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I recently passed on buying some .308" 168 matchkings because they were obviously pulled with a pliers. The guy didn't want much for them but I figured
A- they wouldn't be accurate
B- they may harm my barrel.
Was I right in my assumptions?
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Ha ha.... I wouldn't trust them..... Probably pulled something like this? : ![[Linked Image]](http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x401/chiefbsa/011-9.jpg)
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Oracle
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Don't think it would harm the barrel,could just use the bullets for plinking.
Life Member SCI
Life Member DSC
Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell
Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
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Don't waste your time as inexpensive as some bullets are in bulk...
"Supernatural divinities are the primitive's answer to why the sun goes down at night..."
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free may be ok, otherwise a waste of powder. been there done that.
the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Don't think it would harm the barrel,could just use the bullets for plinking. Some guys have a hard enough time shooting perfect bullets, let alone fu cked up ones from the start... 
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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I remember an article a while back by a gun writer (Wayne van Zwoll?) in which he deliberately disfigured bullets. Cutting off the tips with wire cutters. From the pictures some of the tips were uneven some oval in cross section. They shot surprisingly well, about 1.25-1.5" IIRC.
If the bullet below the caliber ogive is not damaged they should shoot OK, not match grade, but good enough for hunting.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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That's WVZ though. He can do anything. Along with being a prolific writer, he's also a damn good hunter and marksman... 
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Campfire Ranger
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Can't imagine what can be wrong with cheap SMKs; if the bearing surface isn't jacked nothing detectable will be at issue inside a couple hundred (probably several hundred) yards.
In the past I've picked up these deals, pair em with hard used brass & propellant I've decided never to buy again and hitting an area hayfield where I can get 400 yds and smack steel and (oh boy I hope Alamosa doesn't see this!!) water-filled recyclables.
Any reason to pop a cap is a good one I just don't get people but I'd love to know who has em as I'll happily buy em!
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Don't think it would harm the barrel,could just use the bullets for plinking. Some guys have a hard enough time shooting perfect bullets, let alone fu cked up ones from the start... True,however,it just might be the opposite. 
Life Member SCI
Life Member DSC
Member New Mexico Shooting Sports Association
Take your responsibilities seriously, never yourself-Ken Howell
Proper bullet placement + sufficient penetration = quick, clean kill. Finn Aagard
Ken
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Campfire Regular
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Bullets I've pulled with pliers ended up pretty mangled. The pliers were hard to get a grip on them with and had to put in a hefty dent and I couldn't see wasting my time.
Bullets I've pulled with a RCBS collet puller were slightly marked up but shot just as well.
"Supernatural divinities are the primitive's answer to why the sun goes down at night..."
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Campfire Outfitter
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I have pulled a bunch and could not tell they had a problem on target.
I use a special pair of wire cutter cutters and my rockchucker press.
Even some for a 22 hornet and they still shoot one hole groups.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Don't waste your time as inexpensive as some bullets are in bulk... free may be ok, otherwise a waste of powder. been there done that. Them thar's my cinnaments, zactly. Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Don't waste your time as inexpensive as some bullets are in bulk... free may be ok, otherwise a waste of powder. been there done that. I would disagree, cheap bullets are great for plinking (who cares if you miss a tin can or clay pigeon), fire forming, breaking in a barrel, fire lapping, playing around with reduced loads or even hunting varmints. I think that any trigger time is a good time so never a waste of powder.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Ha ha.... I wouldn't trust them..... Probably pulled something like this? : You mean that's not how you're supposed to do it?
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Shoot them of you want. Mild loads with them will give fair accuracy and won't hurt a thing. In my miss spent youth, I often salvaged bullets by pulling them in my press with side cutter pliers. Lots of bullets had cannulures you could grab with the side cutters with no apparent damage.
My biggest fear is when I die my wife will sell my guns for what I told her they cost....
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I personally won't use seconds, sure as hell wouldn't use bullets pulled with plier
A Doe walks out of the woods today and says, that is the last time I'm going to do that for Two Bucks.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Nosler seconds are the cat's meow.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Pulled lots of bullets over the years, using a hammer puller, broken several them too. Always got some deformed tips that I trimmed them up with a filet knife or side cutter and kept for Zeroing a rifle with at 25 or 50 yards. Later used them on hogs under a feeder or for shots under 100-150 yards on game, and never had a problem with penetration, accuracy or with jacket seperation in a Cup & Core bullet.
Bought my 1st Nosler Blems in 180 gr 30 cal 1st Gen BTips in a cellophane bag with a colored folded paper label stapled over the end of the bag that had been hand stamped or xeroxed with the info, for ummm $6 a bag + a little freight or even free freight one time for a bigger buy .... ran those 1st 180's in a 300WMg and never have thought they were the problem with my shooting skills on paper....and none of the critters ever said a word one way or another about them.
Ron
TIME FOR TERM LIMITS !!!! Politicians are just like diapers, they need to be changed often and regularly for the same reason...Robin Williams.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Nosler seconds are the cat's meow. They are the best thing going right now. I'm glad some snobs like my left handed buddy doesn't buy them... . Saves more for us, that do like them.. 
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Yeah ! I would not equate 'seconds' to
bullets pulled w/piers.
Bullets recovered with inertia pullers are NOT damaged nearly like using 'pliers'.
I've used collet pullers for years and there is little/no damage to the bullet.
Also 'pliers' and sidecutters aren't the same in my book.
Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Nosler seconds are the cat's meow. No they suck and no one in their right mind shoot think about buying them! I personally won't use seconds, sure as hell wouldn't use bullets pulled with plier Yeah that's more like it! Seconds are a danger to the shooter and shot blatant disrespect to the game hunter firsts only should be used. (Cuz I want more for myself )
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Campfire Outfitter
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Like Billy Idol said: "More, more, more..."
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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free may be ok, otherwise a waste of powder. been there done that. Even if the bullets are free, you are wasting powder primers and time. Skip this bargain!
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Campfire Outfitter
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...Even if the bullets are free, you are wasting powder primers and time. Skip this bargain! This. Why bottom feed?
"There's more to optics than meets the eye."--anon
"...most of us would be better off losing half a pound around the waist than half a pound on our rifle."--dhg
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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Campfire Ranger
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Think about it... if you have to ask if something is a good deal or a good idea, then it probably ain't.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Is asking if things are a good idea, a good idea?
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Campfire Outfitter
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Think about it... if you have to ask if something is a good deal or a good idea, then it probably ain't. Yeah. Makes sense.
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Campfire Tracker
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Like Billy Idol said: "More, more, more..." Also Andra True Connection.  I have a friend that purchased a lot of Government Surplus. He got a 55 gal. barrel full of 5.56 bullets that had been ran through a machine to make them unfit for loading. They had dings and gouges and were unround. There was some carbide bullet dies in the mix and he just had to try. He ran some of them through the carbide dies and loaded up a box. I was quite impressed with the accuracy they produced. IIRC, the largest group was around 2" and the smallest right at an inch. I wouldn't want to be caught loading them in MY magazine but, his experiment really opened my eyes.
Shew me thy ways, O LORD: teach me thy paths.
"there are few better cartridges on Earth than the 7 x 57mm Mauser"
"the .30 Springfield is light, accurate, penetrating, and has surprising stopping power"
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I ran a test doing just this some years back. IIRC, I loaded 100 rounds of .223 with a known accurate load. I puled 30 of them with an inertia puller, 30 with a collett puller, and 30 with a pair of pliers. They were disfigured in pretty much that order: the intertia-pulled were like new, the collet-pulled had small longitudinal marks/grooves, and the pliers-pulled had larger horizontal grooves. Some were visibly out of round, too.
I re-neck-sized the cases I had pulled, put the same charges back in and re-seated the bullets.
At the range, the 10 unpulled rounds made a lovely little group. The intertia-pulled made an almost identical average group (3 groups of 10). The collet-pulled again made almost identical groups. And the ugly pliers-pulled bullets? Ditto. I saw NO significant difference in group size.
I believe that as long as the bases of the bullets are undamaged, slight damage to the sides of the bullets merely "irons out" in the rifling as the bullet shortens and obturates under gas pressure.
Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.
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Campfire Ranger
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Rocky.....well...since YOU say it, I'd come 'nearer' believing it. I really wouldn't have thot the disfigured rounds would have nearly the same performance. I certainly have shot bullets pulled w/collet & inertia pullers. The few I've pulled and damaged by whatever means I just chunked. It hasn't been that many tho. Thanks Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Campfire Outfitter
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That's science, thanks Rocky.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Campfire Outfitter
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This is how I have done it forever.....no issues in re-use whatsoever https://youtu.be/oOGWt4o9iEs
Maker of the Frankenstud Sling Keeper
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I ran a test doing just this some years back. IIRC, I loaded 100 rounds of .223 with a known accurate load. I puled 30 of them with an inertia puller, 30 with a collett puller, and 30 with a pair of pliers. They were disfigured in pretty much that order: the intertia-pulled were like new, the collet-pulled had small longitudinal marks/grooves, and the pliers-pulled had larger horizontal grooves. Some were visibly out of round, too.
I re-neck-sized the cases I had pulled, put the same charges back in and re-seated the bullets.
At the range, the 10 unpulled rounds made a lovely little group. The intertia-pulled made an almost identical average group (3 groups of 10). The collet-pulled again made almost identical groups. And the ugly pliers-pulled bullets? Ditto. I saw NO significant difference in group size.
I believe that as long as the bases of the bullets are undamaged, slight damage to the sides of the bullets merely "irons out" in the rifling as the bullet shortens and obturates under gas pressure.
This! I've pulled many with my press and pliers. I used them initially to fire form AK brass, and I found them to be plenty accurate, even the ones that slipped a bit. Unless someone has actually shot some, you have no basis to chime in. Bullets conform to the bore long before any significant pressures have churned up and do get ironed out.
Hunt with Class and Classics
Religion: A founder of The Church of Spray and Pray
Acquit v. t. To render a judgment in a murder case in San Francisco... EQUAL, adj. As bad as something else. Ambrose Bierce “The Devil's Dictionary”
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I recently passed on buying some .308" 168 matchkings because they were obviously pulled with a pliers. The guy didn't want much for them but I figured
A- they wouldn't be accurate
B- they may harm my barrel.
Was I right in my assumptions? I read a test quite a while back where bullets had the tips deformed in many ways from flattening them to cutting them completely off. Then they also deformed the bases on other bullets and tested those, also. The bullets with the tips deformed shot about normally at 100 yards. I believe they lost accuracy past that point, but not rapidly. The bullets with the bases deformed lost a lot of accuracy at 100 and much more and rapidly past that. This may not exactly answer the question but should give you an idea that the tip of the bullet is not nearly as critical as the base.
We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?
Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
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I've bought and shot Sierra seconds that shot better than the boxed, identical SKU stuff.
I haven't had the same luck with those in .224", but the .308s were superb.
You can roll a turd in peanuts, dip it in chocolate, and it still ain't no damn Baby Ruth.
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