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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 23,319 |
The more I hear about the ongoing crisis around the world and the draconian policies of our own regime, my thoughts are turning to planning for anarchy in the US should something big happen (ie. nuclear detonation in one or more of our largest cities; total collapse of our monetary system; a breakdown of our food supply/distribution, etc) The more I think about it the more glum it appears for city dwellers such as myself. I rely on our current distribution system of food, gasoline and utilities distribution as well as reliable electronic communications systems, etc. If something were to happen and one needed to protect his family who has thought about what weapons would work? Also, what about a sniper rig in a political situation that may evolve into guerilla warfare?
Currently I am counting on gathering together my children and their families in the event of a widespread anarchy situation. That would mean equipping four men with weapons and ammo (9mm, .45ACP, .223 and .308). I have settled on two Marlin Camp rifles with matching handguns/magazines (S&W Mod 59 in 9mm and 1911 .45ACP) as well as a Mini-14 in .223 and an Icon Preditor Hunter in .223 (sniper) along with several more 1911s and a Browning Hi-Power. I am currently looking for a .308 sniper rig as well. Leaning toward an FN or Savage rifle.
Any thoughts on this?
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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Joined: Dec 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379 |
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303 |
Curious,.....
Your Children and their Families ALL have their Potable Water, long term Food provisions (including Seed for sprouting), and Medical kits in order ?
Or you have that at your "Central Base"
....something that should run in parallel train, as it were.
Planning is something we do between bouts of reality.
GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats
-- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
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Joined: May 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2002
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There is a ton of stuff written about the topic of SHTF. One of the most interesting is by a guy who went through it during Argentina's financial meltdown. My own take is that weaponry is just one part of it.
I'm not convinced that rural folk will necessarily be better off, at least in the longer term. Depends on fuel vs. working livestock, and growing seasons, among other factors. Think Amish.
I'm just glad I'm not any younger, but I worry about my sons and grandchildren.
Paul
Stupidity has its way, while its cousin, evil, runs rampant.
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Joined: May 2003
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
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nothing wrong with you weapons choices if they work for you....a more daunting task would be the logistics of food, water, medical supplies, sanitation, etc for such a large group of people in the event of a meltdown. sounds like you need to plan for a platoon sized unit....and prepare accordingly.
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
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Joined: Apr 2008
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Apr 2008
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Being in Ok helps you.
You could not pay me to live in NYC or Washington DC. Why would I paint a big red bullseye on my back?
Bad enough I'm downwind of the SF peninsula.....
"Most people have the will to win, few have the will to prepare to win."
Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out-Art Linkletter
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454 |
The more I hear about the ongoing crisis around the world and the draconian policies of our own regime, my thoughts are turning to planning for anarchy in the US should something big happen (ie. nuclear detonation in one or more of our largest cities; total collapse of our monetary system; a breakdown of our food supply/distribution, etc) The more I think about it the more glum it appears for city dwellers such as myself. I rely on our current distribution system of food, gasoline and utilities distribution as well as reliable electronic communications systems, etc. If something were to happen and one needed to protect his family who has thought about what weapons would work? Also, what about a sniper rig in a political situation that may evolve into guerilla warfare?
Currently I am counting on gathering together my children and their families in the event of a widespread anarchy situation. That would mean equipping four men with weapons and ammo (9mm, .45ACP, .223 and .308). I have settled on two Marlin Camp rifles with matching handguns/magazines (S&W Mod 59 in 9mm and 1911 .45ACP) as well as a Mini-14 in .223 and an Icon Preditor Hunter in .223 (sniper) along with several more 1911s and a Browning Hi-Power. I am currently looking for a .308 sniper rig as well. Leaning toward an FN or Savage rifle.
Any thoughts on this? Tinfoil is cheaper than guns/ammo..
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 16,000 |
There is a ton of stuff written about the topic of SHTF. One of the most interesting is by a guy who went through it during Argentina's financial meltdown. My own take is that weaponry is just one part of it.
I'm not convinced that rural folk will necessarily be better off, at least in the longer term. Depends on fuel vs. working livestock, and growing seasons, among other factors. Think Amish.
I'm just glad I'm not any younger, but I worry about my sons and grandchildren.
Paul there is an interesting thing on the net someplace about this guy in bosnia during that flareup. He thought they would do okay living out in the country. Wrong. One or a couple of people against a platoon? They had weapons but not enough ammo, not enough manpower.
THE BIRTH PLACE OF GERONIMO
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Joined: Mar 2007
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,900 |
Don't worry about the tin foil hat comments. Even saw a one hour feature on the History Channel last night about how to survive after the SHTF. Look at how the unionistas are acting in Wisconsin, Ohio etc. to get a preview of coming attractions. Only it will be much worse when you take food and other necessities away from the "entitlement" crowd. It will look more like Libya/Egypt/Greece. Add in the never ending flow of illegals and the mideast situation and there is legitimate cause for concern. I prefer to be prepared rather than be like Nero and fiddle (or make tin foil hat comments) while Rome/America burns. Not like we haven't seen them setting fire to Detroit, LA etc. before.
" The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants" Thomas Jefferson.
Molon Labe
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303 |
nothing wrong with you weapons choices if they work for you....a more daunting task would be the logistics of food, water, medical supplies, sanitation, etc for such a large group of people in the event of a meltdown. sounds like you need to plan for a platoon sized unit....and prepare accordingly. I'll tell ya' what, ......Re : people who aren't FIRST AND FOREMOST focused on the logistics you call out,....and instead obsess about firepower, and firepower alone ? They'll more then likely be SUPPLYING those who did with arms and ammo, and the greater majority posthumously, I'd venture. "Well , we got guns,....let's go get some." ......totally predictable. As is their subsequent (and self expedited) demise. GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats
-- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,363 |
Guns are only part of it. And the choice of actual weapon is not so important as insuring resupply of ammo and to me that means military calibers - .308, .223 and 9mm. If the SHTF, 7mm-08 and .270, even .30-06 and .357 Magnum ammo, will quickly be in short supply or - poetically likely - stockpiled in huge quantities in the hidden basement vaults of guys who starved to death or died of an infection from a minor cut. Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics. Being able to defend yourself is certainly important, but as already mentioned, food, potable water and medicine would have higher priorities than the ability to repel boarders. Here is a decent book on the subject: http://www.amazon.com/Crisis-Prepar...mp;s=books&qid=1263852838&sr=8-1
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery.
Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,659
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,659 |
not a war in history was won with weapons alone. Logistics wins wars.
The only two caveats I would throw up is that you should standardize on MILITARY GRADE WEAPONS. Not converted sporting guns, not Citizen home defense weapons, not things that only look 'tactical', but are not sturdy enough for the long run.
A single fire fight can put more wear and tear on a weapon than a life time of plinking at the range.
Second, make sure your training is up to par. Make sure your spare parts, knowledge of how to repair your firearms, and the mind set of your family is up to the task.
Sam......
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454 |
Don't worry about the tin foil hat comments. Even saw a one hour feature on the History Channel last night about how to survive after the SHTF. Look at how the unionistas are acting in Wisconsin, Ohio etc. to get a preview of coming attractions. Only it will be much worse when you take food and other necessities away from the "entitlement" crowd. It will look more like Libya/Egypt/Greece. Add in the never ending flow of illegals and the mideast situation and there is legitimate cause for concern. I prefer to be prepared rather than be like Nero and fiddle (or make tin foil hat comments) while Rome/America burns. Not like we haven't seen them setting fire to Detroit, LA etc. before. Exactly who was it setting fires in Detroit, LA, and/or looting in places like New Orleans? Ever seen anything like that happen in Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, Montana?...
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,589 |
Funny thing a couple of years ago as a member of our local Department of Emergency Management Team we broached that very subject as we are a rural county out here on the Olympic Peninsula and did a table top exercise on what would happen here on the Peninsula if the big one did occur over on the I-5 Corridor and we had a sudden influx of people from Seattle, Tacoma and the other Metro areas on the East side of the sound.
Believe me the outlook was bleak as there was and is no way that our infrastructure could handle sudden influx of people as we simply don't have the resources in either the public or private sector and there would be no way in hell of replacing the commodities needed to feed and house those coming out of the metropolitan areas as the sources for replenishment would have been destroyed.
One of the problems is it's not just an Olympic Penisula problem. It would be a regional problem as this scenario would play out the same on the East side of the state. I'm not trying to be an alarmist but this same scenario would play out the same way where ever you live in this country.
de 73's Archie - W7ACT ![[Linked Image]](https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t1.0-9/s180x540/532227_701629896563809_1743684631_n.jpg)
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 18,454 |
I'm hoarding .22lr ammo, T.P., and tobacco. Figure it'll buy anything I need.
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,263 |
Maybe those atomic bomb shelter folks back in the 50's had it right. You get the wife and kids in your personal underground bunker, lock the blast proof door, and don't come out for a decade or so.
I'm better when I move.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,900
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,900 |
Don't worry about the tin foil hat comments. Even saw a one hour feature on the History Channel last night about how to survive after the SHTF. Look at how the unionistas are acting in Wisconsin, Ohio etc. to get a preview of coming attractions. Only it will be much worse when you take food and other necessities away from the "entitlement" crowd. It will look more like Libya/Egypt/Greece. Add in the never ending flow of illegals and the mideast situation and there is legitimate cause for concern. I prefer to be prepared rather than be like Nero and fiddle (or make tin foil hat comments) while Rome/America burns. Not like we haven't seen them setting fire to Detroit, LA etc. before. Exactly who was it setting fires in Detroit, LA, and/or looting in places like New Orleans? Ever seen anything like that happen in Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, Montana?... Guess I am missing the intent of your reply as I didn't mention any of those four states. In fact I live in Alaska and it hasn't happened here either. Because something hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. Can I see possible riots in say Anchorage? Yes, anywhere you have people with the entitlement mindset and who can't take care of themselves. Granted there are far fewer of those folks in the states you mentioned and up here!
" The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants" Thomas Jefferson.
Molon Labe
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 33,971
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 33,971 |
I'm hoarding .22lr ammo, T.P., and tobacco. Figure it'll buy anything I need. and whiskey!
Proud to be a true Sandlapper!!
Go Nats!!!!
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411 |
Maybe those atomic bomb shelter folks back in the 50's had it right. You get the wife and kids in your personal underground bunker, lock the blast proof door, and don't come out for a decade or so. if we did that, there would be no survivors....we'd kill each other in about a month.
Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,363
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 28,363 |
I'm hoarding .22lr ammo, T.P., and tobacco. Figure it'll buy anything I need. Good move - I try to keep at least two of the 24 pack double rolls of Northern up on the top shelf at all times. That's in addition to the 24 pack in the bathroom.  Keep extra salt and pepper, couple bottles of clorox for purifying water, big CostCo sized bottle of ibuprofen, antiseptic ointment, canned goods, matches, candles, fuel for the Coleman stove plus Stabil to keep it good for a while and a few other things. Had 27,000 rounds of .22 LR and down to maybe 14,000 now. Damn, time to resupply!
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery.
Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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