Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles 25-06 or 7mm-08? Or??

I'm trying to decide between these two calibers. Would like it to be a reasonable light rifle for high country mule deer although it would be pressed into service with whitetails as well. AND, it might well be used by an aspiring teenage hunter as well. For discussion sake, I already have a 7mm Rem mag.

I'm thinking about possibly going with a 20" barrel (Howa Ranchland) to save size and weight. If I think the stock is too heavy, might switch to a lighter one but I kinda like the feel of their overmolded stock. Or maybe I'll consider a Tikka Lite Stainless (22" barrel). Is there a downside to a 20" barrel? I have heard a few comments that the 25-06 gets pretty loud with the short tube. How about ballistics? I've also heard that the 25-06 needs a longer barrel to take advantage of all that powder behind it. I'm no ballistics expert so hoping someone here can give some input

Regarding these two calibers, could either be a responsible consideration for elk? Are they both more than adequate for a rutting mule deer buck? Any other thoughts that would sway my decision? I've thought about the 270 but concerned that it might be a bit much for a young shooter and start to overlap my 7mm Rem Mag.

Thanks for any thoughts you may have!

Short answer.....the Tikka in 7-08.

There is a dude on another forum that loves to post about the virtues of the 7-08. And he has several pics of elk and deer dropped out to considerable ranges (500+ yards). Anyway, of the two you listed, I would definitely go with the 7-08.

I don't think a 25-06 would be well suited for a 20" barrel. Maybe a 22", but I think 24" is appropriate. The 25-06 is however an excellent cartridge.

The downside of a 20" barrel is going to be noise. Especially if you have a young hunter who might forget hearing protection, the noise will cause more permanent damage then one with a longer barrel.

I have both and like each differently. I would not hesitate to shoot an elk with either at respectable ranges. However, with what you propose with the shorter barrel, the 7mm-08 is the better choice. A 25-06 will be loud and not as efficient with a 20 inch barrel. Stoke the 7mm-08 with a decent bullet and hunt in confidence.

Allow me to be the first: .270 WCF, in a Tikka if you absolutely must.

A 25-06 won't do anything a 243 won't do as just well. A 7-08 will do everything the 7mm mag will do, just at slightly reduced ranges.

7-08 or 270 in a Tikka. You won't notice much difference.

Between those two choices, a 7/08.

I'd like the heavier 7mm bullets over the 25's for just about anything from rutting mule deer to the elk.

This ^. I am a 25/06 fan but with the barrel length you want, this is the way to go.

The Howa Ranchland is only made on a short action and therefore isn't available in .25-06. Problem solved.

I like my 25-06's! But to answer your question.

7mm-08.


As an added benefit, you already have 7mm bullets, correct?

I'm that dude.

So far, three bulls with three shots. Farthest was 346 yards, biggest was 225 yards.

One antelope, one shot.

Buncha deer, one shot each. Farthest was 541 yards.

140 Partitions, except for the biggest bull, that was a 140 AB. 2873 fps for the Partitions, 2850 fps for the AB.




P

This. The rifle will kill out to the point where velocity slows below the design minimum for the bullet -- and maybe then some.

If a 20 inch tube is a must, the 25-06 is wasted on noise.

The only reason I can see for a 7 Mag (not the OPs question, I know) is in a rifle twisted to support the 180 Bergers. That will push the capability envelope out past the 7mm 08.

I'm trying to decide between the two as well...except for myself. I currently use a 25-06 ands it my do everything from coyotes up to elk/moose. My wife shoots a 7-08 and I'm kinda growing fond of it. So I was thinking of changing over to it as well....BUT

I don't see any factory varmit type stuff for it, which is available for the 25-06. I don't reload....anyone use it for coyotes?

I used a 25-06 for over thirty years and harvested tons of Deer with it. Loved it but I am now shooting a 7-08 and love it even more. Both are great cartridges but with the 20 inch bbl, go with the 7-08. My Daughter has a Tikka compact in 7-08 and besides the Deer she has taken with it it will shoot under and inch group with what ever you put in it.

Well the 7-08 is coming out on top (and kinda the direction I was leaning anyway). Now I just have to decide about 20 or 22" barrel. The Howa Ranchaland with the 20" barrel sure felt quite balanced in my hand but that was without a scope.

I'll repeat. There is no 20" barreled Howa .25-06.

There's a stainless Tikka in the classifieds. Mine does this with handloads.




My Superlite does this with the same load.







P

There's likely less than 2 ounces difference between the two lengths, so balance won't be skewered one way or the other.

Darn it. the one in the classifieds just sold.

Tikka - hands down.

The Howa Ranchland with the thin 20" barrel will not feel as balanced when it has a scope on it. The Tikka with the slightly longer barrel, and slightly heavier, barrel will have a better balance with a scope on it.

Another consideration, while Howa's group ok I have never seen an out of the box Howa group as well as out of the box Tikka.

drover

Drover, what do you think about the regular Howa 1500? Notwithstanding your thoughts on the Tikka's grouping. FWIW I am leaning toward the Tikka. Very clean lines. Everything seems to work well. Only thing that rubs me funny is the removable magazine. Seems like a problem waiting to happen. Maybe I'm wrong though.

The Howa is a heavy rifle, no way around it - there is a lot of weight in their receivers, add in a standard contour barrel and the weight jumps quickly. I cannot remember the exact weight but I had a Howa 1500 with the synthetic stock and with a Leupold 3-9 on it and if I recall correctly it was over 8 lbs. A Tikka set up the same way is nearer 7 lbs and much better balanced.

As far as the removable magazine I have never had a problem and cannot recall reading about any problems with them on here except for the occasional complaint about the 223 mags being a bit short with the heavy for caliber bullets .

Something else to think about - Howa rifles seem to fall into the category of "good hunting accuracy" which is not a bad thing, but take a look at the groups posted on the 'fire that Tikka's shoot.

drover

Drover, I'm with you. The Tikka certainly seemed like a bit more refined rifle. And for a couple of hundred dollars over the life of the rifle, seems worth it in spades.

I expect that you will be happy with a Tikka.

As far as caliber - my recommendation would be the 7/08. I bought one when it was first introduced in the 80's and have never found a reason to have any second thoughts about the decision. I have shot a few 25-06 rifles but have never warmed up to them, they seemed to have more recoil and muzzle blast than I like and IMO are not as versatile as the 7/08.

If you have a Sportsmans Warehouse near you they have had the original T-3's on sale, if you have a FFL that will receive for you Whittaker Guns has excellent service and has been having a sale on them also. Europtics has them on sale too but I have never dealt with them but their prices look good.


drover

You can get a brand spanking new Tikka T3X Lite Stainless from Whittakers for $620 minus shipping. Absolutely can't be beat and you will not deal with better folks.

7mm08 with the 20" and Id go Tikka or a model 7.



You saving pelts ?? Cheapo PPU kills em just as dead if ya arent. No need for a varmit round

Nope I don't save them, just want a good all round rifle. I kind of like the shorter package the 7-08 finnlight is....

Then I wouldnt worry about finding varmit rounds in either caliber. PPU is my "off season" ammo because its cheap and Im not saving pelts either so large exit wounds dont bother me. Cant tell ya how many varmits ive taken using it. Kills em just as dead as the higher cost varmit rounds.

Barnes, Federal, Hornady and Nosler all load a 120g factory load that should be awesome on varmints.

120 BT in a stainless T3





Same load in a Superlite. Had a good group going until I pulled the one on the right.








P

The 7-08 is the absolute perfect cartridge for deer. The Tikka is great but a minor gripe is that it doesn't have a true short action.

In the wake of easily duplicated ballistics from many other offerings, these statements of perfection above all others, are amusing and not to be taken seriously.

The 7/08 is nothing more than a picket in a fence of cartridge performance. That's all.

You hit the nail on the head. You've probably built more picket fences than you care to admit too Bob...

bsa: Yes I have....which is why I find damned little "perfection" in anything.

People get delusional about rifle cartridges.

High country mule deer = Creed Kimber Montana

Somebody had to say it. (grin)

I know I'm the semi-new (was on the fire a few years ago but couldn't even remember my name user name on here...lol), but as I enjoy reading all the replies on threads like these, I can't help but say that Mr. Bob is dead on. Pieces of paper with great groups are pleasing to the eye. Ballistic charts are interesting to look at. Most of us have our favorite rifle based on many different things. But the "perfect" caliber exists only in the mind of each of us. If it was an objective choice, every deer hunter who pursued the perfect caliber/rifle combination would use the same caliber in "X" rifle. In the end, most of us go by experience and personal likes and dislikes.

Nevertheless, it is dead solid perfect in the middle of that picket fence regardless of what any snarky Yankee might say about it.

Not bad for elk, either.

I hear the gripe about short action and it puzzles me. What's the difference? Half an inch? Who cares?




P

Bet I was using a 7/08 before you were in diapers......I know I was using one before you developed an IQ......

So where precisely does it sit in the lineup? Would that be the lineup of SA standard cartridges, short fat belted cartridge, standard cartridges? belted small bore magnum cartridges?

What would be to the right and left of it in that picket fence?

What a joke. You guys sure do get all wound up over brass bottles that hold powder don't you?

Like I said....people get delusional. And emotional LOL!

Especially [bleep] from the South.Would that be Tex- ass? Huh?

Notice how you immediately attacked me personally because i think your favorite cartridge is absolutely nothing to get excited about? That burns your ass because you know Im right doesn't it?

I suspect you don't have enough experience with anything to comment.... but if you do suppose you tell us the difference between the 7/08 and the 280, 284, 270, 7x57. 6.5x55,6.5 Creed, 7 Rem Mag and a few others in terms of ow they kill animals?

C'mon ....tell me? I'm all ears.

You can't and you know it. What a joke.

You're the one who basically calls someone a dumbass for merely expressing an opinion. And my opinion, which is undoubtedly more worthwhile than any you might express on practically any subject is that as a balance of performance, recoil, action length, and typical rifle weight and length, the 7-08 is damned near perfect. That doesn't mean that any there aren't lots of others that work really well, or even better, one being perfect doesn't mean another isn't either. For instance, just because Larry Bird was great, doesn't mean that MJ was not great too.

So take your snarky Yankee ass and STFU.

ANY headstamp can be fed wrong and spun wrong.
Inside 100yds most will never know it.

Bob, true story...


When I was 13-16 years old I remember reading the cartridge trajectory charts in the annual Peterson's and Rifle Shooter(?) magazines.


I had it all figured out...grin


The 22-250 was the flattest and I already had one so a 7-08 was next best.

Local store didn't have one so I placed a WTB ad in the paper.

Old farmer called up and had a 788 that he'd sell. But of course in the mean time I had my eye on a fancy new 25-06 M70 Winlite.

Bought it and STUPIDLY traded it in a couple years a later on 300 Win mag.


Still wish I would have bought that 7-08.

Well, thanks to everyone for their thoughts. Plunked the money down on a Tikka T3x stainless lite in 7mm-08. Now to keep an eye out for some quality glass on after Christmas sale!

Good choice IMO.

drover

Sorry if it's been asked before, but do you reload?

And what's you budget on glass?




P

That's pretty funny right there.





P

You do like wise. Like I figured, you can't answer the question,which proves my point. Another stooge.

I learned a long time ago never trust, or listen much, to anyone with two first names. It shows they couldn't make up their minds about anything as simple as choosing a first name ......It's a southern "thing" LOL!

You and Pharmseller can do your mutual admiration circle jerk,and play rope a dope while you're both figuring this stuff out.He comes up with some of the dumbest threads I ever read.Mystified by a 160 AB that drops one MOA more than the tables said...now what could cause that?

Hilarious......keep reading those ballistic tables and looking for "advice". LOL!

You boys got a long ways to go.


BTW moron.....you made it personal because i don't see anything special about a 7/08. Got your panties in a wad. What a child...grow up.

that goes for PS as well. idiots.

You need to get over yourself. Your word is not the end all be all on any subject. I have no problem with you being wrong. It's America, you are free to disagree with me and be wrong all you want. But I do expect that even the other Yankees in your AO think you are an assshole.

I don't know if he's an a-hole, I just thought the "Yankee ass" comment was funny. He is a mite touchy, though.

And no offense, JoeBob, I don't admire you. I don't know you.

BobinNH should wait until he knows me better to insult me. Then he could do it properly.





P

OK, that right there is funny!

Thanks.

Why the hostility Bob?

A .270 Win or .280 Rem is your huckleberry. Mildish recoil, plenty of power out to 500 yards.


Ruger .280 Rem for $499. Have one and love it.
https://www.cdnnsports.com/280-hm77rp-22-syn.html?___SID=U

Got one of these .30-06 rifles for $499 for a future son-in-law. Love it too. 20" barrel.
https://www.cdnnsports.com/30-06-hm77rlfp-20-syn-ultra.html

That's okay. Only the weak seek the admiration of others.

Cheer up Bob. There are shytloads of dickheads on here but it's almost Christmas man ! God I do hate the 7mm-08 though. No good reason why but I never could stomach the dumpy little thing.

Must agree with Blackheart..

Just get a 270 Win

That is what Bob would have said..

When did the OP ask about 280s and 30-06s?

You considered that snarky?
What a joke.

Anyway, I like the 7mm-08 more than a little, but somehow get by with a bunch of different choices. All used in the same covers. .223AI, .22-250, 7mm-08, .280AI, .300Sav, .338Fed, .30-06, .300WM.

And could have made others work just as well.

The perfect Deer rifle is akin to the perfect women. Or man if you happen to be a huntress.

Wait, you said absolute perfect. Is it absolute with 120's, 140's, 150's, 175's? Is it absolute in a LW, middle weight, heavy weight? I like my women kinda middle weight, but could be content with a light heavy if she can get around and makes me laugh.

Am I being snarky?

You consider "snarky" to be pejorative enough to warrant much reaction? But then again, you are clearly a godless Yankee. I had to choose the "most" perfect bullet of all of the otherwise perfect bullets in the bestest little whitetail cartridge on earth, I'm most partial to the 154 grain Interlock, which is of course, a purely handloading affair. That said, there are no flies on the 139 grain pill.

God loves us all. Even you'll Rebs.

I like the 140 Barnes myself. Grabs them by the horns, or pussy during Doe time.

And have a wonderful Yankee Doodle Christmas. Feliz Navaida and all that.

I will and you too.

😉

I'm starting to get that warm fuzzy feeling and can almost hear the angels singing Kumbaya...lol. Hope everyone is having a blessed night.

Eddie

Good lord. This is whole yankee/reb thing is weird. Glad I am from a state that didn't exist until after the war between the states. Or the war of northern aggression. Or whatever else it is.

I started using the cartridge (7/08) about when it was introduced. Before and after that I killed deer (and other stuff) with the 7x57,7/08.280 Remington,270 Winchester and a bevy of 7mm magnums. I only got to watch what a couple of friends did with the 284 because I knew the load workup but never owned one.

All of them do anything a 7/08 does and none of them do less,velocity wise, with any bullet, so where this "perfect middle" crap comes from I have no idea (?). It sits on the lower end of 7mm cartridge performance. I am skeptical of any claims of "perfection" with so much duplicitous performance levels.

Most of this was with 140,150, and 160 gr bullets gr bullets of various makes and styles.

The difference was that the higher velocity cartridges shot flatter,and at distance killed very quickly, expanded their bullets further away but the smaller 7mm's were efficient if unspectacular. They all killed.The biggest difference between them was "bullets". I never saw anything to get excited about and still don't. It's the best thing they ever did with a 308 case but that's the best I can say about it while I stifle a yawn.

I liked the 7/08 but this notion of it occupying some theoretical "perfect middle" is perfectly subjective. I'd nominate the 280 in a heartbeat over any 7/08 or 25/06,neither of which would make any list of mine in a Top Ten all round BG cartridge....(I don;t care who uses them for what).

Anyone is free to disagree on the 280 thing as well,but these notions of "perfection"are the product of active imaginations. You'll pardon me while a stifle a snarky yawn in the face of all this "wisdom"....

Layne Simpson said it was the perfect Whitetail cartridge and considered it the .30-30 for South. I mean wouldn't it work fine up here also? What couldn't we work a bolt? I always thought that was a snarky, if not out and out BS. Then Kenny J started bribing him with grits and the .280AI became the bell of the South.

Carmichael said the .280Rem was were it was at with the 7's. WTH did he know?

Pass the .308W if this Yankee just had to pick one.

Well, he did put "Or??" in the title.

Carmichael jumped on the 280 bandwagon because he followed O'Connor and there was really no where else to go. It would not have been PC for Carmichael to use a 270; he needed his own cartridge.

Carmichael could have used anything similar with the same worldwide results because he could shoot...but he mostly use a 140 Nosler Partition at just under 3100 fps as I recall.The rifle was a Clayton Nelson M70 custom.

As a general purpose 7mm for BG hunting Im grabbing a 280 Remington a LONG time before any short action 7mm.


Here's one of mine from a by gone era,a custom Mauser by Kevin Campbell purchased from George Caswell, and that I sold years ago; but not before I hunted it East and West for 4-5 years.

I burned out the original barrel and George replaced it with a Douglas.

Had not seen the rifle in years. It was common back then for snarky Yankees to buy airline tickets to hunt far places and get their experience shooting rifles and hunting, instead of reading about it on the Internet.




http://www.gunsinternational.com/gu...arna-mauser-280-rem.cfm?gun_id=100656909

Kumbaya????

When the Angels want warm and fuzzy, the Northern Angels sing Battle hymn of the Republic. Southern, Dixie.

Kumbaya is really weird.

You'all could do what I'm doing. Building a 7X57! It's in between the 7-08 and .280 and it's going in a "Short" action M-70! That should ruffle some feathers.

I've killed schit with both, and can tell you WITHOUT A DOUBT, the 7mm Rem Mag is the better choice. If you don't agree you're a POS inbred or a snotnosed yank.

Tanner

"Y'all "can do what you want....BTDT,too.



I agree with Tanner. But then he's smarter than the average do-do on here and has the experience .

After screwing with all those subordinate 7mm's, I'll take a 7 Rem Mag any day.

I hear they are hard to shoot due to excess recoil but a 30/06 is not......which I frankly find to be more Internet myth.

I'm a potato eating Irishman, and highly offended that I would have to choose either of those two choices. Bugger off laddie....
_________________________
laissez les bons temps rouler

Good grief. We're the one's with -25*F weather. Not sure how anyone gets their panties wadded over the shape of a little brass cylinder. The world has many such cylinders, all "about perfect" for little whitetail deer.

Will say, Bob despises one of my favorites, the 308 Win, but I don't take it personally. He's my friend, even though he's completely ignorant.

At least the M70 will not have the bolt handle fall off, or the extractor break, or the trigger malfunction. Of course you will absolutely have to weld the bolt handle so it does not spin. Oh, you have to use the same barrel and stock as everyone else, and powder, and bullets. Damn, you will need a semi to haul this [bleep].

Of course, then there are the Bubba's we make fun of. Some of them, with factory stock rifles, factory ammo, see through mounted blister pack scopes, kill an awful lot of game. And, not all from the road.

But then I am just passing thru life, learning as I go, Looking down at no man, looking down at my feet for no man.

Laffin'!

Brad what can you expect from a Snarkey Yankee!?

I prefer "cantankerous".

Southern Bubba's are most often into the good chit and willing to pay for it. Northern Bubba's not so much. Give credit were it's due.

"Cantankerously big 7 prejudice?"

True. Takes one to know one

Anybody who shoots stuff with a belt at white tails, is like the 50 year old dude with the new Corvette. He is compensating for something.

BobinNH may be a snarkey Yankee but he has fine taste in rifles.

All he needs now is a sticker on the buttstock, a rattle can paint job and toss them in the creek next to a fish and he will be the gun god.

I got the sticker part covered... pure macho death.

Hey, stop that. I'm 72 and on the 6th Vette. Started in my 20's and not compensating for anything. I don't think, then again, na....

And I have been known to use a 7mm-08. Hmmmm....

Unless you're shooting at deer a long ways away, there's really very little difference in any of the 6mm-7mm range options.

Some like a little longer action and a little higher velocity with medium to heavier bullets.

Others like a shorter action and are happy shooting medium to lighter bullets.

Viva la difference!

Bob will never change my mind and I won't ever change his but we can agree to disagree, like gentlemen should - even though I'm right!

As is someone that feels the need to point that out...

At my age, the only thing I am compensating for is the depth of the water in the toilet bowl. I have to be a lot more careful to keep the jewels dry than I did twenty years ago.

Cred is where it's at today boys. All you have to do is read. Shooting not required to be an expert.

LMAO


BloeJob you just keep digging yourself a deeper hole...it's already apparent you don't know much of anything.

There's people posting here who have likely passed more big deer than you've ever seen....smart guys.

Like I said....people with two first names.....Encephalitic morons

You're the one who feels the need to point out over and over that cartridges with more powder will outperform those with less.

But like I said, you're compensating. Keep blasting those puppies with the big schit.

Well played Brad.
Now put on your big boy pants and rattle can that puppy!

Then toss it in the yellowstone river and you too can be a gun god.

That made my morning Bob.

Merry Christmas to a Snarky Yankee from a southern bubba