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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Deflave: What you are NOT considering in your contention is that its NOT just the strapping of a pistol to a duty belt!
Then once its strapped there you have to live, work, sit in a car, sit in witness chairs, run with it, fight with it, swim with it, wrestle people with it, draw it from the holster as quick as possible etc etc etc.
I did the above for 3 decades - so's I know!
I switched (at my own personal expense by the way) from a 4" barreled pistol to a 6" barreled pistol - that switch lasted about a year.
I even tried carrying that 6" barreled pistol "cross-draw" for a while.
I went back to the shorter "sight-radiused" pistol and was happy I did.
You would not think 2" in length and a few ounces more would make a difference enough so's one would go back to the shorter barrel length but for me it did.
As well as some of my cohorts.
Indeed the weight and longer sight radius of the longer barreled pistols made a slight difference in qualifying scores for me and others but often it was not worth the "hassles".
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy Never considered that. Thank you for sharing your experience as a LEO. Dave Varmint Guy Congrats the first guy not to get a GFY Hank Oh, he got a GFY - in spades - but would need someone to draw him a picture to explain how. Yep!  That one left contrails...
It ain't what you don't know that makes you an idiot...it's what you know for certain, that just ain't so...
Most people don't want to believe the truth~they want the truth to be what they believe.
Stupidity has no average...
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Btw,
The overall length difference is less than an inch between the 17 and 34...
Also, when was the 34 ever marketed as a 'target' pistol? It was, as Mack pointed out, intended for speed/tactical matches--a role it excels in.
As an aside, our local PD switched back to Glocks giving the choice bewtween the 34 or 19. I'll have to ask my buddy what the % split was (he chose the 19).
It ain't what you don't know that makes you an idiot...it's what you know for certain, that just ain't so...
Most people don't want to believe the truth~they want the truth to be what they believe.
Stupidity has no average...
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,531
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,531 |
Btw,
The overall length difference is less than an inch between the 17 and 34...
Also, when was the 34 ever marketed as a 'target' pistol? It was, as Mack pointed out, intended for speed/tactical matches--a role it excels in.
As an aside, our local PD switched back to Glocks giving the choice bewtween the 34 or 19. I'll have to ask my buddy what the % split was (he chose the 19). Interesting. Entirely skipped over the 17.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability."
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,866
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,866 |
Btw,
The overall length difference is less than an inch between the 17 and 34...
Also, when was the 34 ever marketed as a 'target' pistol? It was, as Mack pointed out, intended for speed/tactical matches--a role it excels in.
As an aside, our local PD switched back to Glocks giving the choice bewtween the 34 or 19. I'll have to ask my buddy what the % split was (he chose the 19). Interesting. Entirely skipped over the 17. Yep. That did surprise me.
It ain't what you don't know that makes you an idiot...it's what you know for certain, that just ain't so...
Most people don't want to believe the truth~they want the truth to be what they believe.
Stupidity has no average...
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,531
Campfire Sage
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OP
Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,531 |
As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." That's been my experience, too. I can't justify giving up the slightly (yet very comfortingly) superior shootability of the Glock 17 for the ever so slightly decreased printing characteristics of the Glock 19.
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Joined: Jul 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." Agreed. For uniform work, a G34 would be a top choice. The funny part most view the G34 as this overly long and hard to conceal piece, yet take a look at a G34 vs a standard 5" Government Model: ![[Linked Image]](http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/IV_Troop/Handguns/IMG_2484_zpswygsyaly.jpg)
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I wish more people and departments/agencies recognized the advantage of longer sight radius.
Grab a timer and shoot comparable handguns with extreme differences in sight radius and you'll quickly realize that it's a game changer.
If you're going to strap something to a duty belt, by all means give me the longer sight radius. Within reason...
Dave Yep.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I went through my firearms trainer course at The Texas Department of Public Safety, home of the famed Texas Rangers. We shot out to 50 yards with handguns, which was the limit of their range. We shot with Model 60's and most of us had a semi-auto that had a 5" barrel. The longer sight radius is incredibly helpful in aiding accuracy. Hitting a 50 yard target in the center scoring rings with a 2" barreled 5-shot revolver was almost a circus stunt, or the result of a very talented marksman doing the shooting.
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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 |
As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." Agreed. For uniform work, a G34 would be a top choice. The funny part most view the G34 as this overly long and hard to conceal piece, yet take a look at a G34 vs a standard 5" Government Model: Very, very, very fugking few people do what you're doing in that pic. It's always telling. Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." Agreed. For uniform work, a G34 would be a top choice. The funny part most view the G34 as this overly long and hard to conceal piece, yet take a look at a G34 vs a standard 5" Government Model: Very, very, very fugking few people do what you're doing in that pic. It's always telling. Travis +1. Pistol size is always an entertaining topic.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." Agreed. For uniform work, a G34 would be a top choice. The funny part most view the G34 as this overly long and hard to conceal piece, yet take a look at a G34 vs a standard 5" Government Model: Absolutely. Factor in that many LEO pistols now have lights which extend well beyond the G17's muzzle, and enough to at least split the difference between the G17 and 34. If a duty holster is long enough to fit the light, then why not a longer slide too?
Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
--Winston Churchill
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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If my memoir is correct, years ago it was either the Tribal Police or BIA guys ordered the 17L. A gun shop owner I knew was working on the bid.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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As a uniformed officer, I gladly exchanged a bit of comfort for the longer sight radius, first with a 1911, then with a 5" M&P. There really arent enough negatives to offset the increased "shootability." Agreed. For uniform work, a G34 would be a top choice. The funny part most view the G34 as this overly long and hard to conceal piece, yet take a look at a G34 vs a standard 5" Government Model: Don't forget the weight difference, as well. I don't have a steel 5" but my Scandium Commander with 8 rds of 230 weighs 34 oz. My G34 with 17 rds of 115...33 oz
It ain't what you don't know that makes you an idiot...it's what you know for certain, that just ain't so...
Most people don't want to believe the truth~they want the truth to be what they believe.
Stupidity has no average...
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,609
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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After not handling my 1911 for quite a while, I picked it up and my first reaction was: man, I can't believe how thin this thing is! The photo shows oal is the same but, also shows this thinner fact.
Shew me thy ways, O LORD: teach me thy paths.
"there are few better cartridges on Earth than the 7 x 57mm Mauser"
"the .30 Springfield is light, accurate, penetrating, and has surprising stopping power"
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Campfire Outfitter
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After not handling my 1911 for quite a while, I picked it up and my first reaction was: man, I can't believe how thin this thing is! The photo shows oal is the same but, also shows this thinner fact. The photo also demonstrates the wide variety in personal preference and impressions. Mackay is using the photo to show similarity, all I see is difference. The G34 looks huge to me.
Forgive me my nonsense, as I also forgive the nonsense of those that think they talk sense.
Robert Frost
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Campfire Outfitter
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I believe the discussion had drifted to LEO duty carry, in which bulk and/or concealability doesn't matter, but weight, length, and shootability does.
The G34/35 was designed to pass the "box test" so not surprisingly is roughly the same as a 5" 1911. Holding the two tells a different story, but on a duty belt you're basically back to the "box test" standards.
If it doesn't excessively weigh down an already heavy belt, and doesn't bury the muzzle into patrol car seats (and push up into your torso) then shootability and control "at speed" and under stress should become the focus of evaluating the best pistol.
Just a guess, but the lack of widespread adoption of longer slides probably has something to do with "uniformity" within departments, with the detectives, management, and little people preferring the G19 or G17 sized pistols. Also, most cops aren't "gun people" so they probably haven't even considered the benefits of a longer sight radius. Just guessin'.......
Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
--Winston Churchill
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2012
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After not handling my 1911 for quite a while, I picked it up and my first reaction was: man, I can't believe how thin this thing is! The photo shows oal is the same but, also shows this thinner fact. The photo also demonstrates the wide variety in personal preference and impressions. Mackay is using the photo to show similarity, all I see is difference. The G34 looks huge to me. and in reality there is no where near as much difference as you think
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Lets put this in another perspective: 5" 1911, with one magazine of 8+1, for 9 rounds of 230 grain JHP, equals 2 pounds, 15 ounces: ![[Linked Image]](http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/IV_Troop/Handguns/IMG_2488_zpsphdpgp8l.jpg) Versus, Glock 34, with 2 magazines of 21 rounds +1, for 43 rounds of 124 grain JHP, equals 2 pounds, 14 ounces: ![[Linked Image]](http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/IV_Troop/Handguns/IMG_2489_zps4n8q6kev.jpg) 9 rounds versus 43 rounds for essentially the same weight. That is MORE than FIVE TIMES the ammo. BTW, the Glock slide is only about 1/10th of an inch wider than a 1911. I think it is the rounded versus block profile that gives people a misconception. I will also note that these are actually 22 round mags. I download 1 round, as I find them a bit too tight. That said, I am not stacking the deck for arguments sake, and simply showing the two, as I actually run them. EDIT: Thanks to Steelhead for catching my dyslexic math!
Last edited by Mackay_Sagebrush; 01/24/17.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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You might want to check your math, but I hear you!
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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