being up there, was also hanging on the bulkhead on the LST crew berthing area when I was there. When I got out, I had one made just like the one I saw, which is a little different from yours. It hung on my office wall until I retired to remind me of those who were still there and those who would never come home. Now it hangs in my reloading room. Photo's below.






There isn't a day that goes by that I don't think about those times and how true that sign really is and I say a little prayer for those who still stand in harm's way all across the globe and you probably do too.

Bob
I never made it as far north as Khe Sanh. I was with the Army 5th SFGA in RSVN, mostly in II Corps.

I saved the quote I gave above from Star and Stripes while over there. I cut it out and carried it in my wallet ever since. I am sure there were several iterations elsewhere.

I too have a spot on the wall in my reloading, hunting and knife area. My pics are John Wayne (Ballad of the Green Berets) and a S.F. recruiting poster of a major airborne jump stating that those who join S.F. are different.

Thanks to you from all who have, do and will serve their country.

Grind on.
Tim

michiganroadkill:


You asked me if I could just walk away from the fever and that should have been my clue to run like hell, but I missed it.

Since I started hanging around here and have seen the absolutely OUTRAGEOUSLY GOOD STUFF some of you boys are making, I am coming down with a baaaaaad case of new knife fever. It's incurable you know? I am particularly gratified to see some common sense knife designs using common sense steels. I am as happy as a pig in a mud wallow with most of the stuff shown here and it's easy to understand why some of these boys are proud of their knife collections.

I put a couple of knife maker web sites in my favorites on my computer and am watching them for when they put something there that I can't live without. I saw two yesterday, but wouldn't you know it, they are already sold. Good stuff doesn't stay around long and that's a good thing.

Grind on INDEED!! But I'm going to let you boys do it and just pay you for it and we'll all be happy. I'm getting too dam old for that grinding business. I'll grow my tomatoes and peppers and onena you boys can make me a new nife. Dontcha just love it when a plan comes together??

Bob, I am a member of the SCV myself. Could not help but notice your membership certificate on the wall.

Dang son!!! You have good eyes. When the local Concord Ranger camp learned my name, they looked me up and came knocking on my door to join them. There is a county in Florida named for my family and they helped establish Ft. Myers and did establish the city of Labelle and served as its first mayor. Ft. Myers still has major streets named for them. They came originally from Scottland to South Carolina, then to Georgia and then to Florida and fought indians and yankees and at one time ran 50,000 head of cattle free range.

The SCV does good work but we are under attack on every front as the PC crowd rewrites history, re-names schools, roads and destroys monuments and grave yards. I am amazed at how little most people know about that time period of American history. Actually, amazed how little they know about history period for that matter.

Do you think I could use some of my Confererate money to get Tim to build me a knife?

I may be cheap, but I am not easy.
I prefer Krugerrands. They are from the south you know.

Is waterjet cutting expensive?

Depends on the location of the water...

Water jet cutting is about 2x-3x laser cutting cost. But it does not leave you with the melted edge that laser cutting does and I like that. You have too make sure you grind your laser cut edge back far enough so the heat treat process is not negatively affected.

Water jet is a high pressure erosion process. In time and consumables per blade plus wasted material, I can not cut out blades by hand and grind in profiles any cheaper than having them water jet cut. I usually have about 5 or 6 square feet of sheet for water jet cut.

where can one get this "waterjet" cutting service?

Just have to start searching. S/B something in the business ads in phone book, internet, local manufacturing shops, etc.
Then you have to find one that will dink around with your small order and still affordable.

I give them cut out blade patterns to go by. They copy them and make a cutting pattern for the water jet. I give them estimate of the quantity of each blade I am hoping for, plus how much strip to leave for me to cut out onsie twosies. Then I pay them without bitching about the price. The sheet I get back is "optimized" as far as how many blades I end up with.

Well, I am in the grinding mode. I will end up with something just shy of 100 blades out of the sheet and the 3"x36" strip and the salvage out of the water jet skeleton.
Will plan on two grinds, the second probably next year.

Still have a few things members here need to clear up with me on stuff they wanted.
I will post a pic of the patterns somewhere down the road when I get some of each flat ground, bevel ground and holes drilled.

Tim

Off to heat treat.

Beautiful job Tim. Can't wait to see what you will do with them.

I like the lines on several of those smaller blades. Classic and useful. Looks like you're gonna be busy for awhile now!

Nice patterns!

Same here, I'm having trouble deciding which one I like the best. 1st picture, far right, 2nd from the bottom right now.

Are those ours on the top in the second photo? They look good Sir

Shawn

Shawn
Yes, bottom first, top second. I had to make one for me too.

All
Thanks for the comments, and I let me know of any interests.

Tim

ya'



here's what he did with some 52100 and 154CM.

Good stuff T.O.

JAPPFT,


GWB

I have been traveling so much, that I forgot about the thickness of the Japanese style kitchen knife. It's 1/8 inch, and made with 154CM steel.