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Originally Posted by SuperCub
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Stock design is huge in handling recoil...

So does shooting form at the bench as well as the mental picture the shooter has about recoil.

Some shooters seem to have preconceived ideas about recoil that hinder their ability to handle it. On two separate occasions I have taken young teens to the range with me that have never fired a CF rifle before and by the end of the trip, these two young men were effectively shooting my 375H&H and getting good groups. Neither of these fellows came from a "shooting" family, so had no mental baggage before the trip. They did great and based on that positive experience would be able to handle pretty much any reasonable rifle after that.

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SuperCub,

so true my girlfriend is not from a rifle family shooters. they used to shot handguns. her first rifle was a 300 wea mag and she s really a good shot. you imagine the face of other shooters at the shooting range when she said i dont know what caliber is it and the guys were trying to shoot a 223 and they tried once the 300 wea mag. too much to handle they said .... will try the 375 ruger there too ...

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I've long thought that recoil problems are about 95% mental and are the result of the shooter being told that "this thing will kick the #$^% out of you." My wife is 120lbs and shoots my .338wm with skill and grace. Never told her it would hurt her and it never has. She loves the .44mag 629. With that being said all of my .300's have a more noticeable recoil phase than the .338's.

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I've shot and hunted with both...For a few shots,neither one will kill you;but if you shoot a great deal,you will be effected,sooner or later. I have never felt the recoil of either when hunting,but good shooting habits are acquired on the range before you hunt,not in the field.

Recoil is most certainly not just mental; it has physical ramifications as well....

I spoke with an African pro a few weeks back and naturally the subject turned to rifles....he told me a lot of clients bring 300's and 338's but very few could really shoot them well.....even if they thought they could....




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Hi Art. I agree. The most obnoxious rifle to shoot off the bench short of my Lott was a friend's Browning Stainless Stalker in .338. We called it the "flying wedge" due to the small surface area of the butt plate.

But, as has been said, it depends on many factors but a main one is ejectate: the volume of powder and weight of bullet. Then of course follows rifle weight and the platform nuances such as drop at comb, surface area of butt plate, and so on. Then there is the very subjective perception of recoil (which like pain) varies a bit from person to person.

I think the most important factor involved in recoil is honesty-with yourself. If you find it next to having tooth pulled you will not shoot well with it; admit it and move on to a cartridge with lesser recoil.

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Originally Posted by Sitka deer

Stock design is huge in handling recoil...


That's certainly been my experience.


Retired cat herder.


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Originally Posted by rost495
I hate to argue with ARt, but physics predict a measurable amount of recoil.

The issues there are not arguable, but FELT recoil is totally different.

If you calculate speed of recoil thats a huge factor. I can take a healthy belt as long as its not super sharp... Super sharp IE fast hurts me.
Heavier folks feel more recoil than lighter ones.
Stock shape and fit and recoil pads make HUGE factors of difference.

I had one 06 that I hated to shoot, it was my buddies, it wasn't overly light but not heavy, I'd have shot my 338 any day next to it and I'd have told you all day long the recoil between the two was identical basically.

Personally if you are in the realm of 300 mag recoil and can handle that, then the same setup in 338 win mag won't be much if any different in recoil IMHO.

As to Luiss comments, the 300 mag is not the only round that will go through a mooses shoulders... some folks simply like other rounds. How many moose are killed with 6.5x55 and you don't ever NEED to break both shoulders or even one to kill...
Point being you can use what you want to.


Sorry, but I missed the argument??? The most memorably onboxious rifles I have shot have been plastic-stocked 338s. The gentlest big rifles have been wood stocks with a touch of cast. Come to think about it, a Savage bolt rifle in 30-06 was memorable... A proper pad, tuned trigger, and it felt like an entirely different rifle.

So many things can increase felt recoil without changing anything real, like noise, to begin to guess what someone else is feeling.
art


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Originally Posted by Sitka deer
I completely disagree with the notion the 338 can be less aggressive than any of the standard 300 mags in equal rifles.

At the range yesterday a friend was shooting my new 6# 8oz 30-06 and his 338 700XCR... He was not liking the 338 at all, yet the ultra-light (he shot 150, 165, 180, and 200gr bullets for group) he found pleasant enough he wants one.

Because the 338 is so common I have seen more people afraid of their 338 than any other and by a wide margin.
art
Agree 100%, i've shot the 300 win mag, 375 H&H and the 338 and of the 3 the 338 had the worst recoil of the 3. IMO the 300 win mag is one of the best all around calibers ever created. I hunted with one for years and shot lots of deer, a few elk and bears and a few moose with it. I was shooting Federal Premium Nosler Partitions in all 3 rifles in various grains.


That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.

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I like the old myth about Classic Stocks being better for recoil, as they deliver a rearwards push and do not raise up and belt you in the face.

After reading that a few hundred times, and shooting both classic and monte carlo stocks a few thousand times, the truth is pounded into you.

As for the 300 vs the 338, I think is it a matter of whether your interests lay in bullets or ballistics. Both are well suited to the majority of game either would be used, one shoots a tad flatter, both shoot well constructed light for caliber bullets well, and both have a top end bullet weigh that will suffice for all but the heaviest African game for which neither is legal anyway.

What do you like? Bullets or ballistics?

JW


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I've shot both quite a bit in similar rifles. I can handle about 20 rounds from each in a range session before I get sore. I still walk away bruised.

Recoil isnt mental until the physical part of it has caused the mental part.

I would say they are even. But would also say that in the 300 180's are the norm and in the 338, 225's are the norm. There is a big difference between a 180 and a 225. That there is far more different than the step from 300 to 338.

A 300 mag with 150's is quite pleasant to shoot, but that same rifle with a 200 will thump you hard.

After neer 20 years of pounding the 300 sits in the safe and the 270WSM comes out to play. I dont need to pound myself to kill an animal. They realy arent all that tuff.


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If you can handle the recoil of a 300 no problem, you should be able to handle a 338 in the same rifle.
I owned a 300 win, 338 win, and a 375 in the same exact rifle. The 338 kicked a little more than the 300 and the 375 kicked a little more than the 338. Then i shot a 30-06 in a savage rifle and it hurt more than any of those.

I personally like the 338 more than the 300.

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In the words of EK, "The proof of the pudding is in the eating." Shoot them and see. There really isn't much difference between a .300 and a .338 and in the field, at game, you won't notice it at all...most likely. MHO



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I recently worked on my buddies Winchester 300wm and shot it about 30 times, in a short session. Recoil wasn't too bad.

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Originally Posted by luisss
if u relode how much is the 338 win mag to reload how much dose it come for 20$ using cheep practice bullets


I just ordered 200 rounds of Speer BTSP .338 Win bullets, and they ran me $45 w/ tax included.

At any rate, try to use "practice" bullets of the similar design (boattails for boattails, or flat base for flat base), grain weight, densities, etc. There won't usually be as much of a variance when you sight it in using your hunting bullets, and you won't dump as much moolah into getting used to how your rifle performs.

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I own both and can't tell the differance when I pull the trigger with game in my sites. I shot a large 6x6 elk last fall and was glad to have the 338win. with me. First shot knocked him off his feet,he got up second he was done. I can't shoot either off the bench without pain,but sand bags make it possible.

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As much as I hate the recoil of the .338 I would much prefer it over the .300 Mag. I do prefer the .375H&H above all others for shooting heavy bullets. But then I don't like being beaten by recoil.


Thus saith thr lord; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeh from the lord. Jeremiah 17:5 KJV
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I should add that I have acollection of Model- 70, all pre-64's and I know that the rifles I never shoot our my .338's, they hurt me far more than any of my .375H&H's. I haven't shot any of my .458's ever.


Thus saith thr lord; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeh from the lord. Jeremiah 17:5 KJV
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having both and shot them successfully with heavier than thou' bullet weights they do have some ooomph but generally not enough to hurt. Some yrs. back I picked up a J.C.Higgins in a .30-338, done some load testing and found the Woodleigh 240grn. PP to be ideal for accuracies but found no recoil @ 2564fps. Perhaps it is just me..but I do know that when you up the powder charge to 90 plus grains in the heavier calibers then your getting into some shoulder "wow".

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Haven't shot a .300 much but a Sims limbsaver slip on pad over the stock pad and it really took the bite out of my current .338 in a Browning Stainless Stalker. The Browning had a magna port job before I got it and between it and the good pad even guys who are afraid of it are surprised at its good manners.
What I like is that there is no muzzle jump and I can stay pretty much on target. I had the slip on pad and was looking for a longer stock. Tried the slip on pad and it solved two problems for me. I am very tall with long arms so it may not work for all.
I had a Ruger with a boat paddle in .338. I really liked a lot about it, even the boat paddle, but it did bite! I think it was the thin butt and kind of hard pad.
Had another with a 25" slightly bull barrel and a great fitting stock that allowed a great cheek weld built on a Springfield action. It weighed over 10 pounds and wasn't as tame as you might think it would be. It was a shooter, however.
Had a BAR in .338 for a while that I never thought I'd give up but I traded it for the Stalker. Might get another one someday. Great rifle. The very nature of the BAR took the bite out of it. I'd put on one of the miracle coatings, magnaport and put a sims pad on the next BAR making for one great weapon.
I'd call it a dead heat on recoil between the stock BAR and Stainless Stalker with my set up.
I prefer the 250 grainers, otherwise why bother? They do come back at you harder than the 200's.
Heck I found my Savage 110e in 30-06 to be as sharp as about any.
I think the .338 is basically an 06 on steroids if you use the bigger bullets. Close to the same trajectory with more energy at every point along its path.
Get a good pad and cheek weld and you can do it!

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This is no place to get a pat answer on that one! smile

Personally I can't tell any differnce between the two..I prefer the 338 Win. to the 300 Win mag...A 210 Nosler at 3005 FPS or a 300 gr. Woodleigh at 2500 FPS is pretty hard for the 300s to compete with under field conditions and if the recoil isn't a factor..

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A 338 with 200-210 bullets is a very different beast than one with 250 loaded hot, in my experience



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