Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Let Me Have It. I Am a Bicyclist

It's not always the Auto drivers fault.

Aww,,they quit filming too soon,.it was just getting good.!

Paul,

You keep mentioning that many car drivers are inattentive and do stupid stuff and don't obey the laws. Yes, that is true. So what?
That is not what this thread is about. You asked why drivers have problems with bicyclists. That is what we are all talking about.

If you are defending the bad behavior of many bikers by saying that many drivers are worse, you are certainly not elevating the cause of bicyclists.

Whether drivers are good or bad doesn't change the fact that motor vehicles and bicycles are not a good mix.

Studies of highway traffic have shown that when vehicles are traveling at close to the same speed, accident numbers are reduced. The same studies show that when vehicle speeds vary by more than 20 mph on the same road, regardless of vehicle type, accident rates go up. That certainly includes bicycles using the same road.

You mentioned that being delayed momentarily by a bicycle is no different than being delayed by a mail truck, etc.
I beg to differ. Mail trucks, garbage trucks, and school buses are providing an essential service to all in the community. Bicyclists using the road for fun and fitness are not in the same category.

The person that said that drivers are not in any physical danger from bicyclists only gets half a point for their argument. Ask any driver that has caused a death if it has had a major effect on their life. Twenty years ago my niece killed a pedestrian with her car. It haunts her to this day, despite the fact that she wasn't found at fault and the pedestrian was on drugs and stepped out right into her path, possibly on purpose.

Common sense on the part of drivers and bicyclists would eliminate most problems. In that statement I include most bicycles staying out of most traffic lanes most of the time. In my mind that is common sense. Unfortunately common sense is hard to legislate, and we don't want more laws and restrictions.

I always figured a guy who acts like an entitled douchebag on a bike probably acts like an entitled douchebag when driving a car.
Yes I do ride, but mostly gravel roads because there is a lot less traffic to deal with. No I don't wear spandex.

You guys are wasting your time.

He's making roads safer for all of us, you should thank him.

Funny how he can't comprehend why people hate cyclists...

Now that is quality content. Travis, can you give 444Whackoff some lessons?

This will make all better........



And.......

You'll never get these guys to stare longingly at you dressing like that.

I am not at all defending bad behavior in bicyclists. I abhor it. I don't consider slow rolling stops, not signaling turns and speeding on a bicycle, when they don't affect other road users to be bad behavior. Certainly no worse than it is driving a car. I ride my bike the way I drive my car. I am courteous to other road users and I bend the law a little when in my learned opinion I can safely and courteously do so. Don't we all?

I didn't ask why motorists have a problem with bicycles. I know why and I offered myself up as the target of your rage. I didn't say I wouldn't shine a little perspective on the subject while you tee off on me.

Why is the reason a vehicle is on the road important? Should delivery vehicles have priority over a family driving to Disney World since the delivery vehicle is providing an essential service and the family going to Disney World is on the road purely for recreational reasons. When I am towing my boat, should I get out of the way of people driving to work?

Not only are drivers not in danger from bicyclists, they have a hell of a lot of control over whether they run over one or not. If you are unfortunate enough to be involved in a not at fault fatality with a bicyclist, I can't imagine it would be any more traumatic than being involved in a not at fault fatality with a motorist.

You are right in that there is an elevated risk associated with speed disparity. Especially given a bicyclists vulnerability. I do my best to mitigate that risk by riding lightly traveled roads, using strategies to make myself more visible and staying out of the way as much as practicable.

I am a safety specialist by profession. There is no such thing as the absence of risk. We all have a threshold for what we consider acceptable risk. Some people are afraid to fly.

I have poured over volumes of data on bicycle accidents and fatalities. Bicycle fatality rates are on the decrease and have been for years. When I look at the leading causes of bicycle fatalities, I see risks I can eliminate. There are just over 700 bicycle deaths per year. If I don't ride on the wrong side of the road, don't ride under the influence and don't ride at night without lights, That number is cut in about half.

Then if I don't ride in door zones, use extreme caution and slow down at intersections and road entrances, I further reduce the chances I'll be killed. Further yet if I am alert for right hooks and stay out of door zones.

That leaves sideswipes and rear end strikes as the chief remaining type of fatality. The best strategies for eliminating this risk are unfortunately the very strategies that piss motorists off. Riding off of the fog line increases visibility and discourages squeeze passes. Riding in groups increases visibility and discourages bullying behavior.

I rarely ride in groups. Most often alone or with one other person. I am keenly aware of traffic behind me. I wear bright colors. When a vehicle is well off behind me I often tend toward the middle of the lane and weave a little to increase my conspicuity. Then I look over my shoulder to let the motorist know I am aware they are there. Then I move as far to the right as practicable. At that point I am at their mercy. I monitor them closely and am prepared to bail if I have to and have time.
That technique has served me well. I have stripped away all the manageable risks and am left at what I consider an acceptable risk.

Even with all of the risks associated with bicycling, studies have shown it adds to longevity.

There are almost as many accidental gun discharge death in the US each year as there are bicycle deaths. That doesn't dissuade any of us. We feel confident that we can manage the successfully manage the risks.

Paul you said.... '...Not only are drivers not in danger from a bicyclist, they have a hell of a lot of control over whether they run over one or not...'

I beg to differ, when 'the pack' ran the stop sign, I was left with the choice of driving up their collective AZZes or leaving the lane....I did not have time to slow down. I DID have control over whether I ran over them or choose to move into the oncoming lane, and as I passed them they were still coming through the stop sign. Had a car been coming in the opposite lane I would absolutely have been in danger.

I spent 24 years as an Air Traffic Controller, lots of 'routine tasks', but mostly looking for things that would, could, might go wrong and fixing it before babies and Samsonite were scattered all over several counties.

It strikes me odd that a Safety Specialist could not possibly forsee the possibility that a bicycle could be a causal factor in creating DANGER to a driver.

By that's just my opinion!

I get what you are saying. I didn't do a good job of explaining what I meant. A motorist is not likely to be killed or injured by a bicyclist. In your case the bicyclists could have been a catalytic force in a crash. Situations like that are a relative rarity I would think. I can't say I have ever read about a bicyclist being a catalytic factor in an accident. I feel certain it has happened but would reckon it to be so rare as to make it almost a non-issue.

On that we agree.

I am fortunate in that I can commute to work on a bicycle, I live just 15 minutes away but by taking longer routes I can turn it into up to a two-hour commute each way. I love this self-imposed hardship, the necessity of rolling out before dawn and the fact that being out there in the weather, whatever it is, has become part of my daily routine.

More than that the opportunity for epic endeavors. I have ridden from Texas to New York, and recently England, Scotland, Ireland and France. I used to think of my motorcycles as freedom machines, and I suppose they still are. The sight of a loaded-up motorcycle in the driveway, camping gear and bags attached and the world waiting at the end of your driveway, is a fine thing.

Heading out for distant places on a bicycle is like that, but better. You never know what the day will bring, or where darkness will catch up to you, or upon what patch of ground you will spend the night. I could live that way, easily.

Birdwatcher

Yep.

Sounds like you and I are on the same page. I am forever aware that I am the one putting myself out there in or in immediate proximity to public roadways, and act accordingly. If I get hit, it will always be my fault.

I will say I ride slower than the spandex crowd commonly does. Part of this is the fact that the faster you go, the more your eyes have to be fixed on nothing but the pavement ahead of your front wheel, I actually like to be able to look around when I ride.

Another reason for going slower is I will bail off of the asphalt and onto the roadside grass in a heartbeat rather than impede traffic. You cant do that very well when you're rolling fast.

Birdwatcher

Dude, Town Lake hike and bike trail, downtown Austin TX, not far from UT.

Whatever state of harmony you thought you were in, you'll lose it when you hit that trail

Just so you know, a major part of that reek is the padding of their crotch pads That alone would prevent me from ever wearing one.

Do you ever go to the advnture motorcycling website advrider.com

I am getting ready to head out on a 32 mile loop. It goes right through the heart of New Orleans. Most of it is on dedicated bike paths or in bike lanes. This time of the morning on a weekend I have the roads almost completely to myself. The stench of Bourbon Street at this hour stings the nostrils.

Have a good ride!

12 long pages of bicycle talk. Shoulda been tittypitchers before the second page was done.