Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Winchester Collectors Pre-64 help please

Gentlemen, hope you don't mind my ignorance but I was wondering if anybody can shed some light for me...I'll let the pictures do the talking and I'll listen but best I can determine this was made in '40 or '41 (ser.# 40xxx) I realize of course the stock nor barrel are original and the safety seems to have been changed. The 26" barrel is stamped 264 wacker improved on one side and apex match grade on the other.
Magazine follower is also missing..
Any comments whatsoever are welcome and appreciated!

Beautiful piece of wood- stock is unique, to say the least. Not exactly ugly, but not what a guy would consider classic lines. Checkering is extremely well done. Looks like pretty much a complete custom- reblue, new tube, a bit of spit and polish just about everywhere.. all in all, IMHO, a pretty nice piece built for someone with large hands and an extra long length of pull or long arms.

Bob

That is a beautiful piece of wood and the checkering looks nicely done. The roll over cheek piece ruins the lines for me. The safety looks original but reblued. If you don't get any info I will look in the Wildcat books about the Wacker Improved not familiar with that.

Someone at one time spent a lot of money on that one. Love the wood and the checkering. 264 Wacker Improved? No idea, a 264 Win Mag on steroids?

Lovely workmanship, but strange.

Now, I am curious. I would assume that since the rear bridge is not drilled and tapped for scope mounts the barrel would have sights on it, but if they do, the rear sight is quite forward of where I would think it to be? Something also seems to be amiss on the bolt? Just thinking my Model 70's seem to not have a recess at the rear of the bolt as this one shows, when cocked the firing pin assembly is out of the bolt sleeve and when it is not cocked I believe it is flush. Is there a firing pin in there?

Appreciate the responses so far guys. I agree it's a beautiful piece of wood with a slightly "different" style..
I did make a mistake tho, the serial number is 42xxx...
Knives, the firing pin is present and cocks and fires as it should. As I understand the pre-war models were not D&T on the rear of the receiver. Here's a few more pics just for the hell of it.
Ok knives I read a little closer and get what you are saying...I'll take a few more pics to hopefully clarify..

That would correct on the rear bridge not drilled or tapped, but even in your new pictures, I can't tell that it has sights. Old eyes and bad monitor!! I really like the way the stock maker did the long slim wrist.

I was writing while you were editing. I look forward to see more photo's.

Rifle fired...

Bolt lifted up only..

Bolt closed, cocking complete..

Very astute comments so far by some smart and observant folks!

Plus one from me on gorgeous wood and workmanship. The style leaves me cold, but that's just me. I too haven't figured out the sights, nor have I heard of the .264 Whacker Improved.

To add to the discussion:
If you do want to fit a scope, that early style of safety may give you some trouble.

Of all the things to go missing, the magazine follower? Makes me wonder if the "Whacker" had feeding issues, someone was working on the follower, one thing led to another, and the parts never got back together.

All good points gundoc, thank you..
I also can't find anything on the wacker imp, and the only info I find on Apex seems to be a company that mfgs pistol barrels.

You are welcome, but I don't know that I added much to some already astute comments.

I too was wondering about the Apex. I believe the Apex you found also sells some other handgun parts. I suspect we are talking about two different companies named Apex. It seems to be one of those fairly common names based on the concept of being the best, "pinnacle" being another example.

But maybe not. It couldn't hurt to contact them and find out.

I don't know how you feel about the stock, but a skillful stock maker could possibly "tone down" the cheek piece a bit. He could possibly do something about the flair on the pistol grip, but that would get into some very well done checkering.

Is there anything "uniquely stylish" about the fore end?

It would also be great to learn more about the provenance. It would be interesting to discover this was an early effort by someone who later became well known. Great craftsmanship, that's for sure.

I think Apex was a barrel maker post WWII to probably the early 1970's. I am thinking that they used to do a lot of reboring back in the day.

I may be totally mistaken and they just might be a brand of a large Pittsburgh, PA gun shop and were actually Douglas barrels. I can't remember the firm. I had been there many times. Gees I can't believe my memory sometimes!!!

Certifiable: That was a beautiful piece of wood!
In fact I kind of like its radical looks as it has been turned into.
I wish I knew something about the cartridge/caliber - haven't heard of that one.
Enjoy!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Had to rush home so I could check the Wildcat Cartridges II which is the only one I have and no luck on the 264 Wacker Improved. I did find that NUMRICH ARMs still list APEX Match Grade Barrels in 375 H&H and 243 on their website although out of stock and regular APEX barrels in 30 Cal.. The listing indicates that these barrels have threaded holes in the barrel for sights, is that the case with yours?

Gundoc... checkering runs all along both sides of the fore end but no fancy cap or other embellishment to speak of. I'll get a better pic of that

Varmintguy, I agree the piece of wood is really something! Done to a different style that's for sure but the grain is fantastic and carries the whole length of the stock

Knives...so at least I'm not the only one who can't turn up a thing on the wacker! This barrel has no holes for sights front or rear. With a cheek piece like that I can only assume this was to be strictly a scoped affair..?

I think a decent stockmaker could clean up that cheekpiece area and perhaps reduce the end of the grip a bit to definitely improve the overall look and feel. That wood is worth fussing with!

Depending on the price the stock could be re shaped and the action rebarreled to a different caliber. It's a nice piece of wood that's for sure.

I 100% agree on the fussing with! The wood is amazing but I would not want to mess with the checkering at all!

There was a guy about a year ago on ebay that was selling Pre 64 Model 70 stocks that were very close to this style. He was either a duplicator or selling off a few that had been duplicated for $900. Very much to these lines but with straight grain. I was offered one when I was asking on another forum for Pre 64 stocks.

If it is a 264 Win Mag Improved I would love to know what it is. I am a huge fan of the 264 mentioned. Maybe a 264 Clark?