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You're right about the Dec tag, that's the one I'd really want. And like I said, please let me know which outfits taking the 140's south of the border.

Thx
Dober

PM sent BIG BUCKS

Please PM me with details and pictures

Greenhorn,
I would be glad to send you a brochure and some pictures to your email if you have doubts..I don't think its funny, and it is a fact. the only downside is The rancher I book for is sold out about 3 years in advance but I can get you on the list..Every hunter has the first opertunity for a spot the following year and must declare at the end of his hunt. These 3 ranches are well managed, all over 100,000 ac. and they only have 3 hunters on each ranch per season. The deer are the owners hobby and he is proud of his deer herd and rightiouly so....If your in top condition and can walk many miles in sand, and can shoot, you will get a monster buck over 200 B&C..You will see them every day with a spotting scope then the walking,tracking starts.
$5500 fully guided. DK Boyd Land and Cattle Company, Midland, Texas..He is booked for 2009,2010, 2011, but he has another ranch in New Mexico that I can get two hunters on, but they would be on their own other than the foreman would give them a tour of the ranch and show them were the bucks hang out. you can stay in the bunkhouse and fix your own meals..I have seen some real big bucks on this ranch but its a hard hunt. $5500.

I have another ranch near there that will normally get you about a 160 to 180 with one or maybe two each year at 200. Easier hunting, spot and stalk mostly..$3000 for the hunt, $3000 for the kill. Flag Ranch, Billy Cole owner, Billy has a booth at Dallas every year..He is booked for 2009.

Both ranches have about a 60 to 70% success, and a lot depends on weather, range conditions etc. but most folks have about a 70 to 80% opertunity at a big buck..Shot are long and sometime difficult, but most folks that hunt hard see a big one..

I have a hunt in Montana, with a lot of deer, at $2000 per hunt and a very high success rate and a 30 incher is possible but very rare indeed..Most of these bucks are 25 to 26 inch spreads and would have to hump to make 150. It is a good hunt for sure and he runs a great tented camp with good food, but the bucks are average...

So Greenhorn, if you have any doubts then book a hunt with me at my price, send me a 50% deposit, and if the above view is not correct then I'll pay for your hunt. I don't candy coat my hunts and what I say they are is what you will get.

It's nice of you to offer such a great deal for me, but clearly you do this knowing that I wouldn't consider it, even if it were free. I'll rather put a few days into my $16 Montana license, in this state which has few trophy deer. I choose to spend my money wisely, and most importantly, my time.


Can you verify this claim? A quick look through the B&C trophy search will highlight annual entries from at least the correct county and state.

Can you verify this claim? A quick look through the B&C trophy search will highlight annual entries from at least the correct county and state.

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If you will look at the Boone and Crockett entries you will find that Texas has produced very few "record book" mule deer.

That being said, I am sure that the man offering this hunt has quite a few pictures to be able to verify his claim of having taken B&C deer every year. An advertiser on this website certainly wouldnt have to stretch the truth to sell a hunt here. The man that offered the hunt has said that he does not "candy coat" his hunts.

I for one would like to see these deer, big mule deer are hard to come by and if the hunt is as advertised it is priced well below market value

Please post the pictures and end Greenhorns doubt. If you do not know how to post pictures on the internet I would bet you could email the pictures to any number of members who would post them for you.

I can tell you that I grew up in this area Atkinson talks about, and know several of those ranches very well. I even hunted the Boyd ranch growing up. Deer of B&C proportions do in fact live there, but don't let the book be your sole source of information, as any avid mule deer hunter knows, many of the biggest mule deer bucks do not make the book, the the "book" can be (and is, IMO) overated. There are bucks killed in the 190"+ class every year in these areas I(we killed 2 190" class bucks last year here). It is a sleeper area for sure, with tightly controlled access, huge ranches, and many ranchers do not need the money here (oil royalties fill the bill nicely for them). Like he said, the deer are thinly dispersed over vast areas, much like Sonora. The big bucks are there, and the hunting can be brutal, but worth it.

Here's one from the area, Nov '09, a 230" class buck:
[img][IMG]http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t32/JGrimes_2007/GainesHammeheadbuck.jpg[/img][/img]

JG, I don't disagree with what you're saying. But if you're advertising "Boone and Crockett" bucks.. those do not include the almosts or coulda shouldas.

Ok. I don't know Atkinson personally, and maybe he should have said B&C "class" bucks. Would that have made you feel better? Just because you spend your money "wisely" as you said, doesn't hide the fact that B&C class deer are there.

If you have traveled at all widely hunting large mule deer (whether B&C,or B&C Class, or simply "old and large"),something a guy should have figured out by now is that your BEST chance for a TRULY large buck will likely be best in what I call "fringe" mule deer country.Maybe a lightly hunted ranch or other large acreage in some "non-traditional destination-type" place with low deer density,very low hunting pressure,plenty of escape cover,or a combination of factors that result in bucks being able to grow up,with excellent winter habitat to carry large bucks over from the rut,etc.

Sometimes the licenses in these areas are very tough to get(AZ Strip,Kaibab,etc); sometimes private and limited access creates these conditions.Sometimes it comes about because hunters are like "sheep",following the crowds to highly touted areas or "hot" outfitters,and ignoring the "fringe" habitat areas, like New Mexico,Texas, parts of Oklahoma,and hard to draw areas of Colorado,etc.

I have no doubt whatsoever that Ray has the deer he speaks of on these large, remote, difficult-to-hunt ranches in New Mexico, and Texas. I suspect that very few hunters really have the patience and determination to stay "off-the-trigger" for two weeks at a stretch,or devote the 2-4 years of burning tags it takes before you finally get a crack at a buck like JG posted a picture of.

Just because a guy goes someplace,hunts half-assed for 5 days(not enought time BTW)and does not see a big one,does not mean they are not there.....

BobinNH, I agree 100%. Your experience stands out in your posts.

Here's another one taken through my spotter. I could never catch up to this buck.

[img][IMG]http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t32/JGrimes_2007/NMidlandMulie.jpg[/img][/img]

Cicero,
Atkinson's pictures are on his website.

Oooohhh, Maaann! I know you're not supposed to judge them from behind.......but I'd blow a tag on THAT one.....I have made bigger mistakes in my life.

BTW, I could give a ratz asz what he scored

I think its a stretch to compare the hunting in the county where that deer was taken in the photo to the area where ole Ray is trying to book his hunts. That county was just opened to hunting this year and there were sure to be some giant deer killed. Look at what happened in Yoakum and Cochran counties when they were opened to hunting back in 97-98, they killed the state record in Yoakum that year, a 221 2/8" giant killed by Pat Beaird. It was the state record for 6 years until that freak in Reeves County was killed(283"). Yoakum and Cochran never produced like they did in the first couple years and while a couple good deer get killed every now and again the cream of the crop was skimmed off the top early.

I am kind of surprised that Ray is still trying to book mule deer hunts, he and I have gone round and round on another forum as to his advertising practices. He advertises a deer that a friend of mine killed many years ago, its on his website being held by the landowners wife, and he advertises it as a 234+ deer. The deer is a slob, but its not 234+, its a 207" deer and he killed it on an unguided hunt and its the best deer he's killed in that country and he was born and raised there. Ray claims it was killed 4 years ago but it was shot over a decade ago

There are only a handful of deer killed in Texas that qualify for the Boone and Crockett Record Book and while I completely agree with JGRaider that the "book" overrated, I have a problem with the claim that they kill 2-3 a year. Its simply not true.

All this being said, I have to give credit where credit is due, Ray and I had a fairly hated debate a couple of years ago when he claimed that the new "state record" was killed at the gate of one of the ranches he was booking for and I corrected him. He was talking about a deer that was killed in a closed county(same county that just opened this year) I know this because I wrote the article that was in Muley Crazy Magazine as well as Kings Hunting Illustrated. It wasnt close to that ranch. I am happy to see that he is not advertising with that deer anymore as it was poached. The article I wrote was called "Forbidden Fruit" and I will be more than happy to find the issue numbers if anybody is interested.

If your looking to hunt this area of Texas you need to go in with realistic expectations. Ray says that "I have 3 ranches in Texas owned by the same people and they shoot 3 bucks each year and all are over 200 B&C but your not allowed to shoot lesser bucks." If your not allowed to shoot deer less that 200" then I think you'd have almost as much luck on a Unicorn hunt on the same ranch. The country has produced them but a 200" deer anywhere is tough, much less desert country where the densities are low

This area has,in the past,produced the kind of deer you couldnt expect in several lifetimes of hunting, the odds of finding that kind of deer would be similar to winning the Lotto somewhere. To place an expectation on a 200" deer anywhere other than the Arizona Strip or maybe the Henry Mountains with the very best guides available is simply irresponsible, even in those areas 200" can be a tough expectation to meet and exceed

With all due respect to Ray, I am not trying to get into an arguement with anybody, merely expressing an opinion based on many years of chasing the biggest mule deer in the best country available.

Drummond Lindsey

Welcome Drum!
Glad to see you are still kickin.
I don't know Ray, but will vouge for HuntSonora as a straight shooter.
(HH)

I will vouch for Huntsonora also. I find him to be very knowledgable. I cannot argue with the points he has made here either. You're absolutley correct about it being the first hunting season in that particular county. I personally saw pictures on the game wardens camera of at least 10 bucks over 200" that came from there during that first season. It will definitely not continue. Like I said before, I do not know Ray Atkinson at all, but I do know the DK Boyd Ranch he speaks of. This is a huge chunk of ground (375 sections private). I do not know what has been killed there the past couple of years, but it does have the potential. My intention was not to promote anything. I was merely trying to point out that there are 190"+ bucks killed in the surrounding counties every year on well managed places. I agree 100% that advertising B&C deer every year is risky business for sure.

Did you catch it now? It's called reality.. and sometimes it is very funny.

Reality is there are 190'+ bucks killed here every year. We killed 2 last year. I like reality. My advice would be to stay in Montana and take your chances. I like my chances better down here.

huntsonora,
Welcome to the campfire, and it seems you bring a lot of good experience and knowledge.

Mule deer hunting today,if you want a big buck, seems like a game of more and more hunters vying for an ever-diminshing and smaller slice of the same pie.....kinda like the popularity explosion and wild price increases that followed sheep hunting for quite awhile.

This is why I put in for my buddy's ranch in Wyoming each year (we've killed bucks that gross over 190 there but I would not want to bet on it each year), but otherwise I just go to Canada.They may not have the widespread Utah,Colorado, or AZ monsters that a handful of hunters kill each year,but at least I know the quality is there,even if it is still not easy ( but then again they might!)

And "yes" the B&C scoring system leaves a lot of truly great bucks languishing on the side-lines. One look at the present world record typical whitetail tells you that....great buck, but thin,lacks great character.But I'd a shot him,too