Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Custom Rifles & Wildcats Customs vs. Factory

I have bought a few customs and big name guns and a lot of factory guns. Interestingly enough, my customs, envisioned for some specific purpose, have generally let me down. You get them and there are always problems, most often requiring my own work and in most instances a second or third gunsmith because the builder never screws up. In my experience, I would say average accuracy and function of customs are below the level of factory guns, though I have never had an an Echols or something in that price range. Also, some smiths seem to build accurate and some build functional but I have not found the one that builds both. Problems I have experienced include feeding, multiple broken bolt stops on a builder designed action, poor accuracy, badly cut chambers, bedding problems, special recoil reducing stocks that make everybody that fires the rifle exclaim "Wow, that kicks hard!", etc. I have not commissioned a custom that did not have some combination of these issues and required work and in most cases $$$$ to correct.

With that said I have found two or three factory rifles that are darn close to perfection without much work and are as follows:

-Tikka T3-Plusses: accurate, balance well, light weight, reliable, feed great, reliable, slick feeding, great value and wonderful factory trigger. Needs: a good recoil pad, which can be bought for $30 or so and installed DIY. Cons: loading port that makes single-loading and checking chamber difficult. I have had four, but now only own my daughter's 7-08.

-Blaser R8: most consistently accurate platform I have fired and generally shoot the same hot or cold or clean or dirty, reliable, feed great, travel well, can switch cartridges, great detachable mounts, excellent trigger, good balance and great open sights. Needs: a normal sling swivel that allows bipod use. Needs: install a cheap Harris swivel adaptor on a really expensive stock/receiver. Cons: guns and accessories overpriced, though Eurooptics $2,200 special on the preferable S version is a reasonable value compared to customs, hammer forged barrels a little rough compared to lapped, cut barrels.

-Honorable mentions--Kimber: most of the qualities of above but just not quite as consistent. Cooper: may be close but I don't have enough experience to know.

Are you happy with your customs? If so, who built them and what specs? Do you have multiple factory rifles from a brand that out perform customs? If so, what brand and why?

I haven't had any full-out custom jobs, just too many off the shelf and semi-customs to go that route.
All of my semi-customs have been tack-drivers. All started as off-the-shelf rifles that didn't live up to my expectations or needs and got a new barrel and action job done to them.
I'd have to agree on the T3 series. One of the better off-the-shelf rifles available.
I had an R-93 Blaser in 300 Win that was fantastic. Alas, shoulder problems sent it down the road.
I'd add to your list the Howa/Weatherby Vanguard S2's to the list. I haven't owned one yet that wouldn't shoot very well. Especially after tailoring a load for them. Have one in 243 that's shot a 4-shot 2" group at 500.

If you are building a custom rifle because you think it will shoot or perform better than a factory 308 Win rifle (especially a bedded, screwed on straight factory rifle), you are in for a sad day.

OTOH, not a lot of T3s with fiddleback stocks or chambered in a wildcat you want to play with.

I would be disappointed in custom bolt guns also if mine shot less accurately than factory bolt guns. Who does your work? My custom bolt guns are almost always more accurate than factory, and they should be. Maybe it is your loads?

GAP, Kampfeld, Dwight Scott, IT&D, RW Snyder, Pierce, Pac-Nor, plus 3 other local smiths who shall remain nameless😉 Have all done nice work for me. But there are definitely some hacks out there, just like any other trade.

There are some very accurate factory rifles out there and one certainly doesn't need a custom to fill the freezer. But there are different reasons for customizing rifles.....

I've had 4 full customs built and one more on the way. So far of all the ones I've had done the one that has been most accurate and never has had an issue since day one is my Kampfeld Custom built .243. I got it from Karl 4 years ago, I think it might of been one of the last full builds he did.

IMHO its the perfect rifle. Its built around a Borden Alpine action, Lilja #3 contour barrel, 1-9" twist and finished at 23".
Shilen trigger, PTG Oberndorf aluminum bottom metal, and a McMillan Classic Edge stock. Feeds perfect and has been super accurate - this shooting factory ammo. I'm happy:)

My other most accurate rifle and again I'd say about perfect is my factory Remington KS .280. Owned it since new, shoots great and has just been my lucky rifle - I should of bought your stainless one a couple weeks back but missed it by a couple minutes!!

Third one is a Tikka Superlite 7MM-08 that I dropped in a Hunters Edge, scary accurate and will be coming along to Wyoming in a week when I hunt antelope - as a backup but I may have to actually hunt with it:)

I have customs built by two on your list. Neither equal my Tikkas and Blasers for both function and accuracy. Some build accuracy and some function, but I have not found the smith that does both in my price range.

Agreed on Howas, though I have owned a couple that were just OK. Most are exceptional.

Maybe my criteria for a hunting rifle are in order:

-great balance
-reasonable weight
-good trigger
-accurate
-shoot all bullets to roughly the same POI hot or cold or clean or dirty

I have had my share of guns and very few rifles meet the last category, custom or otherwise.

I would say that if you are happy with your factory guns, then stick with them. No reason to spend more money if you feel it is to no avail. For example, I won't spend money on a custom barrel if a factory one meets my needs, etc.

As for function, I certainly would not accept a custom rifle that did not function correctly, if in fact it was due to the smith's poor work.......

DMD: Understood. I have had issues myself.

Thats why most of my hunting has been done with pre 64 M70's bedded in Brown, McMillan and Bansner stocks.

(BTW flawless reliable function is the FIRST requirement for a BG rifle, not hairsplitting grouping ability. I have yet to see anything that beats a pre 64 M70 at that task, spreading the experience over many different brands over many years.) If it doesn't work perfectly it's junk no matter how accurate it is.

I've not had a factory rifle that didn't need something tweaked or fixed, with the exception of my Ed Brown Damara.

I've never had a Tikka.

For typical factory guns vs custom, if you think they're equivalent, don't buy a borescope...

Some factory barrels look pretty good, but it's not that hard to see the difference thru a Hawkeye. Many, esp. Salvage and Rem, can look pretty rough with tool marks. I'm amazed how well some of those actually shoot.

Then go Hawkeye a Brux, Krieger, etc.

DF

Amen and hallelujah!! I have no problems with my factory rifles. Most are over 60 years old though. They made them to work back then....

Yeah it's the old wood and blued guns that get left alone, save for maybe a trigger job. The new factory stuff that gets tweaked and customized.....

There's been 52 years + to weed out the Win M70's that feed like crap, don't shoot well etc.

What you have left is the cream of those made.

I'd guess that 52 years from now - the available examples of M77 or Kimber or whatever will most likely be slicker n snot, feed well, shoot etc. Likely for the same reasons.

Yep...as my realist friend would say, "We're living in the good old days."

Agreed. The function didn't make my list. Not sure why, maybe I consider it a given. My guess is a Blaser or Tikka out performs a pre 64 in that regard but need more testing to prove. I am confident both do under normal conditions

That's my point, Tikkas and Blasers don't need tweaking in my experience.

I have killed more stuff with my M700 rebore 338-06 than anything. Going on 22 years. That said, I do enjoy my M70's...

Would love to hear the "reasoning" behind said "guess".

For sheer practicality, reliability, dependability in the field, a Pre-64 M70 is very hard to beat. Break it down part for part, and it should be self evident.....

Reasoning is outlined above but have had 30 or so pre64 70s and around a dozen custom FN Mausers, the Mausers ae still mostly around because of my commitment and nostalgia, the pre-64 M70s are gone and the Blasers and T3s for me better meet my standards of reliability, accuracy and ergonomics out of the box without a bunch of gunsmithing. Much less drama from those two brands than anything I have played with in my opinion. I also think both feed better ghan Mausers or pre-64s because of inline mags.

For what it's worth, most of my hunting is in arid and fairly open areas requiring good marksmanship from field positions. Said areas contain ample amounts of blowing dirt.