Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles School me on the 300 Blackout in an AR

My son in law is looking at an AR15 in 300 Blackout.

I don't have any personal knowledge of this cal.

What can you tell me about it?


Thanks! Virgil B.

It will be roadkill in 10 years, not worth the effort.... 6.8 will always have a hunting niche.

It's a modern 30/30, give or take. If he is looking for a suppressed hunting round, there is something to be said for it. If he's looking for a high velocity round I'd personally opt keeping it a 5.56.

I just picked up an 8.5" upper from PSA to use with a suppressor. Easy switch from 223 and very versatile with light bullets for hunting or heavies for QUIET plinking...

300 bo will be around if nothing else for the guys running suppressors.

I starting shooting its predecesor 300 whisper out of a Thompson Contender single shot in 1999. I still have the Contender but also a SBR Noveske AR 10.5 inch barrel.

Lots of haters of this round but I am not one. I have killed over 50 whitetails with this round both subsonic suppressed and supersonic.

Its all about bullet placement. So far no run offs, most deer drop within 20 yds or so. I farm and have kill permits from the state. I have a Ruger in .308 Win that rarely gets used.

its a suppressor round, if you want a suppressed gun get a BO. Not a hater, if your not going to suppress it the 5.56 makes infinitely more sense, cost to shoot good bullets, flatter trajectory, just as lethal, practice ammo everywhere. To hunt in a no 22 state I would say get the 6.8.

This covers my thoughts... in a no 22 state it would not be just my go to round, 6.8 or others that are out there would cover it better without a can IMHO.

Thanks guys!

I'll pass on the information to my son in law.

Sounds to me like he'd be better off with a 5.56

Virgil B.

My son is 38 and is building a 300 BO. I am not sure why but that's what he wants. He will suppress it.
But he does have a 223 for serious work.

I have one, a Daniel Defense M4V5. I previously had a CMMG, and the DD is more accurate. Both guns are completely reliable.

I like the 300 BO myself. Supersonic it's a .30 carbine on steroids, especially when loaded with good bullets, which is a good thing. Subs are a specialty round but work well, too.

Sorta, but I think it's more accurately described as the AR15 version of the 7.62x39.

I still find it odd how guys who think the AK round is perfectly adequate, but insist the 300 Blk is only good for subsonics. I guess some people still think headstamps matter more than what comes out the muzzle.

I also see it as the American version of the 7.62x39.

Don't have one, but plan on putting an upper together one of these times.

Common bolt and magazine with the 5.56 is easy for me to like.

Leaving behind the 30-30 I was never impressed with the 7.62x39 except for cheap plinking. The 300 Whisper intrigues me as a sub sonic round but offers nothing over the 223 to me at least for my uses.

I have no hate for the round, just hate the hype that it was introduced with.

this is the skinny on the 300 black. decent at short range really nothing else.

good video..whispering death...1000 yard snipers...too funny.

If you are gonna build an AR pistol, I'd go with the 300BO for that too.

Me either, but mainly because of bullet selection, not power. The difference in power isn't enough for an animal to notice one way or another, and the 300 isn't hampered by poor bullet selection like the AK round.

Been over this before, but you are as stubborn as I am.... x39 supersonic, ammo all over the place to buy, can run it in 308 or 311 barrels, never seen a problem,cheap plinker. Kills fine.

Why go a a 300/221 and have to form brass, or buy formed brass, expensive super sonic ammo, and so on, if all you are going to do is blast with supersonic, the way to go is obvious.

If you want to go sub, the way is obvious that the 300/221 now has a legit use, but I"d have no issues going sub with the x39 either.

Heck to do it all, go x39 from the start and have the best of all worlds.

at least the BO can kill a pig. 223 can't.

Nope but I caught this one sleeping...

I don't just go "blast" ammo. Not into that.

I don't buy rifle ammo either, and the 300 is easier to reload because of brass availability.

My point though is not whether the 7.62x39 is better or worse than the 300, but that they are more alike than different. That is why it doesn't make sense to me that guys who think the AK round is fine will turn up their noses at supersonic 300. They do the same thing; the only advantage in one vs the other is whether you reload and want good bullet choices.

Really?
I was with a group that hunted pigs last January. We killed 14 of them, nine were killed with ARs in 223. All but one of those was a one shot kill.

Its just like a .30-30 minus about 40-50% energy at 100 yards! whats the pros of the blackout vs a 556 running 75 grain bullets when using a 16" barrel? Im getting about 2575 fps using hornady 75 bthp.

it will be the AR platform round in 10 years for everything including hunting.

dang opinions!

keep in mind that people sniffed at the 8mm Kurtz while the world was banging away with full length rifle rounds in urban warfare.
the 8mm was the predecessor of the 7.62 Russian...The BO is the reloaders version of the two.
massive amounts of available brass
broad selection of projectiles
sufficient energy at the range 90+% whitetail deer are shot.
capable of subgun suppression with factory ammo
and actually noticeable difference in report side by side with supersonic loads against a 5.56.

look...if you want to shoot elk... buy a elk caliber.
if your average shots are 200+ meters...buy something else.

but at common, average distances and proper selection and placement the BO will work better than a 5.56.
Better means faster incapacitation.
And as a urban fighting caliber you can switch from a 110 Barnes to a 220 RN SUBSONIC.

You are very true they are very similar. And once 300/221 brass was available formed it changed quite a bit... but I have all the forming stuff from years back, and I've also got a fair amount of x39 lapua brass available to me personally.

And yes, I always forget there are some folks that don't reload. I just don't understand that part much, but I tend to forget that in my factor.

I've yet to see a deer or pig the 223 couldn't kill.

And now that I"ve thought a bit... I think you can get 300/221with the light barnes bullet in factory ammo.

I've never seen barnes in x39 ammo.

that would make the 300/221 my top pick if limited to factory ammo.

And the fact that I think you can buy factory 194 lehigh subs also. The best sub bullet I've ever shot.

If you compare a 150gr Hornady SST at 2000 fps (300 BO), to a 150gr RN at 2350 fps (30-30), they are very close at 100 yards if you look at retained velocity/energy.

IMO, the Blackout will be the "standard" bigger-than-223 for years to come. It is very good at what it does, and with the complete compatibility between it and 5.56 equipment, it's a no-brainer for most people wanting to try something a bit "bigger" than a 223.

Can you get 2000 fps using a 150 sst or is it more like 1875-1900 fps? Whats the expansion velocity of a 150 sst? We get a whopping 2125 using a 125 nosler ballistic tip! Then your trying to compare a handloaded blackout round to a weak light factory .30-30 round. Not apples to apples!

Western Powder load data for the 300 BO goes up to 2086 fps for 150gr, 16" bbl, using Accurate 1680.

I was sandbagging a bit on the BO.

Same reference max of 2375 fps for 150gr in the 30-30, via Accurate A2230.



I'd say I was pretty close in my example.

a 220 RN @ 1100 is a fun thumper...let's see the 5.56 equivalent.

That's easy, a 75 grain hpbt at 2800 fps.

Pretty much any 5.56 supersonic rifle round will beat any subsonic round. That's part of my gripe on the blackout, it's been hyped up so much people think it's a "thumper" when it's nothing more than a pistol round at subsonic velocities and a ho hum rifle round loaded supersonic.

And 30-30's can be loaded with pointed bullets too...

75 bthp or similar in a 223 would never leave me feeling undergunned...

I have felt shorted with a 300/221 and a 50 beowulf a few times due to distance.

In fact my longest kill with the 223 and a 75 amax was something over 550 and under 575.

Nothing to be sneezed at, the 223 round with correct projectile.

And I load a lot of 30-30 with pointy bullets.

And I load 300/221 only sub sonic.

YMMV.

Mostly we argue about fruit, and mostly it all gets it done.

Face it, deer, if thast what the subject is, are not very hard to kill.

dale,
not to start an argument, but i think you must be mistaken. by chance do you have any pics?

all these hogs were shot with a 223; some in the ear, some in the neck. none died... at least within view. you're not talking about hogs that ran off and died are you?



rost,
just because you haven't met any pigs that couldn't be killed with a 223 doesn't mean they're not out there. check out this vid where my buddy shot one right between the eyes with the most powfer bullet you can get for a 223 (whatever that is). texas hogs are very tough and extremely clever. this pig took a knee so we would concentrate on the others. while our heads were turned he charged right at us. i had to knock my buddy out of the way or he would have been killed.

my hogs didn't go down because i was shooting a 6.8. yeah i know... anything .270 is ghey but at my age sometimes you just have to go with it.

Note, that is a 223 laying on the sleeping pig above. Be very very quiet as I wouldn't want to wake him up...

good try but i blew up the pic. what do you have to say for yourself now?

Where I find the 300 BO most interesting, is when compared to pistol caliber carbines like 9mm, 45 ACP, and even some of the levergun stuff like 357, 44-40, 45 Colt etc.

I think that is the class of cartridges it best fits with.

On that playing field, it can do some impressive things from subsonic to supersonic.

That it can be handily introduced to the AR-15 with minimal fuss, make it a natural.

Dang it!!! Foiled again.

A pig can kill someone?

lol. ok that was good...

here's a vid that turned ugly at the very end. anyone but me and it would have been tragic.

LOL, my cousin heard em across the road a few years ago and went to bust a few. He shot one in a pond and another before it got in the tall Johnson grass but as the rest of em scattered, he noticed the grass started parting and it was coming towards him. He dumped a 20 round mag and never saw the pig but it did change course.

I'm gonna convert all my other AR's to bigger calibers after seeing that video. Which sharpie do you recommend?

djones, the 5.56 with 75 grain scirroco will kill a pig. The BO is fine as a suppressor round, anyone post a 10 shot group with a 300 BO with supersonic bullets at 100 yards out of one of those 1-7 twisted barrels yet?

Forgive me. I'm digressing. Quite a few years ago a paraplegic buddy of mine calls on an icy day here... busted a big sow, can I come get it and clean it as his dad is not home... sure...

Get tehre he has busted this sow about 250ish pounds. I had taken a deer rifle with me... and as we walked up the grass starts parting, going all directions... I shot at the wakes of grass, as my nephew fed me more 300 wtby rounds as I needed.... I think we shot 9 of the shoats that morning.

but a 223 would have killed them all.

Back on track, the most I've shot and killed at once with a 223 is 3 with lined up heads. For some reason I can't get more than 2 lined up and dead with body shots. But I've lost count of how many I have taken with a 223 AR and a 6/6.8 AR over the years. I actually can't recall shooting pigs with much else, a shotgun and a 45 now and then, LOTS more with a 22lr though than anything else. Maybe 10 last fall with 300/221.

Pigs don't botehr me much, I've had to kick 2 of them in the snout to let them know they were running away the wrong way.
I have had one charge me once that got my attention after he had an arrow put in him, but he wasn't much for this world after the arrow had hit and it was mostly a bluff so he could go and die.

I suspect they might be different in different areas, but i've not found aggressive or hard to kill pigs from the Rio Grande up to the middle part of the hill country and all in between so far.

Now a group I saw in New Mexico once..... and had no clue they have moved into that area at that time.... that group was some big mean looking pigs.... we wouldn't shoot since we were on top of and after a fairly big muley buck at the time....they kind of looked a hair wooly and grumpy.

I needed a good laugh before bed! You have a numbers problem there! Might need to get to a 308 too, that 223 wasn't working all that well.....

I heard all my life how pigs had an armor plate draped over them and nothing short of a nuclear weapon would penetrate it.

Then one day while calling coyotes a bunch of them walked into my cousins view and he popped a big boar with a 223 AR and a 50 grain NBT right behind the front leg. It ran about 75 yards into the brush and ran out of oxygen. I stepped on another one buried up in a thicket and it/I ran the other way. Found the big old boar dead and he weighed about 300 lbs. Told me right then the 223 worked when put in the right spot.

I don't shoot em in the head nor do I expect them to drop dead at the shot. Lung em and they die pretty quick. Oddly enough the only one I can think of us losing was one I shot with a 44 magnum. Maybe just blind luck but I like my chances with the 223.

Right now I'm trying to see what a 147 grain Federal HST in 9mm will do to one but they aren't cooperating, done went nocturnal.

It don't matter how you kill pigs, just kill em!

And to get back on track, the 300 Blackout will do just fine too of course, just don't tell me the 223 ain't enough.

I'm just fine with the 223 for that too, I don't want to give anyone the impression I think the 223 doesn't kill.

My interest in the 300 is more for short barrel stuff (I don't have much interest in rifle length 7.62x39 either); the 300 excels in short barrels and really does have an advantage over the 5.56 there. My little backpack gun (literally, fits in a backpack) is a 9" barreled AR in 300; that's a great performer in a small package and much more potent and pleasant to shoot than a short 223 or short AK.

I shoot it with 110gr or 125gr supersonic loads most of the time; the subsonic stuff is more of a niche use IMO.

Always have to laugh when people talk about those blood thirsty feral hogs!

c'mon jimbo. i know you know better

sorry twr but friends don't let friends hunt with 223s. somebody's gotta say it.

rost. try to stay awake to the end of this one. i'm not shooting a 308 anymore. for some reason i haven't figured out yet, i changed to a 6.8. but i would NEVER hunt hogs with a 223.

fish, to be clear, when i allude to killer hogs and 223s, i'm not talking about stripers that could just as easily be boot stomped. i'm talking about one's like in this vid... over 400lbs. substantial livestock have already succcumed to this meat eater. hunters have been killed when their vehicles were turned over from direct charges. another professional hog killer and myself are the only ones i know who have even set foot on ground in the same square mile of this man killer. we both had 6.8s and he soaked up 5 of them right in the ear and brain. when i examined him he had numerous 223 bullets stuck in his armor shield and one buck knife. you have been led to water...

When I grow up I wanna be just like or a little like or sorta like, oh heck who am I kidding, I could never face down a charge like that...

Who would really believe these types of stories, vehicles overturned by a 400 lb hog. Cattle being eaten. Come on now, give me some of what your smoking! Good friends hunt all over texas with dogs for a living and we fund this hilarious as hell.

It's better read in sarcasm font... :-)

I mean c'mon, everyone knows nothing will stop a Buck knife!

I heard djines once also slayed a real bigfoot! I know you do put the hurt on some big hogs and piles and piles of them! Could'nt believe those piles of hogs you used to post on the texas hunting forum.

This. I can't seem to care about the 30 Blackout. I just don't see where it is useful compared to the 6.8 or the 6x45.

kwg

Man, those hogs can really soak up misses!
Have you tried missing them with a 50 Beowulf?

Just kidding. I'm still laughing about your killer hog. Laughing too hard to hit anything myself!

LOL, thats so funny.

I don't ever tell folks I've killed a few over 300, none over 400 though, with my 22 pistol.
And I sure don't tell folks about killing big SOBs with arrows....

Beat me to it, was about to suggest the beowulf next.

But I'm set here, if D ever invites me up, I do have a 50 bmg in the vault. I know, its on the light side, but its as big as I have at the moment.

fish - ahh yes. the old thf. that's when i shot a younger man's gun and could actually hit stuff with it. you kinda cheated though. since you already knew me, you already knew i'm full of crap.

barry - misses?? really?? the dirt you see exploding behind the hogs is from pass throughs. or there may have been someone else shooting my gun like in this vid...



rost - i think we would make a good team. 50bmg is a wise choice.

I can't imagine all the lead slinging over countryside that y'all haven't hit something besides a pig. Not that you've hit that many pigs but I'm surprised the pivots haven't sprung a leak or two...