Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters The 7x57 is more incredible!!

:)Actually the 7x57 will do about anything the other two will do, for most of us. Plus those are based on the 7x57. I know some will say that they are based on the 8x57, but that's not true. When the troops, and generals return that wanted to copy the 7x57. Have fun with this! captdavid

Ah, but we had a President who not only wanted to better the Spanish's Mauser rifles, he wanted to best the Kaiser's 7,92x57 Model 98. Hence, US Ordnance developed the 1903 based on the 1898 not the 1893/95 design.

Mr. Roosevelt didn't like Herr Albert's attempt to get France and England in a coalition to stop the US in 1898. The Kaiser also tried to grab land in the Philippines before the US could take full control.
And then, he tried to get land to build ports in Mexico to home his fleet, which could threaten the entrances to the soon to be completed Panama Canal. So, when he became President, Roosevelt felt the Kaiser was a threat to the US.

The 1903 Rifle and 30-06 cartridge are based on the 1898 Mauser Rifle and 7.92x57 cartridge. When the Germans came up with the high velocity Spitzer round in 1905, the US countered with the 1906 cartridge.
The US Ordnance Dept was sued by Mauser for patent infringement on aspects of the 1898 design, not the 7mm cartridge nor the earlier rifle designs.
History, not pop culture, paints a more complete picture.

Oh by the way. The 8mm Commission cartridge came before the 7mm cartridge. The 7mm was based on the 8mm case.

Who is "Herr Albert"?

IIRC, the Mauser military cartridges were introduced in this order; 8x57, 7.65x53, 7x57, 6.5x55, and 6.5x68.

If the Army Ordinance people had adopted the 7.65x53, or modified it to 7.62x53, they could have skipped both the 30-06 and 7.62x51.

As we are having fun with this, I've often wondered. If the US would have gone with a 7.62x57, what would we have now ? Probably some kind of 318 WR or 9.3x62 derivative? Captdavid

Friedrich Wilhelm Viktor Albert of Prussia, aka Kaiser Wilhelm II.

Well, the 7.62 x 57 still would not have fit in he 99 magazine, so Charles Newton would still probably have made the 300 Savage round. The Ordnance Dept, seeking a lighter more efficient cartridge, would still have started with the 300 Savage. Since it's abrupt shoulder was poor for machine gun feeding (ask Julian Hatcher) and the neck was short and forced bullets to take up valuable powder space, I wager we'd have still gotten the 7.62 x 51.
Mr McNamara would still have let his wonder boys convince him the AR15 was the [bleep], so Mr. Stoner's not so ingenious gas tapper with the camming bolt/bolt carrier design that copied and combined both the Swiss rifles' and the rotating bolt head which locked in the barrel extension just like Winchester had already done.

Anyway, 308 and 1 in 10 rifling were predestined because of the huge investment in Pratt and Whitney boring and rifling machines for the Krag rifles.

Or so that is how I stir the pot.

Just look at the thread title...

Some truths are self-evident.

I've never heard anyone refer to Kaiser Wilhelm as anything but Kaiser Wilhelm.

I owned a 7X57 I made for myself about 22 years ago. I should have never sold it. I used 160 and 175 grain bullets in it for most hunting. It was 100% reliable in function (Made on a 98 Mauser-- Standard Modell) and was also 100% on every animal I shot with it. I never needed 2 shots at anything.

I have not owned another 7mm since I sold it and to be honest, if I ever got another 7mm it would be another 7x57 or a 7-08.
Both shells throw the same bullet at about the same speed at the same pressures from the same barrel lengths. I have never owned a 7-08, but knowing the usefulness of the 7mm Mauser, I have 100% confidence in the 7-08 as well.

I wasn't aware that Charles Newton designed the 300 Savage cartridge.

Indeed.

Ditto.

He was definitely ahead of his time! captdavid

Supposedly Savage did. I personally believe Newton gave them a hand as Mr Savage didn't have any personal experience developing a high velocity round; he paid Newton for the first two.

But, getting back to the Capt David's original post;
30-06 is just more bigger and can throw more bigger bullets. So being American, I think it is more better.

Edit: I'll make the Grizzly Bear argument people who will never see one always make. 7 x 57 can't throw a 220 grain bullet at a hypothetical Grizzly Bear in a hypothetical dangerous situation during a hypothetical backpacking trip on Kodiak Island.

I don't think that Arthur Savage was involved with Savage Arms by the time the 300 Savage was introduced in late 1920.

I've got 2 7X57's; a Remington Rolling Block military and a Brazilian Model 1908 Mauser. Both are a hoot to shoot! I've always wanted a 7X57 sporter, but something always seem to catch my eye before I buy one.

They bought Stevens in 1920, but Arthur Savage still very much ran Savage.

True, but WD Bell took 1100 African elephant with a 7X57 and 175 gr bullets.

I think that you'd have to look long and hard to find nicer 7x57 sporters than Husqvarna 1640 mannlichers, Remington 700 MRs, or Winchester 70 Fwts.

How close to current SAAMI specs is your Remington Rolling Block chamber? The 1902s that I've had were between 0.005" and 0.010" longer between the base and the bottom of the shoulder.

"The 7x57 is more incredible!!"

but not as incredible as a 6.8x57, aka the .270 Ingwe...