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#3170980 - 07/21/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: FVA]
GregW Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 08/03/05
Posts: 9810
Loc: Southern Arizona
It was a good one...
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#3178226 - 07/24/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Toms22]
selmer Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/04/02
Posts: 6032
Loc: Upper Midwest
Buy a .22/250.
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#3181544 - 07/26/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: selmer]
dogcatcher223 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 03/30/05
Posts: 14145
Loc: Kolorado
Seems to be a lot of variation in FPS on this thread. My 223AI has a 22" tube, and shooting 40's I am getting around 3850 with 30grs of H335.
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#3182179 - 07/26/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: dogcatcher223]
Enios Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/13/09
Posts: 265
Loc: NE Alabama
Originally Posted By: dogcatcher223
Seems to be a lot of variation in FPS on this thread. My 223AI has a 22" tube, and shooting 40's I am getting around 3850 with 30grs of H335.

My thoughts also, seems a tight chamber can give you an extra 300 to 400fps because you can overload them. Very surprising since most of the time I only see around 30fps speed increase with .5 increase in powder with a 26" and 28" barrel. Without a custom chamber and without custom bullets the best accuracy loads with speed in our 223s is right around 3650fps with a 40 gr. Then again it could be my chrony. We are shooting them across a Chrony Alpha master and a Millennium and either one is within a few fps of the other. I have attained speeds up to 3700 with overloads but the accuracy wouldn't be there. I might also add I've never saw a Hart Barrel that wasn't a tack driver and while I've only seen a 1/2 dozen personally and got to shoot a couple should I chose to build a rifle it would be my first choice. If you added 4" to you barrel you would be doing close to 4000 with your's.
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#3185418 - 07/27/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Enios]
dogcatcher223 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 03/30/05
Posts: 14145
Loc: Kolorado
I can hit 4000 with my 22-250AI, so I never really cared what my 223AI was doing. That being said, I still cannot hit the magical 4k with my 204...It too is running around 3850-3900 with 35's and a 24" tube. Coyotes don't seem to care though. smile
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#3185893 - 07/28/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: dogcatcher223]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5797
Loc: Montana
my .223 AI rifles have 1-8" twist (22.5" Brux) and 1-7" (22" Hart). my interests lie more with getting 2850-2950 fps with the 75 grain A-Max. easy enough to do in my AO, but this gets me to 1K at mach 1.125 and 34 moa.

dont' get me wrong, the fast twist and the 55 grain V-Max (case forming load) shoots MOA at 500 meters, and the fast twist aids in making varmint confetti, but hinders velocity somewhat. i let the rifle tell me where maximum is, and i work with that. if that is less than some others get, so be it. the LRF has reduced the need for max velocity IMO.
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#3186974 - 07/28/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: FVA]
Hawk_Driver Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 3614
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Got just over 3800 out of a Rem 700 with a 26 inch tube that I used to own, 40 gr V-Max using AA2460, very, very accurate as well.
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#3187943 - 07/28/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Hawk_Driver]
FVA Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 7322
Loc: NY
I get 3900 and change out of a 22" 223AI with 40 gr. NBT's.
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#3188776 - 07/29/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: FVA]
DakotaDeer Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 01/19/05
Posts: 14873
Using the new Nosler 35 grain lead free might gain a few more fps.

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#3207946 - 08/06/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: FVA]
whelennut Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 09/15/06
Posts: 4796
Loc: Minnesota
Originally Posted By: FVA
which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps?

The powder that is in a 22-250 case.


Good one! laugh
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#3217626 - 08/10/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: whelennut]
Seafire Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 04/21/04
Posts: 21300
Loc: Southern Oregon USA
no one mentioned the 30 grain HP Bergers.. they are as long as a Nosler 40 grain BT... they can be run at 4000 fps...

I have hit 4000 fps consistently with a 40 grain bullet using RL 7.
It had good accuracy also... but most of my needs don't require that MV...

heck I run most of my 22.250s at the upper ends of what most people run their 223s....

I like stretching out barrel life more than getting MACH 10 velocities...
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#3217966 - 08/10/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Seafire]
VarmintGuy Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 05/23/03
Posts: 7313
Loc: SW Montana
Seafire: I also live by the credo - don't burn out your barrels!
But consistent 4,000 F.P.S. shooting from a 223 case ain't gonna achieve that.
I also get great accuracy and lethality on Varmints with bullets at much lower velocitites.
Most of my 220 Swifts are "pokin" along at 22-250 velocities as well.
Save the steel!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
P.S.: At the just concluded Missoula, Montana Gunshow I saw several sets of 223 WSSM dies for sale!
One set I nearly bought was a new set of Redding dies in 223 WSSM with an "asking price" of $20.00!
Another set of RCBS dies appeared to be new/as new and had an asking price of $15.00!!!
I don't have, nor do I want a 223 WSSM, but I was tempted to buy those dies anyway.

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#3218509 - 08/10/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: DakotaDeer]
Grand Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 11/14/05
Posts: 2477
Loc: Central Cal.
Originally Posted By: DakotaDeer
Using the new Nosler 35 grain lead free might gain a few more fps.


My experience has been that the lighter weight is offset by the longer bearing surface. I reach the about the same velocity and pressure with 36g Varmint Grenades as I do with 40g V-maxes. Perhaps the Nosler will yield different results.
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#3230010 - 08/15/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Grand]
RockyRaab Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 05/23/03
Posts: 14776
Loc: Ogden, Utah
The whole idea is ludicrous. Absurdly dangerous, to boot.

If it could be done safely, every ammo maker would be doing it already.
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#3233929 - 08/17/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: VarmintGuy]
Seafire Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 04/21/04
Posts: 21300
Loc: Southern Oregon USA
Originally Posted By: VarmintGuy
Seafire: I also live by the credo - don't burn out your barrels!
But consistent 4,000 F.P.S. shooting from a 223 case ain't gonna achieve that.
I also get great accuracy and lethality on Varmints with bullets at much lower velocitites.
Most of my 220 Swifts are "pokin" along at 22-250 velocities as well.
Save the steel!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
P.S.: At the just concluded Missoula, Montana Gunshow I saw several sets of 223 WSSM dies for sale!
One set I nearly bought was a new set of Redding dies in 223 WSSM with an "asking price" of $20.00!
Another set of RCBS dies appeared to be new/as new and had an asking price of $15.00!!!
I don't have, nor do I want a 223 WSSM, but I was tempted to buy those dies anyway.


I have noticed bargain basement prices on WSSM die sets and brass locally also..... for anyone who has them, seems like they had better stock up now... won't be around long...

I never warmed up to the concept of the WSSM either...

played with the idea of necking a 25 WSSM to 6.5 mm... but after checking out powder capacity found out that it holds no more than a 260 Rem held... so why bother?????
_________________________
Originally Posted By Rauncho_Bozo:

I run rigs harder than you can ever dream of, and have NEVER needed to replace valve cover gaskets as a routine maintenance item. Even under severe duty schedules.. Nor has ANYONE I've ever known.

UBER!!!




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#3235158 - 08/17/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Seafire]
MZ5 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 795
Loc: Arizona, USA
The 270 WSM, on the other hand, is kind of a neat .264" cartridge.

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#3242469 - 08/20/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Toms22]
RugerDude Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 07/14/09
Posts: 298
Loc: Northeast Oregon
dont bother. if you want more velocity go to a .22-250 or down to a .204, the .204 will easily top 4 grand with 40 gr bullets, and the 40 grain .204 bullets have higher B.C.'s. you are doing something with this cartrige that it wasnt intended to do, this means more wear and tear, and a potentially unsafe situation. at a very MINIMUM have your chamber Akley Improved.

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#3273537 - 09/03/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Toms22]
keith Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 02/08/02
Posts: 4417
Benchmark is slow, you will never get there.

N133 with a thick cup primer in Lapua brass is the key...accuracy is astounding to say the least.

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#3277981 - 09/04/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: keith]
keith Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 02/08/02
Posts: 4417
I wanted to add this comment, there is a world of difference between a factory chamber and a custom Minimum SAAMI Match chamber with minimum throat and freebore. Even 40x Chambers are huge as a general rule of thumb.

We have seen super velocities and accuracies cut from Minimum spec chambers in Varmint and big game caliber, even when Stainless factory barrels were re-chambered when new.

Shooting the 40's at 4000 is no big deal, but it does take specific things to accomplish it, minimum chamber, little longer barrel length, tough brass such as IMI or Lapua, N133, and tough cup primer, 1-14 twist barrel.

4200 out of the 223 AI with the same data above again is no big deal.

N133 is magic in speed in conjunction with extreme accuracy, usually 150 fps faster than benchmark.

These stats are usually contemplated by a guy that is considering converting to a 204 when he already has all the "stuff" for a 223.

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#3278866 - 09/05/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: keith]
FVA Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 7322
Loc: NY

Yeah.Yeah.
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#3279601 - 09/05/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: RugerDude]
Mulerider Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 181
Loc: central TX
Originally Posted By: 35_PBBK
dont bother. if you want more velocity go to a .22-250 or down to a .204, the .204 will easily top 4 grand with 40 gr bullets


Really? I think VV list one load at or near 4k with a 39/40gr pill, and that is the exception.
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#3280340 - 09/06/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: keith]
HawkI Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 06/10/07
Posts: 16057
Loc: The Hawkeye State
Originally Posted By: keith
Benchmark is slow, you will never get there.

N133 with a thick cup primer in Lapua brass is the key...accuracy is astounding to say the least.
confused

I'd rather run a 22-250; even get risky with a 225 Winny or 22 Zipper/Wasp.

What, by chance, is a "thick cup primer"? IME its a Rem. 7.5 or mil-spec CCI. Benchmark is too slow?

The AI 223 and 222 Mag will run close enough without magic primers, powder, cases and custom chambers for the latter. Better yet, magical pressure limits are not really needed either. Benchmark and slower fuel at above SAAMI spec is too slow? eek

Running 4,200 from a 223 begs for a larger case, and they're out there.

Am waiting to see recommended loads for 50 grainers at 3,850 from the std. 223 case now...the 22-250 is obsolete.


Edited by HawkI (09/06/09)
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#3280744 - 09/06/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: keith]
Rog Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 07/04/09
Posts: 417
Loc: east kootenay
so my .223 beats the nieghbors .220 wow is my .223 faster than my hunting budies .22-250 AI? who'da thunk? You know what I think there's lots dreams in this world and dreamers not a few.
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#3280867 - 09/06/09 Re: which powder for .223 that will get 4000 fps [Re: Rog]
Iraklion Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 06/09/08
Posts: 1107
From a standard 223 you will be hard pressed to do this SAFELY. With H335 and a 40gr bt with a 26" tube I did get 4040 fps from my 223 Ackley.

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