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Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Truth.



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George Patton wanted to whack the Ruskies at the end of WWII while they were vulnerable. He could see over the horizon.

Wasn't politically correct at the time, but there would have been no Soviet Bloc, no Cold War.

Neville Chamberlain incubated the BIG war, a much smaller operation could have taken Hitler out early on before he was given ample time to build a mighty military machine.

Hindsight is 20/20. But, here we are, what do we do with the cards we've been dealt. You gotta play the hand you're holding.

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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....

Yep...

Fired by Truman...

Goes along with my previous post.

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Originally Posted by Raeford
God knows what we have there....under the surface. whistle

It's the Boogeyman. And the Boogeyman is real.

[Linked Image]

"The Ohio-class SSGN bristles with more conventional firepower than any comparable vessel because its twenty-four missile tubes (eighty-eight-inch diameter) were originally designed to carry enormous Trident ballistic missiles. Twenty-two of them were refitted with Tomahawk launch canisters with seven missiles each, for a total of 154 Tomahawks missiles, all of which can be ripple-fired from underwater in the space of six minutes. This is likely to be a heavier cruise-missile armament than an entire surface task force."

Why China and Russia Fear America's Killer Cruise Missile Submarines



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Originally Posted by jorgeI
This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....



Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....

Yep...

Fired by Truman...

Goes along with my previous post.

DF


Yep. My Dad who was a WWII Veteran thought the same.

Truman just couldn't stand Mac's ego. If he'd been smart, he would learned how to stroke it and harness and have that tool when he really needed it. But...

Last edited by local_dirt; 04/18/17.

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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Amigo, you could not be more right. Fifty seven years ago( 1960) , I joined the Corps to go to Korea and finish that mess.

I guess Vietnam payed better.


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Most of the OHIO class are SSBNs and the central component of our strategic nuclear deterrent. While some have been converted, my point to the original query was addressing SSBNs. Those we're saving for Russia and China. smile


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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore


Originally Posted by jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
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Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore


I seems to me since WW 2 the politicians have kept the military's hands tied. I think a lot of things could have turned out different if this was not the case. Hasbeen


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Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore


Yeah, Inchon and the drive to the Yalu was just a terrible piece of generalship. As to the PI, with no air or sea assets, yeah, it was all his fault....


A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore

Yep, real warriors.

Google: Chesty Puller/Chosin Reservoir.

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Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore

Yep, real warriors.

Google: Chesty Puller/Chosin Reservoir.

DF




My father was a an army staff sargent who was standing on the beach when McArthur returned. He fought for McArthur all across the Pacific. Actually spoke with him on a number of ocasions and greatly admired the man. He thought Truman was a fool for not listening to McArthur.


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Originally Posted by ruraldoc
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore

Yep, real warriors.

Google: Chesty Puller/Chosin Reservoir.

DF




My father was a an army staff sargent who was standing on the beach when McArthur returned. He fought for McArthur all across the Pacific. Actually spoke with him on a number of ocasions and greatly admired the man. He thought Truman was a fool for not listening to McArthur.


In clear 20/20 hindsight, Big Mac was right, Truman just a politician.

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Originally Posted by jorgeI
Originally Posted by Sycamore
Originally Posted by jorgeI
Seol will be toast. There were at least twenty thousand, yes 20K artillery pieces within range. This will be one huge mess that we once again left unfinished. Big Mac was right....


Big Mac got his ass handed to him in the Philippines AND in the Korean Peninsula. He was just lucky the Marine Corps was there, and not reading Macs press releases about what a good job MacArthur was doing.

Sycamore


Yeah, Inchon and the drive to the Yalu was just a terrible piece of generalship. As to the PI, with no air or sea assets, yeah, it was all his fault....


And then what happened?

Sycamore


Originally Posted by jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
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After the drive to the Yalu and the impending complete defeat of North Korea, the Chinese entered the war with huge numbers of troops since they could not allow their client state to fall. They were possibly emboldened in this since no one had dropped a couple dozen a-bombs on their border area.

However, MacArthur and his staff believed that the Chinese would not attack in any numbers and did not pay attention to signs that they would, right up until they did.

The Chinese side of the Yalu remained a safe haven and dividing line across which we could not attack for fear of enlarging the war, so it settled into a back and forth stalemate - a tactic repeated in some ways in Vietnam with the safe havens of Laos and Cambodia.


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Originally Posted by hasbeen1945
Said not much was going to happen with only one carrier.


Especially when it's in the Indian Ocean......



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Pretty well summed up by Jim above. Further, his "defeat" in the PI, it's his fault just about like Travis' was at the Alamo. Cut off outnumbered and with no possible help for relief, he was ordered out by the President. Man, what is it with you lefties and your hatred of the like of MacArthur? Lastly and to my original POINT, had he been allowed to finish off and drive the Chinese back to the Yalu and a unified Korea, we would not be in this mess. Just another zero to the left of the period and US Foreign Policy debacles since WWII.


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Quote
...However, MacArthur and his staff believed that the Chinese would not attack in any numbers and did not pay attention to signs that they would, right up until they did....


yep, a great general, expert on asians, doncha know?

check out what the Army says about it.

http://www.history.army.mil/brochures/kw-chinter/chinter.htm

Quote
The initial warning attacks and diplomatic hints by the Chinese were ignored by the overconfident Far Eastern Command under General MacArthur. MacArthur�s failure to comprehend the reality of the situation led the entire United Nations army to near disaster at the Ch�ongch�on River and the Chosin Reservoir. Only the grit and determination of the individual American soldiers and marines as they fought the three major enemies of cold, fear, and isolation held the UN line together during the retreats from North Korea. Once tied together into a coherent defensive line, under new and dynamic leadership, these same soldiers and marines showed their determination to continue the fight. Hard battles lay ahead, but the period of headlong retreats from an attacking, unsuspected foe, was finally over.



Originally Posted by jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....
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Originally Posted by jorgeI
I recall saying one is just a statement, two are needed for mutual support and three enhances combat operations sustainability and survivability against a serious enemy. For Gulf War one, we deployed SIX.


And a battle wagon!

Wouldn't it be nice if we could still park the Missouri, the Iowa and the Wisconsin off the coast of NK.



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