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I am trying to set up an aoudad hunt on public land for 2010. I believe that New Mexico is the only place that this type of hunt would be possible(over the counter tags, with public land available)but I might be wrong. I would like to know if any one has tried this before and what units in New Mexico would be best. Also any other information would be grately appreciated (like best time of year to hunt). Also what bullet would you recommend for Aoudad in a 7mm remington mag? Thanks for your replies.


Last edited by LeftHunter; 06/28/09.
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Barbary tags are no longer OTC for public land. They were included in the draw this year. Private land tags can still be bought OTC, but it's hard to gain access to most of those ranches with sheep on them without paying. Units 30 & 32 are the primary units containing sheep with a few herds to the west in unit 34.

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Sprint is right about Barbary going to a draw. Last season was the last season to buy over the counter. There are still over the counter statewide year round tags that are good for all the units that aren't in the LE units(SE NM). Sheep are pretty scatterd though and require a lot of scouting and even more luck! As far as bullets go, Barbary do tend to soak up lead but,like everything else, any good hunting bullet put in the right spot will put them down. I shoot accubonds in my 7mag but looking to try the 168 bergers this season.


"I used to be a tired hunting guide, now I'm just a re-tired hunting guide"


"No eternal reward will forgive us now, for wasting the dawn" JM

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I think that unit 9 is still an OTC tag. I was up there this last weekend and could have killed a a 28-29 inch ram. He was with 24 ewes and little ones. Not hunting sheep, looking for tahr. Unit 9 is a rough dirty SOB for where the sheep are, but it is a fun hunt.

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Thanks for the replies so far. I am trying to talk to someone in the New Mexico Game and Fish department to better understand which areas still have OTC tags but all I have gotten so far are recordings. If you don't mind me asking what is the best area in unit 9? Also what amount of time should I alot for this hunt? I could probably spend 1-2 weeks strait on this hunt. I am also planning on this being a backpack in backpack out type of hunt. Is this a good assumption?

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PM sent.

Toby Joe

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Toby joe,

Are you sure you were in NM? Tahr?


Lefthunter,

Water canyon area.

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Its not a secret. They escaped out of the Water Canyon high fence several years ago. Theres not alot of them, but I know several people who have seen and killed them. There is an established population of them, it is just very low. Do some research if you dont believe me.

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LOL. I did. Sure enough they are there. Dammit,,,,now I have to start scouting for another hunt!

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Where you from in NM?

Toby Joe

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Albuquerque.

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Tobyjoe and Spirit11,
I have hunted these barberys along the slopes of the southern sac mnts and they are a bitch. I have even ventured out onto the eastern plain out way below (20-30 miles) mayhill. They are there, I just never caught up with one. One ol' rancher from the mayhill area told me good luck...you will need fast horses and magnum rifles.
The thing that pisses me off to extreme is that NM must delete this foreign animal from our shores... and that is not a raciest statement. Because NMF&G will not introduce NATIVE desert bighorn sheep where the the aoudad runs amok. My opinion...shoot them all...over the counter license sales $10 a tag. Yet I forgot, NMF&G would rather not take a Leopoldian Gila stance in the world, in trade for, profit and running the largest exotic game ranch in the world at the expense of the rancher and his cows. Shoot those sumbitches, I want healthy desert bighorn.
But, that is just my opinion.
LNF!%)

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LNF I don't have much to comment on, but anytime we get a native back over an exotic, I agree.

Except for the edibililty of the Chital or Axis...


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Last time I looked, we were talking about the sheep in unit 9 and Mt Taylor, not Mayhill, Roswell or Ruidoso. I dont think that they could kill all the sheep out of unit 9 if they tried. Its been an over the counter tag for years, and they still dont kill many. Its too rough, and most people wont go through the effort to find them, or hunt them. If they are not on the road, they dont see them. I would be for the desert big horn deal, but chances that you will ever draw one of those tags, even if they stalked every Mountain range in NM with Bighorns, is very low, and probably will never happen. I would rather hunt Audads, whenever I wanted, save my money, and go to Canada, or somewhere that I can buy a bighorn tag. And not have to jack with the idiots of NMDGF. Being an outfitter in NM, Im get real tired of the pencil pusher game biologists telling me whats best for our game herds, and they dont even know which end the [bleep] comes out of the animals that they are trying to manage. JMHO

Toby Joe

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rost, I'm just pissin' and moanin'!\
But, in the NM Desert Bighorn Mgnt Plan it says (the guad mnts are just sse of the southern sac mnts):

Guadalupe Mountains (Table 5, Figure 2). While this range is comprised of good quality
bighorn sheep habitat, and had native bighorn until the 1940�s, the presence of domestic and
Barbary sheep currently preclude reintroduction of desert bighorn sheep [see Domestic sheep and
goats and Exotic ungulates] (Sandoval 1979a). Private landowners once grazed thousands of
domestic sheep. With the decreased value of wool, this number has dramatically declined,
however, many landowners retain domestics and numbers could increase should the wool market
rebound. There are an estimated 400-770 Barbary sheep in the Guadalupe Mountains with even
greater numbers north of the range. Until domestic sheep are eliminated or double fenced, and
Barbary sheep are eliminated or substantially reduced, this mountain range will not be viable
habitat.
Sacramento Mountains (Table 5, Figure 2). There have been no historic reports of bighorn on
this mountain, however there are reports of their presence starting in the 1930s (Sandoval
1979a). Bighorn habitat is limited but the range could support a small bighorn population.
Presence of domestic sheep, Barbary sheep, and feral goats currently preclude transplants to this
area [see Guadalupe Mountains] (Sandoval 1979a).

Or:

Exotic Ungulates. Aoudads, also referred to as Barbary sheep, are native to North Africa, and
were released in the Hondo Valley, Largo Canyon, and the Canadian River drainage between
1955-1970 (Ogren 1962). Viable populations have become established in historic bighorn
habitat in the Guadalupe and Sacramento Mountains. Aoudads are occasionally sighted in desert
bighorn habitats in the San Andres Mountains. They compete with desert bighorn due to their
higher rate of increase, ability to subsist on lower quality forage, and preference for habitat
similar to that of bighorn (Seegmiller and Simpson 1979). Aoudads are socially aggressive when
they encounter bighorn and may disrupt the rut. The potential for aoudads to transmit diseases to
bighorn is unclear. It is NMDGF policy to eliminate aoudads that occur in bighorn sheep habitat.
Persian wild goats, also known as ibex, were released in the Florida Mountains in 1970.
Originally from Iran, they have been sighted in the Do�a Ana Mountains 12 miles west of
occupied range in the San Andres Mountains, and a skull was recovered in the Alamo Hueco
Mountains in 1997. Like aoudads, Persian wild goats are a potential competitor with desert
bighorn sheep. A desert bighorn sheep, assumed to be from the Fra Cristobal population, was
captured while running with a group of feral Caprids (Spanish goat/ibex crosses) on the Ladder
Ranch in south central New Mexico in 1999. The potential for disease transmission exists,
however Persian wild goats housed adjacent to desert bighorn sheep at Red Rock in the early
1970�s were able to go nose-to-nose with desert bighorn with no documented disease
transmission. Both aoudads and Persian wild goats are potential alternate prey items that may
subsidize mountain lion populations to the detriment of native desert bighorn sheep. These
species also occupy former desert bighorn sheep habitat, precluding reintroduction into those
ranges.
Gemsbok, also referred to as oryx, were released onto WSMR between 1969 and 1977. Oryx,
originally from Africa, have expanded their range into rocky foothills that overlap bighorn
habitats in the San Andres Mountains and have moved into flat terrain on the periphery of
bighorn habitat in the Fra Cristobal Mountains. Although oryx are unlikely to be major
competitors with desert bighorn, the potential for disease transmission [see Diseases] and the
possibility for oryx to be alternate prey for mountain lions exists. Oryx calves, hunter-wounded
oryx, and oryx gut piles left by hunters may subsidize mountain lion diets, keeping the number of
mountain lions in these areas artificially high. Oryx have been observed in high elevations
(>6500�) in the San Andres Mountains on a regular basis, overlapping with desert bighorn
habitat. The Oryx Management Plan (NMDGF 2000) signed by NMDGF and WSMR
recommends the reduction of oryx in bighorn habitat.

Reference:

http://www.wildlife.state.nm.us/conservation/documents/everythingfinalBighornSheepPlan.pdf

Shoot those damn exotics, not state run greed for their existance over the natives. Come on, NM G&F! If you want to hunt big game in Africa then go to Africa or Persia, but give our native wildlife a break from these foriegn herbivors.
LNF150

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LNF, I agree to a point. NMDGF should be doing something to enhance the Desert Sheep populations in NM! Basically all we have is a feeding program for lions!As far as reintro protocol there are few ranges that historically had deserts and now have Barbary. The Guadalupes no doubt would be perfect except for the fact that much of that country is still Domestic sheep country and there are way too many lions in that country to support a reintro there (unless we want to change up the lion diet!) These Barbary fill a niche here in SE NM that is great for hunters. Now SW NM as well as a few central ranges are a different story. Which is why there are still otc tags. NMDGF also have a shoot on sight policy to kill wandering Barbary in Desert Ranges.Like I said, I agree, I wish every mountain range from the Organs to the AZ state line had a viable-huntable Desert herd, but it's not really the Barbary's fault that there isn't. I love sheep hunting, Barbary and hopefully, one day, Deserts but I promise everytime I glass up a big Barbary ram I pretend I just found a 180 Desert!


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"No eternal reward will forgive us now, for wasting the dawn" JM

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That is so true about the Barbary in 9, I have hunted them many times and about the time you think you have them figured they all but vanish. I have only caught a glimpse of the tahr but I will keep trying till it all comes together.

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Tobyjoe, I understand your pissed off-ness from my off topic from your Unit 9 to my unit 34. And yes you are right we may never live to draw out and shoot a desert big horn, but maybe our children or grandchildren would if the dark continent competition wasn't there. If you think about it, the oryx, ibex and barbary started from very small populations and look where we are at now. Shoot those down and bring back the desert big horns in small populations and in 40 years (just like the nonnatives) you will have big huntable wild populations of native bighorn sheep. Helicopter gunning is the eviction notice.
LNF!%)

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NMpistolero,
I know I have stirred up a hornet nest of disenting opinion, but the lion pop in the guad is a simple predator/prey relationship. Nuke the aoudad's out of existance in that area and that will cycle down the lion pop or they will have to move elsewhere. Puma concolor is not an endangered species, in fact, it ranges from far North America (canada) down to Terra de Feugo. Seriously mnt. lions are a dime a dozen in the northern and southern hemisphere, shoot them too...they are not as rare as the genetics of desert big horns. Very common. The trick of the whole thing is to provide spaces for longevity and genetic diversity...in terms of this 'southern' big horn sheep. Who give a rat's patoot about cougers, domestic sheep, barbery's, Ibex or oryx if we can't just have an essential piece of the puzzle. The big cats thrive off what nonnatives we provide. Is that not the truth?

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You did not stir up a hornets nest with me. Im just for the more animals to shoot at, the better, as far as Im concerned. I know that Bighorns are a delicate species, prone to disease and infection, but there has to be a way for both to survive. Audads and bighorns coexsist in West Texas, and there are very large numbers of audads there. NMDGF just needs to pull there heads out of their arse, kill every lion, coyote, and predator breathing air in the sheep units, and start stocking.

Toby Joe

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