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#5092496 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Tom264]
slg888 Offline
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Registered: 01/30/09
Posts: 9489
Loc: Knoxville,TN
I'm ready...




Edited by slg888 (03/29/11)

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#5092500 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: slg888]
BradArnett Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Northern Mi.
TFF!
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#5092562 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: BradArnett]
Paul Walukewicz Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 10/13/00
Posts: 7879
Loc: Wish i were back in Alaska
only two bullets i've shot in the 243 so far have been 80gr Bergers and 85 HPBT game kings. Used the 85's for deer this year and it worked, but not how i like. I have one box of 105Amax's to try but i'm running factory tube and don't know if it'll stabilize? i'll have to give it a try and see if it's worth it to go AI on this one or just get a new tube with the proper twist...
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#5092567 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Paul Walukewicz]
Paul Walukewicz Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 10/13/00
Posts: 7879
Loc: Wish i were back in Alaska
also, the berger bullets are a PAIN to get to shoot for some reason. i've tried them in 243, 6mm, and 308. I'm about to say screw it and just give up on trying them.. only one that had acceptable accuracy was the 243 with the 80's and those are varmint bullets...
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#5092762 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: BradArnett]
BobinNH Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 30539
Brad/Eddy: Good thread!The cartridge really moves along!

I did not realize but it is faster than the XC,which I asked about because we have a lot of club members who shoot it in matches.Case forming looks easy.....and a 5 grain advantage over the parent case will get significant with heavy bullets in such a small bore.

Not much not to like....and Lapua brass too.I will see if my smith has a reamer.

Thanks all! smile
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#5093204 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Swampman700]
longshot3 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 1506
Loc: East Texas
Swamp, How can you say that a lighter firing pin with a faster spring, giving you a faster lock time, won't help with accuracy? Are you going to tell me that blueprinting a Mauser won't help with accuracy as well? Your thoughts please.

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#5093334 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: longshot3]
colorado Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 1841
Loc: Colorado Springs, Colorado
I had great luck with the 105g Speer spitzers on deer and elk out of my Rem 700 BDL in 243 in the early 70's before I switched to a 270 (mainly due to the grizzly population). Not sure how they would hold up at 240 Wby Mag velocities, but they did great at 3000 fps out of my 243.
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#5093399 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: longshot3]
Swampman700 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/14/08
Posts: 11207
It will help but an antique design can only be helped so much. The Mauser is fine where accuracy isn't the primary requirement. For me anyway a .243 should be very accurate. The reason the Remington 721 (later the Model 700) was invented is because Bench Rest shooters couldn't get great accuracy with the actions available at that time. Nothing has changed.

The Hornady A-Max will out shoot the Bergers.
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#5093447 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Swampman700]
longshot3 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 1506
Loc: East Texas
Nothing against the 700. I own four of them and they are all sub-moa rifles. The only other Mauser I have built right now is my 7x57, and it too is sub-moa. Again, if the action and bolt are trued, with a quality bbl, the cartridge does not care one bit if it's a Mauser or Rem 700. Tight tolerences and a good machinist is what gives a rifle it's potential, not the name on the receiver. The guy squeezing the trigger gets some credit as well.

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#5093454 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: longshot3]
Swampman700 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/14/08
Posts: 11207
The 3 minute lock time of the Mauser, and the huge extractor pulling the cartridge to one side of the chamber helps too;)

A polished turd is still a turd.
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919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994

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#5093533 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Swampman700]
longshot3 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 1506
Loc: East Texas
You seem to be stuck on lock time. Read carefully, I am putting a Ti(titanium) firing pin with a speed spring. That decreases lock time. And, with neck sized AI brass, the chamber fit should be 1:1. Therefore, no effect caused by the extractor.

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#5093539 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: longshot3]
longshot3 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 1506
Loc: East Texas
Does anyone shoot Accubonds in their 243 AI's I use them in my 25-06 and have great results.

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#5093838 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Paul Walukewicz]
darrenk75b Online   content
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/12/09
Posts: 1819
Loc: Northern CA
Originally Posted By: Paul Walukewicz
also, the berger bullets are a PAIN to get to shoot for some reason. i've tried them in 243, 6mm, and 308. I'm about to say screw it and just give up on trying them.. only one that had acceptable accuracy was the 243 with the 80's and those are varmint bullets...


Where are you seating them? Many bergers like to be jammed into the lands (not something I'd necessarily want to do for a hunting rifle).

If you have a remington .243, the factory twist should be fine for the 105 AMAXs, but possibly not enough for 105 Bergers.

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#5093879 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: darrenk75b]
BradArnett Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Northern Mi.
My only experience with the Berger's has been w/105's in this 243AI. They shot good for me in the lands and it also looks like they just might work even now that I'm jumping them .040".
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#5093928 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: BradArnett]
HuntKY Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1053
Loc: TX/WYO/TN
Brad, you said you were on your 3rd barrel on the 243AI. Out of curiosity, how many rounds are you getting before they puke?
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#5094069 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: HuntKY]
Jim in Idaho Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/29/01
Posts: 16860
Loc: Idaho, USA
Brand new to the .243 AI so take this FWIW. Just got my LH M700 SA back from the smith and finally got it to the range this weekend. Barrel is a 24Ē Remington factory take-off I bought from the classified here a couple of years ago.

After fireforming 50 cases this past Sunday, I checked the capacity increase from cases of the same lot. Notes are at home, but the average gain in case capacity (weighing cass water filled to the base of the neck) was about 2 grains of water, or a whopping 3.8% capacity increase.

Using the 1 in 4 rule, that should allow about a 1% increase in velocity. Figuring around 3000-3050 with 100 grain bullets for the parent, that gives us 3030 to 3080 fps. Obviously not something to write home via Priority Mail about.

Factory ammo, Remington 100 gr. Core-Lokts, gave just over 3000 fps in the original chamber, about 3020 IIRC, and rounds from the exact same box of ammo gave 2949 fps in the improved chamber, a velocity loss to be expected.

But in fireforming, my velocities were a bit puzzling. I was using max book loads (for the parent case) of RL-22 and H-4831 under Sierra and Hornady 100 grain bullets, 44 and 45 grains each. 45.0 grains of H4831 with a Hornady 100 BTSP in my 23.75Ē barrel gave 3135 fps, it gave 3096 fps with the sierra bullet. Thatís cooking. In previous trials with this rifle Iíve gotten 3050 fps pretty easy with the same bullets and loads of 42.5 grains of IMR-4350 and (the exact load escapes me here) IMR-4831.

Now, this is a little fudgy logic, but the .243 loads have been tamed due to itís propensity for wider pressure swings in any given string. So, Iím using loads that the books claim to give 3000 fps from their 24Ē test barrels, in a larger chamber, and getting 100+ fps more. Pressure signs (yeah, I know) were totally missing. Primers had a good, well rounded radius, bolt lift was easy, every subjective indication said pressure was very civilized.

Not that Iím unhappy, just cannot explain the increased velocities from this enlarged chamber. Well, maybe Ė I had the bullets seated to touch the lands for fireforming, that would be the only difference over the normal loads where bullets are about .020Ē off the lands. That alone would be telling evidence of being careful when you seat any bullet hard up against the lands. Oh well, something for more experimentation.

Anyway, my whole reason for AIíing the .243 was not for increased velocity anyway. I just wanted to tame itís internal ballistic weirdness and itís humongous appetite for eating throats. Prior to AIíing, this brand new barrel had just over 600 rounds through it of moderate loads, and throat erosion had already advanced .070Ē.

Now that Iím getting my target velocities with book loads for the parent I know pressures just have to be mild (a goal I increasingly strive for as I get older) and Iím not so worried about those famous kabooms with 100 grain bullets the .243 apparently likes to spring on people as the throat gets all eaten up, Iím a happy camper.
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#5094088 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: darrenk75b]
Paul Walukewicz Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 10/13/00
Posts: 7879
Loc: Wish i were back in Alaska
From jammed to .03 off. Someone mentioned in another thread that i should try even further. So, i'm going to give that a try and see what happens...
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#5094232 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: HuntKY]
BradArnett Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Northern Mi.
Originally Posted By: HuntKY
Brad, you said you were on your 3rd barrel on the 243AI. Out of curiosity, how many rounds are you getting before they puke?


Sorry for the confusion. I just meant that this was an older Rem action that I've had 3 barrels on, not all 3 were 243AI's. First was a standard 22-250, then an 1-8"tw 22-250, now the 243AI barrel.
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#5094339 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: BradArnett]
HuntKY Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1053
Loc: TX/WYO/TN
10-4....thanks for the clarification.

I'm sure you shoot the he11 out of your 243AI, but 3 barrels since '08 would be impressive.
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#5094369 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: HuntKY]
BradArnett Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 2297
Loc: Northern Mi.
If the 243AI was my only rilfe I'd be in trouble, 'cause that one is a bunch fun to shoot.
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#5094643 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: BradArnett]
longshot3 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 1506
Loc: East Texas
Lots of good info here! Just ordered my bbl from ER Shaw. 1/10 twist, figured for bullet weight between 85 and 100gr. .600 at the muzzle and 24in long. I have put together 2 remingtons with Shaw bbls and got great accuracy with them.

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#5094649 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: longshot3]
Steelhead Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 10/17/02
Posts: 73084
Loc: Between Glib and Flippant
LUCK
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#5094875 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: Jim in Idaho]
FVA Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 08/19/02
Posts: 7319
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Jim in Idaho


After fireforming 50 cases this past Sunday, I checked the capacity increase from cases of the same lot. Notes are at home, but the average gain in case capacity (weighing cass water filled to the base of the neck) was about 2 grains of water, or a whopping 3.8% capacity increase.

Using the 1 in 4 rule, that should allow about a 1% increase in velocity. Figuring around 3000-3050 with 100 grain bullets for the parent, that gives us 3030 to 3080 fps. Obviously not something to write home via Priority Mail about.




Funny that the 260 gains a hair over 10% in capacity when AI'n verified pretty thoroughly here.
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/4686301/all/260_Rem_or_AI
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#5094980 - 03/29/11 Re: 243 Ackley [Re: FVA]
Jim in Idaho Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/29/01
Posts: 16860
Loc: Idaho, USA
Not sure I understand, are you saying that the .260 Remington provides a source of humor that the .243 lacks? wink
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