Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Rust Blueing Question

I got some Plinkington's Rust Blue juice from Brownell's to blue a new barrel for my Hawken. The directions say to use such & such a fine wire wheel to buff the black coating down between boilings.

My 1st question is can't I use fine steel wool instead? (This was supposed to be a low budget project).

My second question is how do you know if the water you got is de-ionized? That's what they said to use & I think that I recall that water botteling companies ionize the water to kill algae or something. How do I ger de-ionized water. I have well water but its full of iron & minerals.

Thanks for any advice anybody can offer.!

I have used fine steel wool on a few hobby bluing projects and it has worked well. But you have to make sure you get the kind that has no oil on it. Oil and Grease are great enemies of perfect rust bluing jobs.

I never used deionized water and I got fine results. I just used bottled spring water.

Boil the steel wool in water with a little detergent added, to remove all oil and grease. Rinse throughly, to remove all traces of both oil and detergent.

As for water, wouldn't distilled water that you can buy in a grocery work? It is usually less than a $1.00 per gallon.

I have never rust blued, but I have read a lot about it. Even just the slightest bit of oil, on the steel wool, on the rifle, or on the surface of the water will mess it up. Don't even touch it with your bare hands. Wear clean cotton gloves.

Thanks for the advice! I guess I'll boil my steel wool and forge ahead. I have to boil out the tank I bought to do this anyway. If it turns out well I'll post a picture.

I've done a lot of (budget) rust bluing. I think you'll be best served by buying a stainless steel wire wheel from Brownells. They're not that expensive. Insert a bolt through the wheel, tighten a nut on the other side, and chuck it in your drill. Clamp the drill in a vise for carding. That's a low-buck setup. The brush will give you a better finish than steel wool by hand. Especially on a long piece like that barrel.



As posted above, buy gallons of distilled water from your grocery or hardware store.

You'll be making multiple passes of applying solution, rusting, boiling off, and carding. I change the distilled water for boiling quite often.......seems to help.

A quick and dirty "damp box" will aid immeasurably in the rusting process. Basically, a box to hold the barrel at a consistent warm humidity. I built myself a damp box with a pan of distilled water heated by a light bulb. A similar temporary box could be assembled to do the same. My bulb is under a pan on a dimmer switch that is just hot enough to keep the water tepid.

Steven Dodd Hughes suspends a bulb over top of a pan of water with a clamp. His bluing on double shotguns is excellent. You just want to encourage rusting........not humid enough to draw condensation.

I use latex gloves instead of cotton. Never touch the metal without gloves.......in any part of the process.

I degrease with Simple Green & distilled water solution. Wash and then soak for a bit. Then boil in clean distilled water.

I attended Phil Pilkington's custom gun class in 1983, so I had a chance to learn all the secrets of rust bluing using his solution. Not many secrets. Oil is your enemy. Apply rusting solution in long sweeping motion. You can rub the very first coat to make it "bite", but from then on just "glide" over the metal. Don't use a soaked applicator......just damp enough to lay down a very thin coat. Hold metal under a light so you can see where you're applying the solution.

Use a hair dryer to immediately dry off the metal when removing it from the boiling water. Water runs left to dry can sometimes leave a residue mark that you can't get rid of.

If you have trouble getting the rusting to "take" on about the 3rd or 4th pass.........try washing in a weaker solution of Simple Green and water.......then boil in water again before re-applying solution. I've had this work for me. Probably caused by a minute amount of oil in the water.

It ain't magic, and it works. Probably one of the easiest things for a hobby gun aficionado to do with a high degree of success....and little investment.

And don't forget to wear those latex gloves when you handle the steel wool also.

Absolutely.

Wear those gloves from the moment you remove the metal from the rusting area, right through the boiling & carding process, and re-applying the solution. You may use 2-3 pairs for the process. They're cheap.

Octagon barrels: Knock off any "knife edges" just a bit on the barrel with some sand paper. It will never be noticeable on the finished product, and it will take the bluing solution better.

Block sand your metal to get the best finish you can. Machine marks, or sanding marks will be magnified on the finished product. Rust bluing doesn't cover these.....it enhances them. I typically finish to 320 or 400 grit.

If you're using cotton balls to apply your solution, make sure they aren't impregnated with lanolin. You'll be laying down a solution mixed with oil.....a real no-no. I've gone to using folded strips of white t-shirt cotton held with a closepin.

Sorry.........I keep thinking of things that might help. Stuff that helped me in the past.

De-Ionized water is not necessary and can be detrimental. You actually need a slightly acidified water for best results. Old-time gunsmiths liked to use rain water for this task.

Sometimes you find a steel that doesn't easily convert from the "red rust" to black. Even boiling for long periods doesn't seem to do the trick. What really helps in every situation is to slightly acidify the water - using two or three drops of hydrochloric, sulfuric or nitric acids - per tank full of water. These acids supply the hydrogen ions needed to convert FeO to Fe3O4 (magnetite).

Mr. 300Takedown;
In my experience you have received some excellent advice here.

I mix my own rusting agent, and am not sure how a different agent might react so I can�t say exactly how the Pilkington�s might differ. I believe you will not want to let the rusting stay on too long whichever formula used, as deep pits are not easily removed.

Different steel seems to oxidize at different rates, so for instance a Ruger investment cast receiver can be challenging to get the same tone as a gun barrel. A muzzle loader barrel should be a great place to start rust bluing I�d think.

I have been happy with the results from rainwater and distilled water.

While I used steel wool cleaned in white gas for years, when I finally got a steel wheel from Brownell�s I surely kicked myself for waiting that long. To my eye, the rotary wheel gives an even buffing with much less effort.

That said, I�ve yet to do an octagon barrel. I might hazard a guess that the rotary wheel might be too aggressive on the edges on an octagon, but I�m not sure.

Good luck on this rewarding aspect of working on guns.

Regards,
Dwayne

Oil is the enemy of all rust blues except one, Laurel Mountain Forge Barrel Brown and Degreaser. It is also a excellent rust blue solution that contains a detergent. You can bare hand your gun parts, steel wool, carding wheels, etc. with no problems. It is so much less of a headache to rust blue when you don't have to keep everything spotless. No gloves or degreased steel wool needed.

RWO

Dwayne,
Almost all the barrels I do are octagon or part octagon and the wire wheel is not problem what so ever.

Brent

This little tip is intriguing. I started changing to fresh water on each boiling to get by this. I'm going to try the acid next time. I have some concentrated hydrochloric and nitric acid. Any particular advantage of one over the other?

Pilkington also taught his "fume bluing". The metal is rusted in an enclosed container (Pilkington's was a plexi-glass affair with a sealed top, so you could monitor the rusting). A watch glass on either end of this box.......3-4 drops of nitric acid on one, 3-4 drops of hydrochloric acid on the other. Not mixed! The acids fumed in the container and started the rusting process on the metal.

It's a very fine-grained rust, and very evenly applied. The disadvantage is everything gets coated with the rusting agent unless masked. Boiling and carding processes are the same. At one time these instructions were included with Pilkington's bluing solution.

While all hydrogen ions are created equal, hydrochloric fumes aren't quite as noxious as nitric.

As far as I have found, anything that will cause rust to form can be used in your blueing. I have, on many occasions completely browned a piece, only to convert it to blue at the last step. That is, I would apply browning agent, let it rust, card it and repeat the process. The last step is to boil it up and convert it all to blue.

Huh.....

I guess I never really gave much thought to the variations in the chemical processes...........but a bluing job could theoretically be accomplished with only one boil off?

What are the downsides of that approach?

I recently completed my first rust blue job and was well pleased with the results. I did an '03 Springfield using Jim Bair's Gun Goddess. Used a damp box, took 6 passes, cardings, and boil offs. BTW, I used plain tap water (changed for each boiling) for the boiling and it worked just fine. The results were well worth the effort. I have two more rifles to do and I learned enough to be quite comfortable with the process.

In regards to browning, I've used Bwood Casey Plum Brown. Their instructions say nothing about boiling. After using the solution per directions, I boil just like rust blue. This gives a very rich, deep brown color to the parts. The Bwood Casey brown stays brown. I would guess the brown to blue depends on the chemical composition of the solution.

Mr. BrentD;
Thanks for the information on octagon barrels.

I appreciate your sharing that.

Regards,
Dwayne

From my experience, I believe that slightly acidified water will convert any browned steel or iron to blue.

Yes, theoretically, one boiling would suffice.

Downside? I can't think of any.

Those of you who are using carding wheels, what speed are you running?

"It's a very fine-grained rust, and very evenly applied. The disadvantage is everything gets coated with the rusting agent unless masked."

I also remember from my reading that it is necessary to plug the barrel to keep the solution out. Seems like it could cause harmful pits in the bore.

Hot bluing doesn't seem to harm the bore.