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#3798480 - 02/14/10 08:34 PM Ruger accuracy??
idahostalker Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 250
What type of accuracy are you getting out of your ruger. I have a tikka t3 that i get .5 inch groups with hand loads. im thinking about getting one in 338. what type of groups are you getting with your ruger?

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#3798579 - 02/14/10 09:10 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: idahostalker]
cole_k Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1503
Loc: East of the Big Muddy
In the last 5-6 years I bought 5 Rugers. All shot 1 to 1 1/4” at a 100 yards out of the box with factory ammunition. With hand loads, they were MOA or less. After trigger jobs, they were down in the .5's when I'm having a good day.

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#3798583 - 02/14/10 09:12 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: idahostalker]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
Ruger M77 .257 Roberts, mfg. 1989, 3 shots, 100 yards


Ruger M77 7mm RM, mfg. 1982, 10 shots in 40mph winds, 100 yards


Ruger M77 MKII .300 WM, mfg. 2003, 5 shots @ 100 yards, first shot from clean bore


Ruger M77 .30-06, mfg. 1984, 2 shot scope check, 100 yards


Last weekend or the weekend before I was shooting clay pigeons at 600 yards with my 7mm RM (see above). I had never shot it past 500 yards and took only 3 shots but nailed a bird on the last shot.

All my Rugers are free floated and I've polished up the triggers. Other than that they are factory.

Don't let anyone tell you Rugers can't shoot.


Edited by Coyote_Hunter (02/15/10 04:53 PM)
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3798584 - 02/14/10 09:12 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: cole_k]
cole_k Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1503
Loc: East of the Big Muddy
Oh, by the way all of mine are wood stocked.


Edited by cole_k (02/14/10 09:13 PM)

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#3798635 - 02/14/10 09:41 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: cole_k]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
1 laminate (heavy barrel .22-250 VT), 3 walnut, one "canoe paddle".

The "canoe paddle" was purchased for a song, NIB, because it wasn't very popular. I love it.
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3798675 - 02/14/10 10:10 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
VaHillbilly Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 02/05/07
Posts: 3684
Loc: BSG Virginia
I'm glad you guy's are having good luck with Ruger accuracy cause after several tries I didn't have any........................547.

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#3798798 - 02/15/10 02:05 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: VaHillbilly]
wantok Offline
Member

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 36
Loc: Western NSW, Australia
Out of the box my M77 in 25.06 shot 1.25" groups with 117gn factory loads. Can't wait to see what it will do after getting some work done on that trigger. Do they really have to make them that heavy??

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#3798846 - 02/15/10 04:05 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: wantok]
Urban_Redneck Offline
Member

Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 143
Like any factory rifle, most benefit from glass bedding. My circa 1981 RS .308 Win shoots 5/8" @100y with factory loads it likes.
_________________________
"If I'm already on my way down
I might as well just work the crowd"


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#3799324 - 02/15/10 07:46 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Urban_Redneck]
High_Brass Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 01/09/04
Posts: 4187
Loc: Parkersburg, WV
My M77 Mk II in 280 shoots well under an inch at 100 yards consistantly when I do my part.
_________________________
Karma and Trouble have busses, and there's always an empty seat.

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#3799643 - 02/15/10 09:24 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: High_Brass]
George Foster Offline
Member

Registered: 06/22/01
Posts: 118
Loc: Ouaquaga, New York - USA
I have a pair of Ruger 77 Mark II's that will average 1/2" for 3 shot groups with their favorite loads. One is a 243 that it's best five shot group has been 1/2" and the other is a 6mm and the best five shot group for that rifle has been 3/8". That said both rifles will keep five shot groups right around 3/4" to 7/8" with their favorite loads as long as I do my part.
_________________________
Good Shooting, George

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#3799675 - 02/15/10 09:33 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: George Foster]
RugerM77270 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/01/09
Posts: 1665
Loc: Southest Alabama
My All Weather Mark II shoots my handloads like this and upward to .6 typically when I do my part. Factory goes about an inch with the cheap stuff.
_________________________
Whatever a 7x57 can do a 270 can do better.

True fair chase is you in the woods buttnaked with nothing but your finger nails and teeth.

If you'e fixin' to put a hole in something, make it a hole to remember.


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#3800808 - 02/15/10 03:06 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: RugerM77270]
hotsoup Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/06/05
Posts: 5464
i just hunt, and never sit down just to shoot groups. however, my mk2 wood/blue 30-06 does everything i ask out to 300-350 yards. right after i got it (several years ago) i zeroed it with 180gr partitions 3" high at 100. every season since then, a couple weeks before the season opener, i shoot a fouling shot or 2 then shoot one final round to ensure it is still 3" high. i may have had to make a scope adjustment, but if i did, i don't remember doing so.

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#3801241 - 02/15/10 04:55 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: hotsoup]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
I was back at the range today and took another three shots at a 600 yard clay pigeon with my 7mm RM. I thought I hit it on the third shot but later discovered I had hit just under and flipped it over and several feet away.

Crappy Rugers! wink
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3801484 - 02/15/10 05:51 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
Bay_Dog Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/13/04
Posts: 747
Loc: Kenosha, WI
My 2005 vintage .30-06 Springfield will shoot as good as I can muster. It's as accurate as I've seen a rifle, also without a modification from the factory. Also, have a buddy with an early MkII .270 Win that is spooky accurate.

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#3801691 - 02/15/10 06:34 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: idahostalker]
roundoak Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/25/09
Posts: 5078
Loc: Badger State
Currently have 6 blue/walnut tang safety rifles in 5 calibers.
22/250, 257 Roberts (2), 270 Win, 7x57 and 35 Whelen. Triggers were worked on except for one. No free floated barrels just tinkered with front screw. Very happy with their out of the box accuracy and with reloads achieved excellent hunting rifle accuracy and the 22/250V heavy barrel shoots .5 for me and under that when my son shoots it.

The 257 Roberts with 75gr Hornady V-Max groups not to far off from the 22/250.

Paper groups always look good and I file them all but these rifles are loaded for consistient cold barrel POI.
_________________________
Your Welcome At My Fire Anytime




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#3802396 - 02/15/10 10:15 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: roundoak]
280shooter Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/01/06
Posts: 4586
Loc: Boise,ID
Best group to date was .113 3 shot @100yds- with a witness.
22-250 tang. Trigger has been worked and Les Bauska trued the action.
_________________________
Go Broncos!

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#3802584 - 02/16/10 04:35 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: 280shooter]
gunnut308 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 04/01/09
Posts: 4224
Loc: Ouachita Mtns, AR
I've had two 25-06's that were incredible shooters.

I also had a 7RM that at best would shoot 4" and bigger at 100 yds. I guess someone has to get the lemon. -grin
_________________________
Happiness is in a big pile of guts

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#3803161 - 02/16/10 08:06 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: gunnut308]
Sandman1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 136
My MkII .30-06 is new, only shot two brands of factory ammo through it so far, but it gets 1-1/2" groups at 100 yds. That does the job for me, but I intend to play with some handloads and see if I can improve it.

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#3803297 - 02/16/10 08:47 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: gunnut308]
Azar Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 06/19/09
Posts: 949
Loc: Utah
My only Ruger rifle is a 7mm RM that I purchased in August of '08. First 3 shot group after sighting in with factory loaded Hornady 162g BTSP was a 0.822" group.

Unfortunately, my rifle is one finicky sun of a gun. My first batch of handloads (Hornady Interbond) averaged 2.66", the best group being 1.5" but at less than 30-06 velocities. Ruger mentions in their owners manual that if an unmodified rifle shoots factory ammo very poorly they may accept a return. I decided to try other factory loads. The Winchester 150g Super-X 5 shot group averaged 4.3". The Federal Power-shok 175g and Super-X 175g averaged somewhere near the same. I tried a 5 shot group again with the Hornady 162g BTSP and got a respectable 1.4".

I thought about contacting Ruger but I know they don't have any accuracy guarantee. I figured since it was shooting less than 1.5" with at least one factory load they probably wouldn't do anything about it. I probably should have contacted them anyway just to see.

I was able to get a Sierra GameKing handload with RL-22 to do 1.1" 5-shot groups regularly but then I decided to void the warranty. grin I had a local 'smith free float the barrel, bed the action, and take 2 lbs of pull off the trigger. The trigger was actually very crisp but came in at 4.75 lbs.

Unfortunately, I haven't had a lot of time to see how it shoots since the work was done on it. It required a re-zero but then still shot the same Sierra load into 1.1" (which is probably limited more by the shooter than by the gun or load).

I plan to try out some new loads when it warms up a bit and am quite hopeful she'll now shoot. I love the gun, I just wish it wasn't so finicky!
_________________________
Shoot as if your first shot is the only shot you'll get.

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#3804082 - 02/16/10 01:49 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Azar]
roundoak Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/25/09
Posts: 5078
Loc: Badger State
Azar, I for one would like to know the results from having the gun worked on.
_________________________
Your Welcome At My Fire Anytime




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#3804219 - 02/16/10 02:36 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: roundoak]
Reloder28 Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 03/09/06
Posts: 8409
Loc: Deer Park, Tx
My Ruger MK II All Weather in 280 Remington prints 1/2" with Rem CoreLokt 150's most of the time. I have taken over 35 critters in the last 4 years with it at ranges from 100-400 yards.
_________________________
"Who don't do dat?"

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#3804355 - 02/16/10 03:20 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Reloder28]
2Seventy Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 573
Loc: Idaho
My Ruger SS .30-06' is a 2 MOA gun with a handload. 2.5-3.0 MOA with factory ammo. The worst shooting centerfire rifle I've ever owned. I know some Rugers shoot well but this one does not.

270

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#3804456 - 02/16/10 03:51 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: 2Seventy]
cole_k Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 1503
Loc: East of the Big Muddy
Originally Posted By: 2Seventy
My Ruger SS .30-06' is a 2 MOA gun with a handload. 2.5-3.0 MOA with factory ammo. The worst shooting centerfire rifle I've ever owned. I know some Rugers shoot well but this one does not.
270



How old is your rifle?

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#3807071 - 02/17/10 09:19 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: 2Seventy]
RugerM77270 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/01/09
Posts: 1665
Loc: Southest Alabama
Originally Posted By: 2Seventy
My Ruger SS .30-06' is a 2 MOA gun with a handload. 2.5-3.0 MOA with factory ammo. The worst shooting centerfire rifle I've ever owned. I know some Rugers shoot well but this one does not.

270

Have you tried tweeking it any? Float the barrel, tune the trigger, bed it, or check you action screws so you aren't binding the action.
_________________________
Whatever a 7x57 can do a 270 can do better.

True fair chase is you in the woods buttnaked with nothing but your finger nails and teeth.

If you'e fixin' to put a hole in something, make it a hole to remember.


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#3807996 - 02/17/10 02:26 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: cole_k]
2Seventy Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 573
Loc: Idaho
Originally Posted By: cole_k
Originally Posted By: 2Seventy
My Ruger SS .30-06' is a 2 MOA gun with a handload. 2.5-3.0 MOA with factory ammo. The worst shooting centerfire rifle I've ever owned. I know some Rugers shoot well but this one does not.
270



How old is your rifle?


I purchased the gun new in 2000.

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#3808024 - 02/17/10 02:35 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: RugerM77270]
2Seventy Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 573
Loc: Idaho
Originally Posted By: RugerM77270
Originally Posted By: 2Seventy
My Ruger SS .30-06' is a 2 MOA gun with a handload. 2.5-3.0 MOA with factory ammo. The worst shooting centerfire rifle I've ever owned. I know some Rugers shoot well but this one does not.

270

Have you tried tweeking it any? Float the barrel, tune the trigger, bed it, or check you action screws so you aren't binding the action.


Yes. The first thing was a trigger job.
Then I free floated the barrel
Action screw torque
Never did bed it
Finally sent in to Ruger with targets shot:
They told me they cleaned up the crown and got 1/2" accuracy with it but didn't state the yardage they were shooting. When I took it back to the range I could see no accuracy improvment.

I can shoot MOA/sub MOA on the same bench and day with couple of other rifles I've got.
When you buy enough rifles over the years you can get a lemon. I've resigned myself to the fact that this is mine and that I'm not going to put anymore effort into it when I've got other rifles that shoot better.

270

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#3811480 - 02/18/10 03:21 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: 2Seventy]
ring3 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/18/09
Posts: 1049
Loc: West Virginia
Ruger Hawkeye 7mm mag. Best I have got so far is 1.5 groups. I have hesitated floating the barrel. Barrel channel is very close is areas below tip. I question however the action screw torque. Ruger states 95" pounds. This seems excessive to me and hard to measure using the supplied blade screw and a Craftsman torque wrench. How are others accomplishing this?

Rob

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#3811780 - 02/18/10 04:52 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: ring3]
wildhobbybobby Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 12/26/09
Posts: 2127
Loc: Michigan Yooper
I like the Ruger M77 platform very much and have owned several, but I've had a couple that shot very poorly. I tried everything I could think of but nothing would help, until I had them rebarreled.

There was a time when bad barrels from an outside vendor were not uncommon on M77's. Ruger now makes their own barrels and they are supposed to be much better these days.

If you are looking at an older rifle, it will probably be fine but there is some chance you could get one of those bad ones like I had. A new M77 should be fine.
_________________________
Life is like a purple antelope on a field of tuna fish...

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#3811788 - 02/18/10 04:54 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: ring3]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
Torque wrench? I just use German specs - "gudentight".
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3812184 - 02/18/10 06:15 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
Horseman Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 1264
Loc: Midwest
I have a 270 Win purchased in 1999. It has been the worst shooting gun I've ever owned. It tought me how to handload and accurize a rifle. It's still tempermental about loads but I can get it under 1" consistently. It's been bedded, floated and had a trigger job down to 3lbs. It will still shoot most factory ammo around 2" to 3". IMO Rugers are rugged and reliable but their sporter weight guns are just good enough for hunting. I'd put money on almost any other factory rifle to shoot smaller groups from the box. My opinion is based on other budddies guns and spotting for shooters at my local club.

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#3812793 - 02/18/10 08:54 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Horseman]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
Horseman-

Rugers are “just good enough for hunting”? You did see the targets and read the comments above from people with a very different experience, right?

Five Rugers in the safe and they all shoot great. Better, in fact, than the last couple Remington’s, both new at the time, that I’ve shot.
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3815466 - 02/19/10 06:20 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
GA270 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 116
I have a tang safety Ruger .270. I've never taken it to a range, and have no idea how it might group. But it's killed every deer I ever pointed it at, and that's good enough for me. "Minute of deer" is all I need. It always works, and I trust it. What more could I ask?

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#3816691 - 02/20/10 07:04 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
Coyote_Hunter Online   content
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 7798
Loc: 6491 Feet Above Sea Level
Originally Posted By: Coyote_Hunter
Horseman-

Rugers are “just good enough for hunting”? You did see the targets and read the comments above from people with a very different experience, right?

Five Rugers in the safe and they all shoot great. Better, in fact, than the last couple Remington’s, both new at the time, that I’ve shot.


That last sentence didn't come out right. I should have written it to read:

"...the last couple brand new Remington’s that I’ve shot."

That would include my M700 .30-06 made in 2005. My 1975 M700 .308 Win shoots like a dream.
_________________________
Coyote Hunter - NRA Life, Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!

No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.

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#3817204 - 02/20/10 09:43 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Coyote_Hunter]
Horseman Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 1264
Loc: Midwest
Originally Posted By: Coyote_Hunter
Originally Posted By: Coyote_Hunter
Horseman-

Rugers are “just good enough for hunting”? You did see the targets and read the comments above from people with a very different experience, right?

Five Rugers in the safe and they all shoot great. Better, in fact, than the last couple Remington’s, both new at the time, that I’ve shot.


That last sentence didn't come out right. I should have written it to read:

"...the last couple brand new Remington’s that I’ve shot."

That would include my M700 .30-06 made in 2005. My 1975 M700 .308 Win shoots like a dream.


Coyote Hunter
Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers. I actually like Rugers and they are usually accurate enough for their intended purpose. Volunteering as a spotter for my local clubs' open to the public "sight-in days" I'll sight in up to 40 guns per day. I've been doing that for years. I've seen a pretty fair unbiased represention of different brands accuracy. I stick by my commments about Rugers accuracy or lack thereof but don't deny there are many that are exceptional shooters. I also don't doubt it'd be easy to buy a Remington that shoots worse than a Ruger. My take is it'd be slightly easier to buy a poor shooting Ruger than many other brands. Just my opinion and as I said before I know there are some Ruger tackdrivers I've seen and shot some myself.

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#3818125 - 02/20/10 03:37 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Horseman]
leomort Online   content
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 1527
Loc: Indiana
Seems that ruger's weird angle action screw messes up their accuracy, doesn't it?

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#3818445 - 02/20/10 05:06 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: leomort]
AJD Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 1921
Loc: Tates Hell, The Big Bend
I have a tang safety 270 with a floated barrel that shoots like a dream with handloads. Other than the floated barrel it is stock, wood/blue. One I have had for 45 years.

I also have several other newer M77's, 2 ss mark II's. A 260, and a 270WSM. They both shoot exceptionally well. I did install Timney triggers.

I have a couple of #1's. A 25-06,wood blue 35 years, it shoots great. A new SS in 270 and I was surprised at how well it shot.

My experience with rugers is the accuracy is very good. They ain't bench rest rifles but they more than hold their own against other hunting rifles.

All of them shoot less than 1" at 100, some quite a bit better.

Ain't nothing wrong with rugers, well they are a tad on the heavy side.
_________________________
There is no accounting for taste.

Experience is a great thing as long as one survives it.

Barely making it is a whole lot more satisfying than barely not making it.

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#3818633 - 02/20/10 06:07 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: AJD]
BobinNH Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 28019
I suspect that most Rugers are more accurate under field conditions than most of the people running them..... smile
_________________________
Just because I'm not listening...doesn't mean I'm not paying attention.

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#3818831 - 02/20/10 07:21 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: BobinNH]
Horseman Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 1264
Loc: Midwest
Originally Posted By: BobinNH
I suspect that most Rugers are more accurate under field conditions than most of the people running them..... smile


I'll definately agree with that!

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#3819589 - 02/21/10 06:10 AM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: Horseman]
jstevens Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 978
I have had a lot of them, as well as sold a bunch. the older ones were a little spotty, while the later Mk II is as good as any. I have a 7x57 that is still my go to rifle and it has been around the world, killed a ton of game, and I just know when the trigger is pulled something is going to hit the ground. I have floated the barrel and that helped it. It shoots .7 at 100 every day all day till you're sick of it. I have a .416 rigby as well that shoots better than that with 370 NF and H4831, I have twice shot three shots in under .3 with 105 gr of H4831Sc and a 370 North Fork. that makes a nice varmint rifle. Most of the ones that shoot crappy need the trigger fixed which is so easy on a
Ruger most anyone can do it. Fix the trigger and hunt with them.

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#3822581 - 02/21/10 08:05 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: jstevens]
JustLucky Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/03/05
Posts: 560
Loc: Robards, KY
Huntaria_Setters accurized my 260 rem Ruger 77mkII for me recently. It is the ugly ss with the boat paddle, but I like it. It shot MOA skunk last night. I will try to post the picture but it's best is a dime size group at 200 yds.
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2 b 1 ask 1 !

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#3822678 - 02/21/10 08:33 PM Re: Ruger accuracy?? [Re: JustLucky]
JustLucky Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/03/05
Posts: 560
Loc: Robards, KY


Thanks for the help posting Kenny.

Glad I had it accurized. I think Huntaria_Setters did a great job.
Again - 260 Rem Ruger 77 mkII

[img:left]http://s945.photobucket.com/albums/ad297...pg&newest=1[/img]




















[img:left]http://s945.photobucket.com/albums/ad297...pg&newest=1[/img]
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2 b 1 ask 1 !

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