Home Forums Gear Horses and ATV's Horses in the old westerns.

Horsemen, any notion of the prettiest horse the old western cowboys rode on the TV, or movies?

Just now watching Matt Dillion on that, I'd think?, buckskin.

Thoughts?

John Wayne's stocking-legged sorrel was a dandy, too.....

and don't forget Hi-Yo Silver.....

I liked Hopalong Cassidy's horse, Topper.

If you like show ring class, the black Arab they used to play Al Hattal in Hidalgo is about as classy as they come.

That is hands down a slam dunk. Ruth.........festuses mule!

I wonder what would happen if someone dressed like Roy Rogers walked into a real cowboy bar.

Miss Kitty would kick his azz out.....

He would probably leave on his own after one look at Miss Kitty.

Wasn't her name Sarah?

I seem to remember someone riding Sarah?

Watched a lot of Gunsmoke a month or so ago, and Festus rode at least 2 different mules in that time. miles

Ruth. There was a movie called 2 mules for Sister Sarah. miles

Speaking of Roys horse, I am reminded of a little diddy from my grandfather, a florida cowboy.....

Beware of a horse with one white hoof,
Of two beware the same.
A horse with three is no good at all,
and four is not worth his name..........

but then granddad worked his horses....

they were not for picture taking...

Cute saying but not true espically about the work and picture taking you added.

No offense to your grandpaw in any way.

If anyone looks at older photographs of actual horses used in the 1860 + time frame as most westerns are depicted, the actual horses were a far cry from those shown in movies.

I sure enjoyed them though.

I remember sitting round the radio on a Saturday night,early 1950's, listening to Hopalong, Roy, Lone Ranger. I later had plastic replicas of Topper, Trigger, and Silver

http://stvmcqueen.tripod.com/thhorse.jpg

The horse's name was Buster and Steve McQueen did his own riding. The director of photography on Tom Horn said, "I've never seen anyone handle a horse better. He would get on Buster with a rifle and fire at full gallop. He was going as fast as the horse could go and he handled it beautifully."

I knew a real horseman that wouldn't have anything to do with a horse that had white hooves. They were more brittle or less strong, I don't remember, but evidently hooves with white pigment were more susceptible to foot problems then those that were dark.

I heard it this way:

One white foot—buy him.
Two white feet—try him.
Three white feet—eye him.
Four white feet—deny him.

I've seen white feet that are hard and strong. I've seen black feet that are weak, soft and shelly.

Research has been done on this (IIRC, by Doug Butler) and pigment, or the lack of it, is not the cause.

Oh I believe you I know people that say the same thing. I'm just saying I don't believe in it. Sure would be a shame for a man to walk past a good horse because of feet color.

Appaloosas have striped hooves. All the stripes are known for being tough.

The problem is them feets is attached to Appaloosas!

Myth: White hooves are softer and have more problems than black feet.
The color of the hoof is influenced by the color of the skin above it, so if a horse has white markings directly above the hoof, the hoof itself may carry the same pigmentation. Many people believe that hooves with black walls are stronger than hooves with white walls.

Master Farrier John Burt owns and operates the JDC School of Basic Farrier Science near Texarkana, Ark. He is a member of and tester for the Brotherhood of Working Farriers Association (BWFA) and a 2001 inductee to the BWFA Hall of Fame.
John says, "There is no quality difference on the same horse, no scientific data to sustain any difference. The white and the black hoof are both designed the same structurally; the texture and quality of the hoof is the same."

One of the foremost experts in his field, Doug Butler, Ph.D., of LaPorte, Colo., is the author of The Principles of Horseshoeing, one of the most widely used texts on horseshoeing in the world. He also has 30 years of teaching experience and acts as a consultant and lecturer on horseshoeing. In 1976 while doing research at Cornell University, he conducted a study on white versus black hooves by taking squares of hoof material and crushing them in a compressor.

"There was no difference between black and white," he agrees. "The main difference was in moisture content: The softer hooves fell apart easier." He notes that genetics also play a role in hoof strength. "Some Paint Horses have extremely brittle white hooves and others don’t. Appaloosas seem to have extremely strong feet, no matter what color; genetic propensity seems to be more important than the color of the hoof."

I bet that's what I'm thinking of Miles, 'cause I remember Ruth now!

Thanks.

Sara was played by Shirley McLain so they had 2 mules and 1 jackass.

I don't dispute the findings of the experts at all.However, my wife had an old rodeo horse that had one white foot. I have done all my own shoeing for about 50 years,and that one foot was the hardest to keep a shoe on and was always cracking.If I left her barefoot,she would break out that one hoof so much that she was unuseable. The other three had no problems. This is only an example of one, so it doesn't mean much, but I wanted to pass on my experience

Ruth was a boy horse too. miles

The word was, in the old Lassie movies, Roy Weatherwax used eight dogs to play Lassie, all males.

Easy answer for an old western watcher. Randolph Scott's horse called Stardust.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuwNBDnKEoM

Kaywoodie, actually you are right when you said you remember someone riding Sarah. In the movie Two Mules for Sister Sarah, she was dressed like a nun and led everyone to believe she was one. In the end you find out she is actually a prostitute.
Just saying!

So that Jenny didn't buck for free.

Still on old westerns, but, when they light the wick on the oil lamp, light quickly comes from all sides, and brightly.

Gene Autry's Horse was Champ. Tonto's was Scout,but what was Red Ryder's horse's name?

Wikipedia says, Thunder, but you could have looked that up.

I can't remember the name of Matt Dillon's nag but several of us Gunsmoke writers used to jokingly refer to his horse as "Dr. Ross," and would use the name in a script. I.e., "Matt runs out from the Marshal's Office, jumps on Dr. Ross and rides away."

(For those who don't know, "Dr. Ross" was a canned dog food.)

As for "eight Lassies," that is true. Each Lassie knew several "tricks" so whatever "chore" Lassie was supposed to do on camera per the script, there was always one of the Lassies that could perform it.

Same with a popular Canadian dog show called The Littlest Hobo. "Hobo" was a German Shepard pooch who ran around in Canada, hooking up with people who needed some kind of help and Hobo would help them out. The trainer had six identical male German Shepards, all of whom he'd taught a bunch of tricks. I wrote for that show when I was sent to Toronto by Columbia Pictures.

It was interesting to be on the set and watch the trainer handle the dogs for the camera work. Lots of hand signals and sometimes screaming by the trainer.

One thing about writing for a "dog show." The dialog for the "star" was easy.

L.W.

The chestnut that Mcqeen rode in Tom Horn in a bosal and Hackmans bucksin, Ben Johnsons grey and the brown horse in Bite the bullet are some of my favorites.

When they filmed 'Babe' about the sheep herding pig, they went through 48 pigs. Pigs grow so fast that they kept outgrowing the part. Good thing that pigs are exceptionally easy to train.
I guess they kept the crew supplied with bacon, anyway.

Wow! From horses to pigs in less than 2 pages.

True, at least we are not at each other's throats like "up" at the freak show!

It all fits. How many of the movie cowboys ate bacon and beans on the trail?

My Dad spoke of the Tom Mix movies often and his horses Tony and Tony, Jr. Dad said Tony had two hind leg socks and Tony, Jr. had four white socks. Never paid much attention to this until after Dad passed away.

Seen some of the old Mix movies and, yep, he was right.

After seeing Trigger and Bullet stuffed and mounted, Dale had a little discussion with Roy.

I'll add chickens to the zoo.

That flock of red chickens that ran across the farm yards when Matt, and Festis rode onto the place.
Likely the same chickens every time, and some stage hands had to be quick about catching them before the birds ran out on Hollywood Boulevard.

Wasn't Buttermilk stuffed too?

Thanks for sharing that...

You wrote for Gunsmoke? Thats great did you have anything to do with the episode "The Hat" ... It has to be my all time favorite ..

Thanks!

CowboyVon, I wrote several Gunsmoke scripts but I didn't write The Hat. That was written by a friend of mine, the late Ron Bishop, who wrote a whole bunch of Gunsmoke scripts, plus others for other shows. Ron was a very good writer.

He owned a small "ranch" north of Cody, Wyoming, and invited me up to hunt elk there a couple of times. To my great regret, I was too busy to make it when he was there for elk season.

Had some good times over some drinks in Los Angeles, though.

As an aside, Ron served in Burma during WW II. He told some interesting stories about that, too.

L.W.

Thanks .. I watched Gunsmoke every night when I was a kid and still watch as often as I can.. Prior to selling my old place we kept a computer on with Gunsmoke playing on a loop through youtube 24-7 lol you might say I'm a fan ...

Thanks for your part !!!!!

CowboyVon, glad you enjoyed the show. I and other writers had fun writing for it. Every year at Christmas CBS and the Gunsmoke production company would throw a huge Christmas party and dinner on the very large sound stage where the permanent set of Dodge City was erected. That was at CBS Studios, Studio City.

The writers, directors, actors, production staff, our spouses, and other guests from the industry were invited. Interesting to be bellied up to the Longbranch Saloon bar drinking real booze.

Best regards.

L.W.

Leanwolf, I attended my first writer's conference in 1978. By far, the best instructor there was a woman, probably then in her late 50s or early 60s, who had written for Gunsmoke for years. She was easily the best instructor at the conference. I returned to the same conference in Portland the next year as an instructor but she wasn't there. Packed in my files is a brochure from the first conference with her name and photo. I'd know the name if I heard it, but I can't think of it. Anyway, a wonderful lady. My mother passionately believed Marshall Dillon's buckskin was the best horse on television, and while I would devalue the horse for not having the confirmation appropriate to the era, how can one vote against one's late mother. The buckskin it is.

Mtrancher, I don't recall meeting a woman Gunsmoke writer. I know a few women wrote for the show, but I never met one. If you recall the name, let me know.

Hope all is well there with you.

L.W.

I am glad to read that it is acknowledged that many shows used multiple horses portrayed as one. Little Joe's paint was supplied for the show and was often a different one season to season.



My wife Gail bought one of the buckskins that Matt Dillon rode.

This particular horse was injured in a trip wire accident. She was up for auction with a cast on her hind leg. A friend tipped my Gail off that it would be a great horse to own and even if she didn't recover completely would make a great mare for breeding.

Chap did recover and was ridden by Gail for many years. She took Chap all over Calif and into Az where the horse died at age 38. The horse was ridden into Canyon de Chelly, the Grand Canyon and all over the Hopi reservation before moving to Tucson Az.

The horse was 17 hands high and had to have her pasterns trimmed as she had some draft in her to make her so large. My wife took her to the Hopi reservation in the mid 70s where she taught for several years. The tribal leader Vernon bred Chap to his best stallion. The result was a huge stunning grulla that became the breeding stud for many horses on the Res.

This particular buckskin had one rear white stocking. You can see her if you scoll down about 1/3 of page. On left hand side with left rear white foot. Caption says Matt with Buck. here:

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/507499451730202943/

Dang when I opened the link I supplied the horse picture moved to the right side!

My wife was so attached to Chap when she died she took several days off from work, death in the family. To this day she cannot bring herself to look at any Gunsmoke episodes or pictures like the one I found. Truly was a one of a kind horse.

A white hoof tends to have thinner hoof walls. King Ranch use to remove them from their breeding stock.

To OP, most of that older stock was big headed and raw boned, not my first choice. To me, STOLI is about a perfect horse.

Speaking of the old west, Harry Vold died yesterday at 93 years old.

Well know for his livestock supply to rodeos,including the National Finals. He was born when the west wasn't as old yet. RIP Harry

The 'old' west was any time before color movies.

I think Matt Dillon's horse was named "Buck".

Generalizations like that have no basis. Have you read Butler?

Hi IB, I've not read Butler, but I have picked up a lot of hooves. Is Butler a shoer? No one has lamed as many horses as shoers.

To call Doug Butler a "shoer", is the epitome of understatement!

Lol....true and now class you see where most of these old time rumors and such come from.

"My dad always said".........etc. no offense to anyone's family but they're not always correct even though they believe what they're telling with all their heart.

I don't know Butler, for that matter, I don't know the depth of the knowledge of horses on the Campfire, but if it is as full of holes as the rest of the information that is shared here, there is much room for misinformation.

All I know was this cowboy did know horses and when he told me light hooves were more prone to problems, I took him at his word for his experience. I'm sure he ate more horses than most of these drug store cowboys ever rode.

Well, I'll just ask a simple question. Do you believe the genetic makeup of an individual can influence their type (ie do you think no one is more susceptible to defects or disease than the next due to their dna. If you do I'm sure AMA would be interested in your research)?

Has Butler performed conclusive genetic/dna research pertaining to the subject? He does seem to be a hell of a marketer, but didn't see anything on him as a research scientist. I don't know so I'm asking.

Until then, I'm going to hedge my bets by going on my experience.

The information is available to anyone willing to do a Google search.

I have ever no interest in forcing you to believe the facts.

If I may interrupt this disagreement briefly , I'll throw James Steward's horse, "Pie", into the mix.
Interesting in that the horse was Steward's own horse.

I would have avoided the genetic makeup question too.

Pie was quite the horse for Jimmy Stewart. I heard of this story and just found proof.

http://www.npr.org/2016/03/21/47128...e-horses-that-captured-moviegoers-hearts

"they just became so attuned to each other that in one film, "The Far Country," Stewart had developed such a rapport with him that he was able to get the horse to do something at liberty all by himself when the trainer was not around. They were on this location. The trainer wasn't on the set. And the horse needed to walk from one end of a street to another with no ropes on him or anything, and Stewart just went up to him, he said he whispered in his ear and told him what he needed him to do. And the horse did it. And everyone on the set was absolutely amazed, and Stewart just said, that was Pie. That's what he did. So he absolutely had an incredible bond with the horse"

As to hooves, my two cents and worth half as much, though my farrier friends claim there is no difference in a dark hoof and a light hoof, from a lifetime of ranching and using horses in dry, rough country I will take a dark hoof every time over a light one. In fact, horses or cattle, I never turn down pigment.