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I have a beuatiful Spainish SxS sidelock shotgun that I enjoy shooting EXCEPT that it in recoil it brutalizes my middle finger against the trigger guard. This is the only shotgun I own that does that. None of my other O/U or SxS are an issue.

Some suggested it was the length of pull, but it seems to mount like the others. It has a relatively slim PG grip, and it has been suggested that is the culprit.

Anybody else run across this phenomena?

I've seen some using a rubber device behind the trigger guard to soften the blow. May want to check into it.

DF

When I was about 10, I used to shoot trap with a Nobel 12 gauge. By station 2 I had a bloody nose. My thumb would come back upon recoil and smash my nose on every shot.

A member of my gun club but that was due to a completely ill fitting borrowed gun.

Have you measured the LOP? Double or single trigger? How about distance between butt and rear of TG?

If not LOP, another parameter to sort out: is the rear of the TG curved different?

If nothing else, you could try a thin leather shooting glove.

What loads are you shooting?

In general, lighter European doubles are designed around lighter loads than Americans typically shoot, both in shot load and velocity. In general we're convinced that more and faster shot kill "better," in part because we're primarily rifle shooters. But lighter European (and British) 12-gauge doubles are often designed around an ounce (or slightly more) of shot at around 1150 fps, which actually will kill gamebirds quite neatly if the gun's pointed right. We tend to use more shot at higher velocities, which increases recoil noticeably. Even the standard American trap load, which many hunters consider barely adequate for smaller birds, uses 1-1/8 ounce of shot at around 1250 fps.

Twenty years I went to Argentina to help field-test some new non-toxic waterfowl loads from Federal, but we also did a lot of dove and other upland shooting with lead loads. Only a small portion of the lead loads Federal brought down were light-recoiling enough for all-day dove shooting. The rest were trap loads, which one of our group (a Federal guy) soon started calling "slobber-knockers," because they kicked too hard in light bird guns. We finished the dove and partridge shooting with locally-made lighter loads, which worked fine and didn't knock the slobber our of us.

But if the knuckle-busting problem exists even with light loads, some companies sell an angled spacer that fits behind the trigger guard. This doesn't buffer the finger behind the guard as much as allow it to slide along the angle, so the relatively flat rear of the trigger guard doesn't whack the finger. There are models specifically designed for straight-grip guns.

hatri, my grandfather had a Fox 12 ga. I still have it.. But the trigger guard is wrapped at the back with steel wool.. I ask him about it and he said it kicked his middle finger.. He loaned it to one of my uncles to hunt fox with one winter.. When it came back, my uncle had wrapped the steel wool around it and the knuckle busting problem was over.. I still have the gun and rarely shoot it, but that solved the trouble..

One other question: I'm guessing it has two triggers. Do any of your other doubles have two triggers?

I'm not trying to be a smart ass, but IMO life is too short to fugk around with a shotgun that doesn't fit or is painful to shoot.




Travis

Beretta sells this one



http://www.berettausa.com/en-us/trigger-guard-buffer/e00696/

I have a German 16 gauge "guild gun" (thin wrist, straight grip) with an abnormally short length of pull although drop at heel and comb are otherwise about right. It will bruise my middle finger as well as my cheek unless I slip on a thick leather recoil pad to seriously lengthen length of pull and then both problems go away.

All my handloaded shot cartridges are stuffed with what most American gunners would consider to be light loads. One ounce 12's (and often 7/8 ounce), 7/8 ounce 16's (and often 3/4 ounce), 3/4 ounce 20's and 28's (sometimes 5/8 ounce)- all at minimal target velocities. Benefit: my scores went up (less subconscious brutalization of my nervous system), live birds are just as dead, and significant cost savings are realized. What's not to like? I haven't bought a box of factory "high brass" loads in well over a decade, and I have never purchased 3", or god forbid, 3½" magnum loads. The loads described suffice to kill tough ringnecks, ducks, and geese (the latter loads built with ITX, Nice Shot, or Bismuth). The gunning public has been brainwashed so effectively that such a practice is deemed heretical. Oh well.

Mule Deer asked an important question on the loads you're using. I spent week before last bird hunting in Montana, and from the empties I was finding, you would think the Pterodactyls were flushing out of the heavy cover. (There are also Pterodactyls along some Minnesota grouse trails.)

The "finger-guard" that John mentioned is pretty common on straight grip doubles. Just off the top of my head, Galazan's is one vendor; I'm sure there are others. Probably the cheapest solution to your problem.

The answer is yes and yes.

As to loads, the first day on a pheasant hunt in SD, I used 3" 1 5/8 field loads. After a day of that, I went back to 2 3/4",which was better.

I was wondering because 2-trigger doubles often require the shooter to reach a little further for the front trigger than with a single-trigger gun. This causes many shooters to shift their trigger hand too far forward, though in a well-designed double that usually isn't necessary. Of course, "hand geometry" varies from shooter to shooter as well.

I just had an interesting experience while test-shooting a new model of .300 magnum. The pistol grip was a little shorter/tighter than I prefer, even though my hands and fingers are probably a little shorter than average. The bolt handle was also swept back, and the bolt knob sharply checkered. On the first shot the knob scraped a half-inch of skin from the top of the first joint on my trigger finger. Putting on a thin leather shooting glove solved the problem--that day, anyway. On the rifle's second trip to the range I of course forgot to put the glove on, and the bolt knob ripped the scab off!

Hatari, my single trigger Beretta 686 does something similar. Not the middle finger, but my trigger finger rubs on the side.
It has the same LOP of a Baikal IZH27 - but the difference is in the length of the pistol grip - ie grip to trigger.
The Beretta has a shorter length, so finger is closer to the trigger and ends up meeting the trigger closer to the joint instead the pad. Some whitting, bondo palmswell and sandpaper on a beater stock fixed that just fine... Now I need to get a duplicate one.
Of course you could try adding some palmswell with plasticine (temporary) and see if it makes a difference. Lighter loads as suggested will also recoil much less of course.

This device did help my son with the same issue on his L.C. Smith 12 ga. The original owner had built up tape in the same spot.

Ouch! I tried to use some of those in my Citori a few years back. After a half box or so, I started flinching and went back to my normal 1 1/4 oz loads. Much better!

Jerry

My 870 12ga hits my middle finger pretty hard with 3" turkey loads. I bought camp Mechanix gloves with knuckle guards and they work well. There are some with no finger tips.
http://www.mechanix.com/m-pact-fingerless

I wear this type turkey hunting.
http://www.mechanix.com/tactical/multicam-m-pact