Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles An interesting 'trick' to get Barnes TSX and TTSX's to shoot well early on.

Can't help you with the TTSX, only the TSX.

I'd like to publicly thank Safariman for this post. I tried some 85 grainers in a .243 for the first time today and had I not read it, I would have burned up a bunch more than the 9 I shot today. First group out of my Sako Forester went .46"! Same POI as my 85 hpbt Sierra load as well. Good stuff!

You are most welcome! Glad to be of a help and I keep getting surprised that this old thread keeps getting bumped up. Seems to work well most of the time. MARK

Good thread worth re-reading except for Capt. 1/2 Pint's contribution.

I am glad you think so and liked this thread. I just used this method again on a friends new to him 300WBY, and last summer on a 30/06 and a 30/06 AI for a couple of teenagers in my curch who got thier first big game rifles with money they made doing farm labor over the summer. All shot terrific right out of the gate loaded in such a manner. Saved a lot of expensive reloading supplies and time.

Good info. Hadn't seen this thread before, thanks for digging it up.
Due to mag box limitations that's where my 375 ended up with the 250 TTSX.

Have yet to find the rifle that hasn't shot TSX's well at a light kiss to .010" off...................just sayin'.

MM

Well, since you asked, quite a few actually. I have not gone through as many custom rifles as a few folks here like Dober and a couple of others, but between my own customs and loading for family and friends (usually bone stock off the shelf rifles) I have a little experience, heavily weighted towards Barnes bullets. Not only is best accuracy often not the best with the bullets loaded close or touching, (among my small sample of a few dozen) but one often cannot get quite as much velocity with the bullet loaded that close in my experience.

I will readily admit that some rifles did shoot best that way (loaded to touch or very nearly so the rifling), but for the first time out with a new to me rifle, the deep seating with a TSX or TTSX works so well, so much of the time, that I start there and often do not have to make a change.

The next ten rifles I load for might all want a close fit, but above is my experience so far with dozens of rifles.

Just my observations and experience, FWIW, but it does seem like quite a few folks in this thread had similar observable results. So, if my formerly personal little trick helped a couple of folks out and saved them time and bullet money, or perhaps finally got them to shooting the great TSX and TTSX bullets after fighting accuracy issue's... then great.

I am not personally or emotionally vested in the issue either way.

Sometimes mag constraints dictate more freebore than I prefer; barring that constraint, I simply avoid freebore where possible.

Of the variables affecting accuracy, adding freebore is not at the top of my list; haven't seen many BR shooters liking it either.

Rock on with your methodology though, per usual.

MM

Completely agree. I shoot T/TSXs on virtually every caliber I own, and seating them deep is the way to go. I've tried that "kissing the lands" routine and has not worked for me other than increased velocity (pressure).

This sounds interesting, since I need to work up a load with 100gr TTSX in my 25-06. But, if I were to seat this deep, I would be at about a 0.125" jump. Is this in the ballpark of what others are seeing? The rifle is a weatherby mark V 6 lug....

Maybe. I've seen a lot more like 'em deeper than .050 than longer.

Definately worth a try IMO and experience. A .125 jump is not counter conductive to accuracy in many cases WITH THESE PARTICULAR BULLETS. My method is not the first place to try with other pills. The jump on my last 257 Weatherby loads (other than the FN I used last year, which is getting re barreled) was .030 and the rifle shot wonderfully.

My notes bear this out as well.

OK, I'll try them seated to the middle of the first groove and see what happens. Probably be a week or two before I get the test groups shot - I'll report back when I do.

I will be looking forward to the report. Does not work for all rifles, of course, but it sure works for a lot of them. Especially if pushed hard velocity and pressure wise. Barnes and other Mono's generally shoot best at or near max.

Good Luck!

This may have already been covered but I think it is important to understand that there is a reason that Barnes recommends seating them starting at .030"jump. These are solids and do not obdurate like lead core bullets. Solids can and do create higher pressures when jammed or close to jam. I learned this the hard way when shooting the original "X" bullets. Also, they will shoot very accurately when jumped a mile so don't be afraid to jump them. My 7stw w/ 140's jump .180" and shoot .5" all day.

I've solved more than forty rifles for TSX/TTSX/X bullets now. I wish I could say I have found something useful to pass on to get one to shoot. I have a few that like them close up. I have a few that like them way back. Most of them fall in the middle, but that's a big middle when some are jammed and some are more than .130 back.

I haven't even found a way yet to tell me to move closer or further when they don't cooperate.

Really, hadn't heard that. So are you saying you found better accuracy but less velocity loading them further out? How far off the lands are you finding better results?

Thank you.

What I was saying was 1) I was finding GOOD, as in perfectly acceptable in a hunting rifle accuracy by simply loading them to the middle of the top recess groove, quite often. Generally right at or under a 1 inch group, great for big game hunting. 2) I admitted that this is an unscientific 'tip' with only anecdotal evidence i.e. a couple of dozen rifles so far that shot well this way. 3) Velocity is lessened somewhat vs jamming the bullets close to the lands as one is creating a bit of 'freebore' with the jump the bullets make and so one can often ad A LITTLE - VERY LITTLE more gunpowder to the load and get a velocity SLIGHTLY higher than when the bullets are loaded close to the grooves and lands. How far off of the lands and grooves? When this works well on the first time out, I do not take the time to measure how far back we were. We simply then add gunpowder until we get to book max or a tiny bit higher so long as we are not seeing any signs of obvious overpressure.

On a similar note, maybe in the FWIW category, I NO LONGER pride myself on beating book velocities significantly by merely adding gunpowder until the bolt lift is stiff or primers start to flatten or crater. We now know those to be, most often, signes of significant OVER pressure, not a 'safe max load for our rifles' as we once thought. I want to publicly thank John Barnsess for his great articles on the subject as well as many other good writers who have shown many of us old timers the folly of those once standard practices and ways.

Now, when I want more FPS (and I almost always do.... ) I add 1) a larger case or 2) Some Moly to the bullets or 3) a longer barrel and very often of late, ALL THREE at the same time. Thusly 100gr TTSX's from a mere 257WBY rollin along at 3800fps. (Moly'ed bullets, and a Dura Coated 28 inch bbl. So far the mule deer here have very much disliked that combination.