Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only 416 Rigby

Having not shot my new 416 Rigby at game, I have a couple of questions:

1. 350 grain Barnes TSX - At what velocity do these bullets perform best?

2. My rifle is a Ruger Magnum, LNIB, it seems to me that this cartridge and rifle combination could be loaded to near 416 Weatherby velocity. I'm sure this comment will cause a lot of negative comments and there's little use in asking for none. But what are your top loads with the Rigby?

3. I have quite a few 400 grain solids and 350 grain Barnes. I plan on using hard cast bullets loaded to approximate 2,000 fps for white tail. I think 5744 might be a good powder for such, anyone have favorite loads for these?

4. Any other suggested bullets/loads?

Thanks in advance.

When I had mine,I loaded it to the original 410 gr velocities of 2370 fps. The few jackrabbits shot with it didn't complain about not enough speed.

Been awhile so I do not remember the powder or charges,but it was a bunch per cartridge.

Bugger,

I have no idea at what velocity the 350 TSX performs best, and probably nobody else does either, because there's really no upper limit for monolithics. At the other end, a good general rule for any expanding big game bullet is a minimum velocity close to 2000 fps.

Yes, the .416 Rigby can be safely handloaded to very close to .416 Weatherby velocity, because powder capacity is very similar. I ran some experiments with my 25-inch barreled CZ several years ago, using some formulas for calculating internal ballistics, and got just under 2800 fps with 350-grain bullets and around 2650 with 400's. Those results were published in HANDLOADER and, later, in my BIG BOOK OF GUN GACK.

The formula for working up reduced loads with 5744 is:
1) Fill a case with 5744 to approximately where the base of the bullet would be.
2) Weigh that powder charge, then use 40% of that as a starting load.
3) Consider 48% maximum with cast bullets, and 60-65% maximum with jacketed bullets.

Ah, I do have the Gack book. Thanks for the comments.
I used my '375H&H AI' on prairie dogs, very good penetration, not sure about expansion. Need something bigger on my pesky coyotes. Thanks again.

1. They appear to perform best when you shoot accurately. (Mine likes 2500 fps with H4831 SC.)
2. I don't do "top loads".
3. My 350ish cast loads use IMR 4198. 5744 is less accurate; however, I got delayed ignition in warm weather with 4198 and not with 5744.
4. Put ~ 90 grains IMR 4831 behind 400-grain solid or ~ 100 grains H4831 behind a 410-grain Woodleigh. Crimp at a cannelure or driving band with a full load to keep recoil moving the bullet around. That said, crimping can buckle the shoulder of VERY expensive brass. And, long bearing surfaces of SWIFT's, RHINO's, etc. may preclude the need to crimp.

Ive ran 350 Xs past 2700 fps. In my CZ (2,740).

My "hottest" load with Nosler 400gr. Partitions show 2,698 in my ledger for an average of 5 shots. with RL-25 and Fed. 215s.

My only cast load has been fired over 100 times and consists of a 375 LBT-LFN GC, 45 grs. IMR 4198, 13 grs Dacron and a std WLR cap for 1800 fps and 3/4 3 shot groups.

All loads used Norma or B.E.L.L. cases.

Dies matter and Ive had great results with RCBS dies. The Hornadys that came with the gun were horrible for neck tension and the seater was not favorable for the cast loads.

Yikes, I have Hornady Dies.

I suspect that those shot at 2700+fps would shoot close to '06 180 grain trajectory wise for 300 yards or so. Not planning on shooting those bullets that far unless at rocks on a hillside (nowhere close to civilization). I do like to practice with full power loads and with cast bullets. Thanks.

There's a couple of cartridges I shoot past reloading book recommendations. 7x57 and 30-06 -- but it is nice to know what the limits are though.

Bugger,

As I'm sure you know, the .416 Rigby's one of the old British cartridges designed with excess case capacity so lower-pressure loads could be used, due to early Cordite being so heat-sensitive. The oversized case allowed plenty of velocity to be reached without the danger of cases sticking in the chamber in tropical climates.

Consequently original ballistics can be achieved at very low pressures with modern powders. The SAAMI standards are the original 2370 fps for 400-410 grain bullets at 52,000 PSI, exactly the same pressure as the .444 Marlin. So there's room for safe experimentation at under the 62-65,000 PSI of modern .416's like the Ruger and Remington.

Im hoping your dies do not cause you grief, but the Hornady seater stem also contains the crimping shoulder; my bullets sized at a nominal .417 with the Hornady dies along with the sizing dies sizing the neck too much caused issues with even heat treated cast bullets.

Just something to be aware of.

the Barnes perform best above 2000 fps so run them as fast as you want.

Yes the rigby can be loaded almost equal to the weatherby. It's up to you what you decide is a good balance of velocity vs recoil. If you load to 416 remington specs you can use a ton of different powders to get there.

I'm using the remington version of 416 so I don't have any loads, but you should be able to get all the performance you want with lower pressures in the rigby.

Well the 416 Rigby Ruger Magnum rifle has the same stock dimensions that I don't like on the Ruger 77's. Per a very good answer in the Gunsmithing forum regarding stock replacement etc. I've decided to attempt to sell the rifle. It comes with the original box, and material that Ruger included. Also have the Hornady dies, and 2 boxes of brass. I'm selling this rifle below my cost and below what can be bought on GunBroker. If anyone would happen to like the Ruger stock design this would be a good chance to acquire a Ruger Magnum action rifle. My loss, your gain. If interested send a pm also I have it on the classifieds here.
If you don't like the Ruger stock design, beware a replacement stock is more than what I'm asking for the rifle.

I have hunted Africa extensively with my Dakota 76 in .416 Rigby, using factory loads exclusively. While I prefer my .470 for elephant and DG followups due to it's handling qualities and fast second shot, my .416 Rigby has performed splendidly on everything from Klipspringer to Cape Buffalo.

Sighted in dead on at 100 yards, it is slightly high at 50 yards and 3.5" low at 200 yards.

Based on my personal experience in the field, I see no reason to "hot rod" it. 400 grains at ~ 2,370 fps has proven itself over the course of 100 years of African hunting. Recoil is tolerable and it will kill anything that walks the face of the earth. There is no need to "make it better". If you want .416 Weatherby ballistics, then buy a .416 Weatherby, though for the life of me I can't see why one would be needed.

The Ruger Rigby feels better than the Ruger 7mm RM. I have several 338's, a 375 H&H AI and now the rigby that all feel better than that 7mm.
I've restocked the 7mm and now all is better.
I am shooting 400 grain solids with 90 grains IMR4451 in the Rigby. Nice rifle. I think that bullet is travelung in the 2300's.

My good bud's .416 Rigby is a Ruger, no longer made.

He says he gets a lot of attention at the range when he touches it off...

He's the one planning an African Buff hunt.

DF

But it's nice to know limits. I had to know where GM had set the high speed cut out too. That was found out be experimentation.

Have a CZ in 416 Rigby with the European stock. Does anybody make a replacement with a straight comb? Also don't care much for the set trigger. Other than that it's a fine rifle that shoots like a house a fire.

I have a CZ550 in .375 H&H, and didn't care much for the set trigger either so I adjusted it out and had forgotten about it. I'm guessing you know you can do that?

I've noticed that few Americans like set triggers. Maybe it's because we don't have any familiarity with them.

I started using set triggers at age 14 (Now nearly 70), and I shoot much better with the sets. It was one of the things I liked regarding the CZ 550s I had, 416 and 375.

Regarding souping up the Rigby, I was under the impression that Rigby brass was far thinner and it wasn't a great idea, accordingly.

I had a lot of experience with the Rigby years back and shot coyotes here on my small farm with both CZs and a Ruger RSM with my reloads and 350gr Speers at 2,575 FPS. I had a CZ hogback model and an American. I actually liked the hogback better for me; it just fit me better. I didn't like the Ruger stock much, but I loved the rifle otherwise. The buffalo in my avatar was taken with a CZ550 Rigby hogback.

After shooting considerable 416 Rigby ammo, factory and reloads, I am a bit curious why anyone would want to make it hammer their shoulder and brains any more than with traditional loads?

You must be young and tough.

Have fun with a great rifle in a Classic round.

You can get a straight stock from the cz store. That will do a lot to handle the recoil properly.

https://shop.cz-usa.com/cz-products/rifles/stocks/magnum-centerfire

The trigger is adjustable both set and unset. You should be able to get down to a crisp, no creep, 2 pounds, unset.

Last week I was shooting my C 550 in 416 Rigby. I needed to sight in my new old Leupold 3x I put on it. The Rifle shot great and the recoil not bad with a KDF on it My rifle is fully bedded and I was shooting an old hand load. If any one is interested I have 100 new Norma brass that I will sell for 2.00 each for the 100 or to split into 50 round bags, plus shipping.
Randy

Orion03,

You might be able to order an American stock from CZ, but it's also relatively easy to remodel the Euro-style "humpback" stock. That's exactly what I did with mine 15 years ago, rasping off the hump and also cutting off some of the long Schnabel forend. (I usually like Schnabels but not in this particular instance.) I rasped down the comb until the rifle's sights pointed right where I looked, and after sanding the comb and forend tip smooth it turned out spar varnish matched the factory finish perfectly.

If you adjust the primary (unset) pull of the trigger to around 3-4 pounds, the set feature disappears. But Timney also makes an excellent replacement trigger.

Bruce,

None of the present commercial .416 Rigby Federal or Norma brass I've used is "lighter" than, say, .416 Weatherby brass. The case capacity is just slightly less than the .416 Weatherby, and loading the Rigby up to near Weatherby velocities didn't make extraction sticky, expand primers pockets, or cause any other problems except, of course, more recoil. I didn't find it too bad, but all the three buffalo I've taken with my CZ were taken with standard velocity loads, and they worked just fine--as they should.

NOW you Tell me!

Gotta add one more thing about my Ruger. Although it came with rings and I probably have a good scope I won't be putting a scope on this rifle. The stock is perfect with the factory sights. I don't like my face off the stock and think that shooting that way would effect the felt recoil and eventually make me shy away from shooting the rifle. If I were to put a scope on the rifle I'd build up the stock was that I could get a firm rest for my cheek.
After PMing a great writer I got some advice about that on my other 77. I built up that stock so that I could get a good rest for my cheek and I eventually replaced that stock. Now that 7mm RM shoots fine without pain.

I'm still shooting those solids at around 2300+. No issue with recoil. And I'm old, with bersitus and arthritis.

But I think knowing the limits is a good thing even if you don't go that far.

I loaded the 350 gr TSX's to 2700 fps in my Rigby with RL-22, let me know if you want to drive em that hard and I'll go dig up my old load book, my rifle was a RSM too.

Bruce, I did tell you! Go back and reread the chapter in Gun Gack....

Greatly appreciate the info on the stock and trigger of my CZ. Love that rifle and cartridge. Have only shot whitetails with it. Works great with 400gr. soft point Woodleighs as long as you shoot them broadside "behind the shoulder"! Friends give me grief.

Your poor unadventurous friends!

I will if I can find my copy.


I know...I know...

Well, the third printing did just show up here, if you can't find your "old" copy.... :-)

I keep threatening to buy a Ruger .416 #1, but the barrels are too heavy IMO, the "D" contour. Tempted at some point to get a .375 (the "C" contour) and rebore it to .416

Another way to lighten the barrel on the Ruger 416 Rigby RSM is to rebore it and rechamber it to 450 Rigby.

Just had one done and getting ready to develop some loads. Reloading data is pretty slim, though!

McMillan, AHR and Manners make big CZ stocks.

The postmortem on a 150lb hog shot in the neck with a 300gr TSX at nearly 3000fps MV is something to behold.

Looking through old Rifle magazines I found a treasure.

Al Miller writes about the Ruger 416 Rigby. What a perfect article for 416 Rigby owners, especially Ruger 416 Rigby owners.

Al has 33 loads listed. From the 300 Grain to 400 grain. Many of his groups (3 shot) were under an inch at I believe 100 yards. He recommended a 1.5x5 Leupold scope by the way.

Well at accuracy like that, I've got another PD rifle.

September-October 1990 no. 131

Did you convert the 416 you bought from my dad?

These folks make a specialty out of upgrading the CZ. http://americanhuntingrifles.com/?page_id=221

They can modify your stock or put a new one on. Their full house upgrade makes for a very nice rifle indeed.