Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles A look at the 338 Federal 3 years later.

Well folks it's been a few years since the 338 federal was commercialized and we have learned a lot, but still have more to go. And not only that, but anyone with an interest in the 338 Fed must have come to some conclusion that maybe goes against what they have been hearing. So here are my thoughts/questions/comments...

1)Why the 210 grain Nosler Partition???
This is a bullet designed for deep penetration with a high impact velocity. The Fed spits the 210 Part. out at a mediocre velocity. So why the the 210 Partition???

2)Has anyone actually chronographed factory ammo through a 338 Fed? With the mild velocity of the Fed., all fps count! Did the people at Federal lie to sell rifles???

3)People have been killing some big animals with the 338 Federal, but nothing big at ranges more than 150 yards or so... Does somebody wanna sponsor me so I can retrieve data??? I want dead bull elk at 250-300 yards... Elk hunting can be a long range affair! Right? Is the Fed and elk cartridge or not?

4)IMR 8208 XBR???-I need to try this stuff out. I want my Fed. to shoot my 200 grain Hornady's atleast 2600 fps. That would put some air in my tires for sure. Anybody beat me to the punch??

So gents, and ladies, what ya think?

I've got a bud who uses a Montana in 338 fed a bit. he took a nice bull a couple of years ago with the 185 TSX factory load. He got the bull down (330 yds or so) but if i recall right it took a bit of doing.

As well the 185 TSX didn't exit on a shot that I would of thought that it would of. What's all this mean, nothing really as he could see something different on the next 15 elk he shoots...

Side note, he told me that the 185 TSX factory ammo is clocking in the mid 25's for him. Now that kind of suprised me as I thought it would of been a lot more. To me, this is perhaps a reason why the bullet didn't exit on a shot I felt that it should. And I'm one who really likes to have two holes on critters.

Bottom line, I love 33's and this is still a hella cool lil round.

Does anyone make a factory load with a CNC bullet in it?

Dober

I've had mine since 2007...a Ruger 77 Mk II RSI with a PacNor barrel. To answer your questions in order, what I know anything about:

1) I haven't used Partitions since 1982 or '83, because I don't like either their level of accuracy or performance in game. So that's not an issue to me. I do shoot 200 gr Hornady Interlocks, and they run about 2550 fps out of my 18.5" barrel. They also kill game very nicely.

2)The 185 TSX and 200 gr Fusion factory loads seem to shoot right about where they claim. My handloads are just a hair faster.

3) Don't plan to sponsor anyone hunting, except maybe my wife and daughters . I would have exactly zero qualms about shooting elk at 300 yards with either the 185 TSX at starting at 2600 fps or the 200 Hornady starting at 2550 fps. I did take it elk hunting one day this past fall, but didn't get a shot.

4) I use Re 15 pretty much exclusively in the .338 Fed these days. I tried some others, but the combination of accuracy and velocity is hard to beat. If I had a 22" barrel, breaking 2600 fps with a 200 gr Hornady would be a snap-simple event with Re 15.

I think that the .338 Fed is one of the better cartridges brought out in a long time, and I am very fond of mine. Here's a deer I killed two falls ago with mine...



I like it a lot...

Dennis

nobody is killing anything big with it out past 150 because it is not intended to shoot anything period past that distance. if you want to kill things further out why not a proven .335 win mag? dont ask the federal to do what it isnt intended to do, and you will not be dissapointed

Right...

Ummm...I shot that buck at about 225 yards, and it didn't seem to be much of a problem. I wouldn't shoot elk much past about 300-350 yards with a .338 Fed -- but then I wouldn't shoot at them past that range with any cartridge, unless they're already wounded. I suspect if you talk with Federal factory people (hint...I have, including the one who developed the cartridge for them) you will find they have no sense you should limit using the .338 Federal to under 150 yards. They will, in fact, express significantly different viewpoints.

Call them up and tell us what they told you...

Dennis

What are the real world velocities one should achieve with a 20" barreled 338 Federal?

To Jeffrey and the boys! Here we go!

OK!......I happen to do some reloading for a friend of mine who owns a 338 Federal chambered in a Ruger Frontier compact (target grey) carbine with a 16.5" barrel. For short, to moderate and out to medium ranges hunting in brush, timbers, from stands etc, this cartridge and rifle is about as an ideal and excellent combo as you can get.

So far to my friend`s credit and to his rifle`s credit, he has a bull moose kill at about 185 yards, a couple of black bears and has killed numerous hogs in my presence as we hunt hogs together.

Let`s put the 338 Federal in proper context or perspective.

It does very well for what is was designed to do. It is a short to moderate to medium ranged big game cartridge. It is not a 338 Win Mag. Though I personally wouldn`t try for a moose or bull elk at 300 yards with this cartridge and opt to get closer, that does not mean it couldn`t be done.

Simply put, if one wants a more than adequate 250-300 yard and beyond elk and moose round, there are better choices than the 338 Federal.

But at the same time, rather than throwing the 338 Fed under the bus in lieu of the more powerful 338s, let`s not discard the 338 Federal and give it some credit where credit is certainly due.

It is an excellent and ideal cartridge for what it was "DESIGNED" to do, chambered in the shorter actioned and in some cases, shorter and handier rifles! It is not a long range round!

Mine is a 21" 338Fed and I get 2550fps with a 200gr Hornady IL. As evidenced by the "257 Weatherby thread", I do not push my handloads real hard. I think there is room icrease the MV, but I have no need to do that. I've killed a whooping two deer with it this year at 5 yards and 25 yards. Not real "long range." I did get nice exit holes and I think I had burned hair on the close one! I posted all my work up using IMR4895, RE15 and W748 with 185TSX, 210NP and the above mentioned bullet. Try searching through my posts. I'll try to find it also. I would be comfortable shooting at an elk at 300 yds with my 338Fed.

Despite the above post, it will work out past 150yds.

RH

Have used one for two years. Kimber and load with W748 and RL15 with 210ttsx. Shoots into under 1.5. Don't chrono, so can't tell you much on fps. It's up around book top and is what it is.

Bought it for a short to mid-range handy rifle, and the two deer it has killed didn't go more than 10feet and that was flopping on the one. One from front and out back hip at around 70yards. The other a head shot.

There are better LR calibers, but out to 300 or a little more, it should work if you stick the bullet properly.

I like it for what I want it to do which is shoot a big bullet at moderate velocity at close to moderate range. For that I think it is a winner.

If you load according to some of what I saw there you can probably get that 200 going about 2900 fps.

At sea level, my chronograph is showing 2600 fps out of my 18.5" bbl with 48 gr Re 15 and 185 gr TSX. Cases show no signs of excessive pressure after shooting. With the same load and a 200 gr Hornady Interlock, my chronograph is showing 2550 fps. I've been making these loads for myself and shooting them a lot at the range since 2007. I have also fired them at deer, once shot per each, in 2008 and 2009. Both the 185 gr TSX and the 200 gr Hornady seem to kill deer well.

I would think adding 1.5 inch to the barrel could add up to 75 fps or so; maybe less, maybe more. It all depends on the comparison between your barrel and the one you're comparing it to. I once had three .280's with 22" barrels, and there could be as much as 150 fps difference between them with a given load. The correct answer is...it all depends... .

Dennis

I'd have no problemo taking a Montana in 338/08 (like that better than Federal) and sticking a scope with dotz on it and it'll take elk for me just fine to 500 yds. Obvious here I wouldn't take any shot I had @ 500 but if the conditions were right for me to shoot with any other round @ 500 then I'd take the poke with the lil 33 as well.

Most likely I'd use my fav 33 bullet which is the 200 NBT, it'd be easy to set the dotz to kill on demand and the bullet would open at range as well.

People really underestimate what rounds are really capable of these days. I mean you wreck the lungs and they're melba toast!

Dober

Agreed, though I ran into the other kind of guys this week at the range. Two from the Coast Guard, shooting SKS's and suchlike. I had my .308 and .338 Fed RSI's out, just checking. After awhile they came over and wanted to look through my 15-45 scope to check my shooting. Sub-inch groups seemed to stagger them up, so I shifted the bench rest a bit and took a shot at the 300 yard steel plate. They were utterly staggered at my getting a "rinnggg" out of it, first time . I shot it a couple more times, with the .338 Fed, and they were most impressed. It didn't seem worth the effort to explain that shooting a 12" plate off the bench at 300 yards did not represent a great deal of accomplishment. They were very nice, and very impressed...so I hope they come back .

And you are so right, Mark. A large group of people seem to have lost out on the knowledge of just how far away one can kill big game animals -- if they can hit them, find them, butcher them, move them et al are other kinds of questions that have no connection to how well the bullet actually works and at what distances.

Dennis

when i said people arent killing stuff past 150, it was in response to the ORIGINAL post, which most of you dont seem to have read. scroll up a bit guys

JB wrote an article in handloader about loading the 338 Fed. Using TAC, he was getting 2900+ with a 180 NBT, and 2700+ with a 200gn Hornady. That was with a 22" barrel and are loaded just at or under Ramshot's published max loads (which indicate similar velocities). I think the 338 Fed can reach out and touch quite well. I'd be willing to bet that 90%+ of the time, the shooter is the limiting factor when shooting in field conditions rather than the 338 Fed. When getting 2700 with the Barnes TTSX it will still be going just a bit under 2000fps at 500 yds if hunting up around 9k. 2550 with a 210 Scirocco is still ~1940fps using Hodgdon's H4895 max load. That's certainly enough for an elk or just about anything else. I do think the 338 Fed benefits from using high BC bullets and finding just the right powder more than other cartridges to get the most out of it at range. But it can still be done. I have a bunch waiting to get tested when I get my Ruger 338 Fed back. Have to shoot the 338-06in the meantime...

Thanks for your imput guys. It's good to hear accounts of elk being taken out to 300 yards or so. To some this may not seem like too far, to others a great distance. My personal max range on big game is 300 yards simply because with a hunting rifle in a field position with natural elements things can go bad quickly. As far as the distance question I was thinking more from an energy perspective. My concern is bullet performance on the animal. To say 150 is what the round is made for seems a little pessimistic. As far as the bigger gun side of things... I bought my Montana for it's light weight and toughness. It seemed like the perfect elk rifle and I guess you could say this entire posts is based on my dreaming of an elk hunt in the coming year.

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I agree, just 150 yards is a chip shot for my 300 Savage.

RugerDude, can you please tell me about the .335 Winchester Magnum?

Learn something everyday...

Too many people get too caught up in FPS and FT. Lbs. I did too in my youth.

Now, I look at accuracy and shootability, WITH adequate ON TARGET performance.

If one flinches and misses with a .335 WIN Mag vs. hitting with their 338 Federal in the vitals, which I ask is the better round?

Hit something thru the vitals with a round and that animal not die, that will tell you either the wrong bullet was used, and/or it did not have enough 'TERMINAL SPEED on impact' to do it's job.

Not seen an animal yet 'Vitalized' and not die....

I knew muledeer would chime in on this. Don't mess with the man's 338 Fed...

I've used mine only on Calif. hogs to date because it happens to shoot the 185-grain copper very well. Everything hit to date has died, out to 300.

If my memory is working properly today... I believe it was Greg Rodriguez who told me he has culled a ton of kudu with the 338 Fed and finds it wonderfully suited to the task.

All of which is fine with me, as I won't be asking my 338 Fed to do something my other 338s do better.