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Campfire Oracle
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Good post efw....


Thanks..


Ingwe


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Experience outside paper calcs helps...

I do believe Shane has that in spades.

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Shane has a LOT of trigger time...


Ingwe


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There are getting to be more and more VLD-esque hunting bullets out there. Scirroco, Berger, Accubond to name a few.

A 130gr roundnose out of a 1/10 twist 25-06 might work, but what's the point? If you are thinking anything with a pointed end, and maybe a boat tail, you will need more twist.

Call Sierra, that's a good idea. I've called them a couple of times over the years and they have always been helpful. One time they even did a underground tunnel 200-yard test to answer a question for me pertaining to stability of a 190 SMK out of a 308 twisted 1/12.

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It's for the same reason you don't see any 160 gr. BTSP's in .270. Nosler does make a very nice 160 gr. Partition, but notice the shape? And guess what that bullet's market share is.....

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I honestly don't know why I even bothered typing that. It was an utter waste of time, as are these few words.

Do mind your remarks about OUR service men, smarA$$ or otherwise.


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Since I am no engineer, here is a link for twist rate. http://www.realguns.com/calculators/riflingtwist.html

A 130 .257 is going to have to be 1.5 or so inches and I am doubting you can get much more than 2850. That puts the twist requirement at 1 in 7.9. Which is really close to my 260 with a 1 in 8 twist running 140s.

Play with a 100 or 110 with that calculator and you start seeing the twist rates that are offered by manufacturers.

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Originally Posted by MontanaMarine


A 130gr roundnose out of a 1/10 twist 25-06 might work, but what's the point?


Exactamundo!..You don't need a degree in Rocket Surgery to know the BC on that one would turn it into a rainbow trajectory sooner than you had wished...


Ingwe


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FWIW I shot a few 125gr. Extended Range Remingtons IIRC at some hogs...
Don't recall the BC, but if they coulda made 'em 130 they woulda for THEIR 1-10 twisted rifles......

David, excellent post!

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The guys at Sierra who helped me out were not what I'd call pencil pushers. They seemed to me like shooting/hunting enthusiasts (I dare say loony's).

When I called about stability of the 190s in a 1/12 308 Win, the guy got back to me in a couple days. He made up a deliberately slow load, about 2000 fps, and checked it in their underground facility in one of those machine-looking contraptions. Load shot 1/2" at 200 yards. I got the feeling those guys truly enjoyed that sort of stuff.

http://www.sierrabullets.com/index.cfm?section=techservice&page=ballistictech


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I only wish to add that Shane has kept remarkably cool through the course of this thread. Well done!


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Shane is a cool cool dude!

Ingwe


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It takes a fair amount to get me worked up.

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Good on ya'

As you can see, it just takes someone flipping schitt to one of the good guys to get me worked up...


Ingwe


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Originally Posted by MontanaMarine
The guys at Sierra who helped me out were not what I'd call pencil pushers. They seemed to me like shooting/hunting enthusiasts (I dare say loony's).

When I called about stability of the 190s in a 1/12 308 Win, the guy got back to me in a couple days. He made up a deliberately slow load, about 2000 fps, and checked it in their underground facility in one of those machine-looking contraptions. Load shot 1/2" at 200 yards. I got the feeling those guys truly enjoyed that sort of stuff.

http://www.sierrabullets.com/index.cfm?section=techservice&page=ballistictech



I think in their last manual they posted an on target velocity schematic of such a load for B.C. testing at 200yds, with twist a consideration...

Last edited by HawkI; 03/07/10. Reason: twist
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Yeah, Shane stayed cooler than I for sure. Don't knock on the boys in uniform, or even make comments that might be taken that way. That I can't tolerate. We here in Bama might be hicks, but we stand with our soldiers. Dont think I've ever engaged in conversation with Shane on this board, but he has my respect for his service, if for no other reason.

Shane,

That comment was made in a state of light "rage", you might say. The boys at Sierra have to be shooters to turn out the great products that they do. I feel the same about pretty much all bullet mfgs. I deal with engineers, structural, every day. Some are genuine pencil pushers, others have been there, done that. There is a huge difference in the two. Thanks.

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Sierra also has a very good twist-calculation calculator (much more sophisticated than Greenhill) in their ballistics program.

I just ran a .25 130 Ballistic Tip (theoretical bullet, based on the length of a 115 BT multipled by the 130/115 weight factor) through the Sierra calculator, at a muzzle velocity of 3000, which might be a little generous. The answer was a 1-8" twist. This agrees entirely with what Shane said, which is not surprising.

Our new "friend" Buckeyespecial could also have obtained Sierra's ballistic program and used it to search for the result himself, but instead chose to ask his question on an open forum and then sarcastically question the answers he got, without having a clue about the backgrounds of anybody who was answering. I am also gratified that everybody else pretty much kept their cool in the face of such blunt rudeness.


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Originally Posted by BuckeyeSpecial
Mr. Montana Marine et al:

Read the original post, a 130 grain bullet in 25 caliber; I will now qualify it as a 130 grain "hunting" bullet and not a VLD.

Not trying to be a smart guy, just trying to gain an answer with my preferred level of credibility.... looks like you guys don't 'really" know.

Despite your illustrious artillery experience, I see no formula, nor a reference to a ballistics engineering degree (perhaps you have one) So, I guess I will call Sierra someday....


Unfortunately I don't share Shane's coolness, so you can shove a 130 bullet right up your ass [bleep].


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Way to go Steely! Now I wish I had left my first post up. I ain't about to retype it. I ain't that mad anymore. Shane's cool, so I'm cool.


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They seem to be working overtime at the tool factory of late, fortunately the ability to make a sharp one has eluded them thus far.


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