Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Finn Aagaard on the 280 Remington

That hurt my feelings, Ingwe.

I didn't want to have to do this but.....

Check your prostate lately?

Sir Charles

https://youtu.be/TZaRUpXO-0Q

I know.....

Finn Aagaard was a great hunter, writer. I respect his opinion. But, this topic on what's the greatest is absurd.
Everyone deep down knows that the 06 is the best cartridge. The 280 is next. Further the 270 Win is the best ever coyote cartridge.

And the .460 Wby is the greatest varmint cartridge EVER!

Granted. But how much expansion on cottontails?

Just enough.

I have my .280 because I grew up reading Carmichael and he made me want one. With that said I can offer no common sense reasoning that says the .280 is better than the .270 at anything. And there is nothing I would use one for and not the other. And the man who needs ammo in a pinch is light years further ahead with a .270.

If the 280 had came out before the 270...the 270 would probably never had been born.

Flame suit on.

I've often wondered where Winchester came up with the .277 idea from. Beings how .264 and .284 were already established.

It did.

They called it the 7x64 Brenneke and it came out in 1912,so had a 12 -13 year start on the 270.

It would have been silly for Winchester to bring out a .284 on the 30/06 case because the Brenneke already existed.

So it brought out a true 7mm instead and named it the 270 Winchester.

In a way, it kind-of was.

The nearly identical 7x64 Brenneke was introduced in 1917. Eight years before the 270Win.

Hard to figure why it never took off in the US.


Beat me to it Bob

But Bob . . . I kind-of look at differently. It seems silly to me to bring out a cartridge with a minor .007" bore tweak. A new bore size.

Guess it worked for them though.

WA: I thought 1912....whatever.

The Brenneke was first. Not sure but the Brenneke keyed on heavier bullets. I guess Winchester wanted something that kicked less than the 30/06,and shot fast/flat. I don't know why .277 but have read reasons.

Anyway the 270 is a true 7mm. It was also an American cartridge chambered in an American bolt action and shot American ammo sold by Winchester. At the time it was among the fastest factory bolt action cartridges you could buy. That's a big deal in 1925.

Winchester actually designed a .28-caliber round based on the .30-06 case before the 7x64 Brenneke appeared (which most sources agree was in 1917), and a bolt-action rifle to handle it. In the years just before World War One, they intended to introduce both the rifle and cartridge in Europe. Called the .28 Winchester Centerfire, it used a .287" bullet. But the war killed the project.

As to exactly why Winchester chose .277" as the bullet diameter for the .270, nobody really knows, but one educated guess is they didn't want the Mauser 7x57's that had poured across the Mexican border during the Pancho Villa years to be rechambered for a higher-pressure round, so made sure the bullet was just small enough to prevent that.

The reason 7mm (and some other calibers, such as 6.5mm and .30) ended up with fast enough twists to stabilize the heavy-for-caliber spitzers so fashionable today is they originated as military calibers when smokeless powder first appeared--with very heavy round-nosed bullets. The twists had to be fast to stabilize those bullets.

But purely sporting calibers such as .22, .25 and .27 ended up with slower twists. The theory back then was not to over-stabilize high-velocity bullets, because any flaw in the bullet balance resulted in poor accuracy--and those three calibers came into use after lighter, higher-velocity spitzers became the trend for hunting.

1917,wasn't there a war goin' on in Europe at that time. Couldn't that be a small reason not to use a European sounding caliber?

Coulda called it the 284Win.

Yup.