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#2860652 - 03/04/09 07:34 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Blacktail53]
Jeff_O Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 26248
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
I love that picture...

What's your load again, BT53?
_________________________
Aim small, miss small
Think small, miss big

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#2860786 - 03/04/09 08:15 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Jeff_O]
Bulletbutt Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 10262
Loc: Between Seafire and Scott F
You guys sound like a bunch of little kids gathered around a fire and talking about your "big elk rifles"...while your dads are off cleaning their REAL elk rifles...the 35 Whelens!
Couldn't resist.
_________________________
I saw a movie where only the military and the police had guns. It was called Schindler's List.

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#2861019 - 03/04/09 10:48 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Jeff_O]
Blacktail53 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2257
Loc: Southern Oregon
 Originally Posted By: Jeff_O
I love that picture...

What's your load again, BT53?


Jeff, I love it too, that's why I keep throwing it out there. I guess <g>

A max load of W748...not near as fast as some of yours and Loggers loads, but fast enough.
_________________________
BT53
"Where do they find young men like this?" Reporter Savidge, Iraq

Elk, it's what's for dinner....



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#2861033 - 03/04/09 11:09 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Craftsman]
Ready Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 12/21/08
Posts: 4564
 Originally Posted By: Craftsman
Daryl, I thought the same thing that the Hornady 200 gr spire point would work very well at 358 velocity. No big need for a premium bullet. I have to admit that I will test the Barnes TSX as well since it has been so accurate in other calibers.

Reba, I intend to use a 1.5 - 5X scope as well.


I would get a BLR in .358 rather sooner than later. The lack of real world data for:

.358 Win with 200gr. TSX /225gr. TSX from the 20" BLR barrel

keeps me, yet.

I recognize, one does not need TSX at those speeds.

Still, Iwould be very interested in your loads and the speeds you are getting.

Please keep us posted.

Good Luck


Edited by cmg (03/04/09 11:09 PM)
_________________________
...aim.

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#2862834 - 03/05/09 03:59 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Ready]
Jeff_O Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 26248
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
CMG,

From a 20" Pac-Nor barrel I can touch 2500 fps with 225-gn bullets, and get 2640 fps with 200-gn bullets. These are actual speeds. I use IMR4895 for 225's and RL7 for 200's. JB reports speeds well into the 2500's with TAC and 225's but I have not personally tried it. Not a knock on Mr. Barsness, but I've rarely been able to even come close to other people's speeds in my .358's- they report one thing, I get something much, much less... so I'll believe it when I see it! :-) TAC is on my "to try" list, for sure, though.

IMR4895 does deliver 2500 fps, though.

I did mess with the 200gn X bullet, pre TSX, in my .358's. Velocities were similar to jacketed 200's; I'd have to dig way back in my notes for specifics, but that's a general statement of truth <g>.

My opinion- a 225 TSX is going to be painfully long in many .358's. It's gonna cost you some significant velocity. Case capacity is a bugaboo us .358 guys rassle with. WIth 225 Partitions, I am able to pack 51 grains of powder into the case and that gets me right up to 2480 fps. This is a HIGHLY compressed load; 51 grains won't even fit in the .358 case without some shenanigans, to put it in perspective.

Anyway, I have not DONE it, but the extra length of the TSX is gonna cost you 4-5 grains of powder, minimum, and that's gonna put you under 2400 fps.

That's what would happen in the two .358's I've owned and loaded for. If your rifle has a long magazine, it might not matter one bit. Just load them out longer.

Finally... I get the TSX thing; but seriously... at these types of velocities, what exactly is the worry with a 225-gn Partition?? That sucker is going to PENETRATE, and will most likely expand more reliably at those speeds too. My opinion.
_________________________
Aim small, miss small
Think small, miss big

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#2869185 - 03/08/09 10:09 AM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Jeff_O]
Blacktail53 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2257
Loc: Southern Oregon
Jeff O,

My thoughts exactly.
I didn't try the TSX, simply because I knew the NP would be softer and more likely to upset if I needed to throw it at something way out there. Also, I run the Sierra 225 spbt with the same load and even better accuracy, for practice and incidental deer strafing.
If there's any difference in drop to 300 (farthest I've played with) I can't see it and the loads are inner changeable without re-sighting. One rifle, one load, two bullet options.

I had the .358 out yesterday looking to fill my damage elk permit. Our winter has been funky here and the elk have not spent much time on the property that the tag is good for. Time is running out (Mar 31)!
Shooting op's can be as far as I feel comfortable, but I'll stalk if I spot them from a distance. Most likely it will be in the oaks at fairly close range and whatever angle is presented.

I haven't and don't intend to play with other bullets. I don't see a need for them. These two cover all the bases I see for that cartridge and use. If I want to target deer, I'll drag out the .270 and hone the buck knife.

My biggest challenge (worry) is that I have to be sure of my back ground behind the targeted animal, because that NP will pass through on all but "stem to stern" shots and I don't want to hit another elk by accident!
_________________________
BT53
"Where do they find young men like this?" Reporter Savidge, Iraq

Elk, it's what's for dinner....



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#2869384 - 03/08/09 11:27 AM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Blacktail53]
NFG Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 406
I knew an ol' boy that used a 250-300 Sav 99, 100 gr Rem Corelokts, to gather up his elk...deer...moose...chicken killing anything...don't see why anyone would think 358 W wouldn't do well...my Marlin 336 in 356 W doesn't seem to be bothered much in taking anything it gets pointed at...and in the old days, a 22 LR would do the job if you stuck one in the eye into the brain...if you could shoot well enough.

The 358W is a very good medium caliber when used with 225-250 gr bullets at a modest velocity and range. It's not bad with lighter bullets, 180-200 gr, I just prefer the heavier ones. I never could figure out why people extoled the virtues of the 308 and bad mouthed the 358...same as the 30-06 vs 35 Whelen...all of them will take most of the worlds game without a problem...as long as the bullet was placed correctly!!!

Enjoy your toys...all of them...which ever you have.

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#2870388 - 03/08/09 06:12 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Blacktail53]
olhippie Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 01/02/06
Posts: 1733
Loc: Georgia
 Originally Posted By: Blacktail53
Yup...

225 NP from my Sako .358 win.
...That 358 hit'em so hard the eyes bugged out!....I saw shades of old John Wooters his Sako 308 full stock favorite in hand, when I spied your Sako dandy in the photo...

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#2870448 - 03/08/09 06:29 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Jeff_O]
Ready Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 12/21/08
Posts: 4564
JeffO and others,

thank you very much for the replys. It all puts it into perspective. From your reports I deduct, 200 gr. TSX might be more feasible. W/o rifle to play with, I am thinking, it just might make more sense for me then to get the BLR .308, load it with 180 TSX and be done. Kind of a shame. .358 always appealed to me. The TSXs I want for dog work where I appretiate a bullet that a) does not shed mass and b) penetrates straight, so I can avert danger from my dog.

Thanks again for your help.


Edited by cmg (03/08/09 06:31 PM)
Edit Reason: thought of something else...
_________________________
...aim.

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#2870481 - 03/08/09 06:43 PM Re: 358 Win on elk [Re: Ready]
Judman Offline
Member

Registered: 12/08/08
Posts: 192
Loc: Chehalis, Washington
Under 300 yards, its perty damn good... Rosie bull, 225 SGK @ 2500fps

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