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Originally Posted by isaac
When lawyers sense cops having a bad day or they just seem down in the dumps, we sometimes let them hang out with us for a little while!! It really does seem to help.

My kids and neighborhood folks love it when the Harley riding coppers I represent roll up in our driveway pulling their best Ponch and Jon. My kids like the guys and the neighbors think I'm getting shackled and taken away.

I guess I've been most fortunate. Cops have been a positive influence in mine and my kid's life. They get benefit of the doubt as a rule,with me!


I actually like lawyers. I usually get along better with defense attorney's than prosecutors. Weird.



Travis

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Watching TV and packing and I hear in the background from Jim Vance and local DC TV news. "Again, police shoot yet another dog."

Give it a rest media. Good grief!!


Proud to be a true Sandlapper!!

Go Nats!!!!


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Vance was a activist anchor when we were kids,David!! Him and Peterson own longevity in this town!


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




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I actually like Jim. And Doreen.

Didn't Jim like to party?


Proud to be a true Sandlapper!!

Go Nats!!!!


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Oh yeah!! Harley man,as well.


The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward




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Originally Posted by NH K9
Originally Posted by derby_dude
All police should be held to a higher standard than the civilian because police have special privileges that the civilian does not.


I would love to know what these special privileges are. I have, apparently, been missing out all these years.

BTW folks, look to the above statement if you want to know why cops feel the need to look after each other. You can't have it both ways: It's the same standard across the board or we're a "special class" and are going to watch each out for each other.

George


I know not all jurisdictions are the same but around here all police officers can walk into any building armed and a civilian with a CCW cannot. That's a big privilege.

Apparently, in some jurisdictions an officer can shoot a dog and until somebody complains walk away with a problem. I'll admit that chances of anyone around here police or CCW civilian shooting a dog without repercussions is slim to none at all.

In some jurisdictions officers commit felonies for years before they are cought. I smell a rat with that one.

Officers have more discretion in deadly force than any CCW civilian does.

Heck, you guys know the drill I don't have to keep on.


Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous

"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous

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Originally Posted by derby_dude
...Officers have more discretion in deadly force than any CCW civilian does...

You couldn't be more wrong.

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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by deflave
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by deflave
Weak.


Travis
Weak indeed. Try again.


Sure dude.


Travis
Not every situation where a gun goes off and a bullet hits a dog is the same. Both shooters were clearly in the wrong, but the cop was more so in that his shooting was admittedly intentional. One is a matter of recklessness while the other is a matter of malice. The law deals with the two differently.


Holy shiite that's hialrious. If the off duty said it went off accidentally you would be screaming bloody hell any damn way.


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Originally Posted by Magnumdood
Originally Posted by derby_dude
...Officers have more discretion in deadly force than any CCW civilian does...

You couldn't be more wrong.



The Seattle police officer who reportedly shot a known member of the Hells Angels motorcycle gang at a weeklong rally in South Dakota was previously disciplined, once for taunting fans at a football game and another time for allegedly threatening to shoot a restaurant manager who had asked him to leave.

Police officials have not released the name of the officer involved in the shooting, or four other officers with him at the time, but sources have confirmed he is a 43-year-old detective who works for the Seattle police Pawn Shop Squad and is a police guild board member. The officer also is known throughout the department as an avid motorcycle rider.

South Dakota investigators have obtained videotape of the shooting that Seattle union leaders believe will exonerate the officer of any wrongdoing in the altercation that left a Hells Angels member wounded.

"I think it's going to be pretty evident that the officer was fearful of his safety and life and that's why he had to fire," said Sgt. Rich O'Neill, president of the Seattle Police Officers' Guild.

O'Neill said Seattle officers are now concerned for all of their safety because of the Hells Angels' reputation of violent retaliation if one of their members is attacked. "There is a real threat," he said.

Authorities have said the officer and four others at the scene all identified themselves as members of the Iron Pigs, a motorcycle club made up mostly of police officers and firefighters.

Of the other four officers at the scene, one has been identified as a sergeant who at one time ran the security detail for former Seattle Mayor Norm Rice.

The two men were with a group of officers who had traveled to Sturgis, S.D., to join the annual motorcycle rally there.

The shooting happened around 1 a.m. Saturday at the Loud American Roadhouse, a popular bar that held as many as 500 patrons at the time. Sturgis police reported that there was an altercation between some Hells Angels gang members in the bar and members of the Iron Pigs, all of them Seattle police officers on vacation.

Authorities have not said what led to the confrontation, though sources said it might have been sparked because the officers were displaying colors or other identifying markings associated with their club.

At some point, the confrontation became physical, and one of the officers allegedly fired two shots, striking and wounding one of the Hells Angels.

O'Neill said he spoke with some of the officers who attended the Sturgis motorcycle rally and that based on early indications, he believes the officer was defending himself from a "completely unprovoked" attack that might have involved choking.

"It's unfortunate that it had to end like this," O'Neill said. "All the same, the indications are that somebody was totally jumped and beaten. If that's what the investigation says, they have a right to defend themselves."

Seattle Police Chief Gil Kerlikowske has relieved all five officers of duty, pending the outcome of the investigation by South Dakota authorities, according to a statement released on Saturday.

The chief also sent a team of detectives to Sturgis to learn more about the incident, including homicide Lt. Jim Dermody, homicide detectives and a sergeant with the Office of Professional Accountability. The team arrived Saturday, but there was no information available on Sunday as to what they might have learned.

"Our job isn't to interfere with the investigation, but to gather information for our internal purposes," said Seattle police spokesman Sean Whitcomb.

The group of Seattle officers has attended past Sturgis motorcycle gatherings without problems, O'Neill said.

Federal law allows off-duty officers to carry their guns, and the Seattle Police Department's manual gives each officer the option to carry one while off duty.

"One of the reasons for that federal law is that police officers, unlike anyone else, are almost on duty all the time," he said. "You never know when you might run into someone who you arrested."

All are looking forward to "getting back to this side of the mountains," he said.

The officer implicated in the shooting has not been arrested or charged with any crime, but has been disciplined in the past. The detective was suspended for two days for conduct unbecoming an officer during a Seahawks football game on Jan. 8, 2005.

He arrested a fan he said had assaulted him, but other witnesses said the officer's comments at the conclusion of a game the Seahawks lost to the Rams had provoked the crowd. He allegedly taunted the Seahawks fans by pretending to cry like a baby and yelling out, "Go Rams."

The man he arrested had objected, yelled at him and, during a melee, the detective was struck with a megaphone the man was holding.

The officer contended the man had assaulted him and so arrested him, but other witnesses said the blow was accidental.

According to the city's investigation documents on the matter, a witness told investigators, " 'Had the officer not said a word, it would never have happened." She adds police "are supposed to keep the peace, not rile up the crowd.' "

The department disciplined the detective but continued to permit him to work off-duty security at the football stadium if he worked in a different part of the field.

On Aug. 12, 2005, he was again accused of getting into an altercation, that time at a Tacoma restaurant while off duty.

He at one point allegedly threatened to shoot the restaurant manager, who had asked him to leave.

According to internal documents, Tacoma city authorities declined to prosecute the officer, finding there was no evidence that he intended to carry out his threat, but he received a written reprimand for the incident.

But at least one witness said most regular patrons of the restaurant knew he was a cop, and that he was known to always carry a gun.

The police guild is offering moral support to the officer and his family, O'Neill said, and the union's attorney is aware of the shooting.

"The decision to fire is up to each individual officer. Only you know when you feel the time is right and your life is in danger," he said, adding, "It's a traumatic incident any time someone has to fire a handgun."


�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.

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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
Federal law allows off-duty officers to carry their guns, and the Seattle Police Department's manual gives each officer the option to carry one while off duty.

"One of the reasons for that federal law is that police officers, unlike anyone else, are almost on duty all the time," he said. "You never know when you might run into someone who you arrested."


Just another "civillian"....when "the shift ends"....


�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.

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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
Originally Posted by AcesNeights
Federal law allows off-duty officers to carry their guns, and the Seattle Police Department's manual gives each officer the option to carry one while off duty.

"One of the reasons for that federal law is that police officers, unlike anyone else, are almost on duty all the time," he said. "You never know when you might run into someone who you arrested."


Just another "civillian"....when "the shift ends"....

Nope.

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Right....if he were "just another civillian" he would have been prosecuted for not only carrying a firearm in a licensed establishment but for host of other charges.

Instead he walked.

But he wasn't a Biker...he was a cop first and foremost...huh?


�Politicians are the lowest form of life on earth. Liberal Democrats are the lowest form of politician.� �General George S. Patton, Jr.

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"It's unfortunate that it had to end like this," O'Neill said. "All the same, the indications are that somebody was totally jumped and beaten. If that's what the investigation says, they have a right to defend themselves."


If this is how it actually went down, then joe citizen would be justified as well. I concede he may have been charged with a ccw violation for carrying in the bar.


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Just another citizen when the shift ends?

Not even in Canada! You mess up and do something that is unbecoming a police officer, and even though you were "just another citizen" you are subject to charges under the Police Services Act, with penalties that run from censure to 20 days pay, to reversing in rank, to dismissal -- all when you were "off duty, and just another citizen."

Because we are subject to call in, if we get loaded up with alcohol, and can't come in to work, the charge is being unfit for duty due to the consumption of alcohol. See above for Ipenalty.

I've been retired now for just about 9 years, and I still meet people on the street and in stores that I have arrested in the past -- they still know me, and ask if I am still a police officer. I tell them no, and ask them if that makes any difference? I was pretty active in criminal investigations, and drug enforcement, so I don't meet too many folks who remember me helping them with a flat tire. wink

Just another citizen when the shift ends? HARDLY -- not even when the career ends. If I could carry concealed, I would. I can't -- my weapon is tactical communications. eek


"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23)

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Quote
If I could carry concealed, I would.
That's wrong. Anyone who has retired in good stead from law enforcement should be allowed to carry anyway they choose. No country is exempt from dumb laws.


We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?

Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
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I'm disapointed .I thought there would be a pitbull .

With this many pages I figgered the cop shot both dogs and then himself .

A dog shooting a cop ; now THAT would be a story ! grin


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"The killing of the dog in Severn is a sad situation that should be investigated carefully to determine if the incident was caused by a dangerous dog or a dangerous person," she said.

Based on what's in the article, there's not much doubt who's the dangerous one.

More manage & control from the brotherhood of LEO's.

Guy should be taken off duty & given a full & independent psych review & then summarily discharged form whatever agency he is a member of.

MM

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Originally Posted by MontanaMan
"The killing of the dog in Severn is a sad situation that should be investigated carefully to determine if the incident was caused by a dangerous dog or a dangerous person," she said.

Based on what's in the article, there's not much doubt who's the dangerous one.

More manage & control from the brotherhood of LEO's.

Guy should be taken off duty & given a full & independent psych review & then summarily discharged form whatever agency he is a member of.

MM
+1 You're making a lot of sense lately. grin

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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
But he wasn't a Biker...he was a cop first and foremost...huh?

Yes, and ultimately should be held to a higher standard...right?

You can't have it both ways.

He's a LEO 24/7/365 as long as he's licensed and commissioned.

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Originally Posted by deflave
Originally Posted by RickyD
Quote
Same thing could have happened to a private citizen with a CCW.
A citizen would likely go to jail and lose his 2nd amendment rights. Unless, possibly, they were an attorney and had the legal weight of a law firm behind them. Discharging a firearm in such a situation and setting appears to me as irresponsible and would not be justified per the law governing such in my state, which only allows a shoot to protect human life from deadly force.


I disagree with your entire statement.


Travis


Why do you disagree with what RickyD said?


The Mayans had it right. If you�re going to predict the future, it�s best to aim far beyond your life expectancy, lest you wind up red-faced in a bunker overstocked with Spam and ammo.


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