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I handled a Win/Miroku 1885 Traditional Hunter last weekend, in .32-40. No it's not made in Montana, but it's nice anyway, and no doubt strong as heck. They also had a .45-70 trad hunter, both with 28" barrels and tang sights.

I also have a B78 from the 1970's, that is just startling in accuracy, and will buy another. That said, Shilohs are just plain art. smile


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I've shot some Shilohs and Pedersolis side by side. I bought a Pedersoli. There's little question that the Jap rifles are very well made and accurate. Of course you can't be a name dropper but you'll have a lot of money for ammo and reloading equipment.

CDNN has the Jap Winchesters for 1/2 what a Shiloh sells for.


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Originally Posted by Paul39
This past weekend I shot in a BPCR silhouette match with a shooter who holds a Grand Slam in that event. For those not familiar with BPCR silhouette, 10-in-a-row on the longer three targets shot from prone off cross sticks is difficult, but doable. I've done it myself, but 10-in-a-row on the chickens shot offhand is simply awesome, and accomplished by only a handful of shooters. This gent may also have won at least one national championship, but I'm not certain of that.

He shoots a Browning.




Paul


Hey, it was fun watching you set us up with all those "misses", than change ammo and shoot so well.

People, Paul has this Lilja Barreled Miruko Low wall, wearing MVA glass that would call out all the definitions of envy,.....

Having him around, and hanging out with him is the TRULY enviable part of the game, hope he'll return and whup up on us again.

GTC


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Quote
Shilohs are just plain art


True indeed. Short of a high dollar hand made custom unit, I think Shiloh does the finest production work of any US maker. They can certainly stand with folks like Holland & Holland too. One can not fit a human hair between wood and metal on their rifles. I do a little stockmaking, and can only dream of accomplishing the fit on their rifles. Absolute perfection.

Last edited by 1minute; 02/08/12.

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Ha! You're too kind. Those condition changes skunked us all.

Shooting those little bitty buffalo silhouettes at 200 meters with .22 single shots was a kick. If a guy did that regularly he might learn to judge conditions and shoot halfway decent.

Thanks for a great time down in the border country.

Starting tomorrow I'm going to have a go with the .30-30 in my first lever silhouette match. Nothing like a state championship for your first such endeavor. Heard tell that a certain lady went 40 for 40 in that game.

Paul


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Originally Posted by BrentD


Now little jim will be back with more belittling of everything and everyone, but that's just something we all have to live with.



Brent,

First of all read my reply again you pompous jackazz.

No matter HOW they shoot, the the Brownings have an UNSAFE potmetal trigger with a SOFT metal insert. They do NOT take down like an origional 1885. They sure as hell are not even close to the quality of a Shiloh or C. Sharps.

Anyone who would pay within a few hundred $$ of a Montana made rifles for a for a "sort of Jap made 1885 has a screw loose.

And actually I don't everyone or everything. Just pompous coksuckers like yourself who are all talk.

Last edited by jim62; 02/08/12.

To all gunmaker critics-
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Originally Posted by Paul39
This past weekend I shot in a BPCR silhouette match with a shooter who holds a Grand Slam in that event. For those not familiar with BPCR silhouette, 10-in-a-row on the longer three targets shot from prone off cross sticks is difficult, but doable. I've done it myself, but 10-in-a-row on the chickens shot offhand is simply awesome, and accomplished by only a handful of shooters. This gent may also have won at least one national championship, but I'm not certain of that.

He shoots a Browning.

Paul


Paul,

I am sure if this gentleman really exists, you would not mind telling everyone his real name.

Last edited by jim62; 02/08/12.

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Ron Calderone


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Originally Posted by Paul39
Ron Calderone


What state is he from?
AZ?

Last edited by jim62; 02/08/12.

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Arizona, though I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Brian Chilson, another champion silhouette shooter, is from PA.

Where anybody is from has nothing to do with shooting ability or the topic of this thread.

Paul

Last edited by Paul39; 02/08/12.

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Originally Posted by Paul39
Arizona, though I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Brian Chilson, another champion silhouette shooter, is from PA.

Where anybody is from has nothing to do with shooting ability or the topic of this thread.

Paul


Paul.

I just wanted to make sure it was the Ron Calderone I was thinking of who was from AZ.

Thanks providing a name. wink




Last edited by jim62; 02/08/12.

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Originally Posted by jim62
Originally Posted by Paul39
Arizona, though I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Brian Chilson, another champion silhouette shooter, is from PA.

Where anybody is from has nothing to do with shooting ability or the topic of this thread.

Paul


Paul.

I just wanted to make sure it was the Ron Calderone I was thinking of who was from AZ.

Thanks providing a name. wink





I dunno WHO the [bleep] you are (or THINK you are), and don't much care,....but I was spotting for Calderone the day that the 10th Turkey fell, garnering him the first ever "Grand Slam" in NRA BPCRS competition, you mouthy azzwhole.

I know that Rifle better than you'll ever know what the [bleep] you're talking about, Se�or.

Why don't you "Make sure" of that, after kissing my ass.

GTC



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Originally Posted by crossfireoops
Originally Posted by jim62
Originally Posted by Paul39
Arizona, though I don't know what that has to do with anything.

Brian Chilson, another champion silhouette shooter, is from PA.

Where anybody is from has nothing to do with shooting ability or the topic of this thread.

Paul


Paul.

I just wanted to make sure it was the Ron Calderone I was thinking of who was from AZ.

Thanks providing a name. wink





I dunno WHO the [bleep] you are (or THINK you are), and don't much care,....but I was spotting for Calderone the day that the 10th Turkey fell, garnering him the first ever "Grand Slam" in NRA BPCRS competition, you mouthy azzwhole.

I know that Rifle better than you'll ever know what the [bleep] you're talking about, Se�or.

Why don't you "Make sure" of that, after kissing my ass.

GTC



Crossfire.

Until Paul39 Provided a name, I had no verifiable reference for what he is even talking about. I realize Ron Calderone actually exists. Congratulations to you for actually realizing that ,too.

If could learn to READ- I never said anywhere that a Browning would not shoot- just that in overall build quality they are not comparable to a Shilho or C Sharps.. Nothing like a POS pot metal trigger with a soft key stock insert for "longevity"on the Brownings..





Last edited by jim62; 02/09/12.

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Well little jim, you returned just as I expected. And I'm sure we are all impressed that for 5 minutes you out shot Brian Chilson. I'd put money any day on Chilson over you, but maybe you would get incredibly lucky again. It happens - even to creeps like you.

Now tell us about all the hundreds of broken pot metal Browning BPCRs you have had in your shop. I'm sure they must overrun the place. Everywhere else however, they are one of the most dependable rifles on the line.

They are very comparable to Shilohs and CSAs - they beat them regularly. Just like everyone beats you regularly.

Now please regale once again us with the tale of how you beat Garbe in Raton. That was a good one. Or maybe a good story about all those times you whipped Ron Calderone.

I sure hope you come to Raton this year. I will be looking for you.

Brent


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Originally Posted by BrentD
Well little jim, you returned just as I expected. And I'm sure we are all impressed that for 5 minutes you out shot Brian Chilson. I'd put money any day on Chilson over you, but maybe you would get incredibly lucky again. It happens - even to creeps like you.

Now tell us about all the hundreds of broken pot metal Browning BPCRs you have had in your shop. I'm sure they must overrun the place. Everywhere else however, they are one of the most dependable rifles on the line.

They are very comparable to Shilohs and CSAs - they beat them regularly. Just like everyone beats you regularly.

Now please regale once again us with the tale of how you beat Garbe in Raton. That was a good one. Or maybe a good story about all those times you whipped Ron Calderone.

I sure hope you come to Raton this year. I will be looking for you.

Brent


Brent.

The rifles don't do any winning. The shooters do. Dumbphcks like you squall about the quick locktime of a Highwall,Ballard or Stevens and then get your sorry azz kicked on the firing line by a 70 year old man shooting a sidehammer sharps. And so it goes. Morons like you never figure that out.

And yes, I did outshoot Chilson a few years ago at the Nationals. He really crashed and burned that year. I also did outhoot Garbe the Chicken line both days the very first Raton Nats I shot at. We were both shooting well. I was shooting a straight gripped Shiloh no 3 in 45-70. He was shooting his shotgun butted Ballard Schutzen High Wall in 38-55. Ron Long was spotting for him.

I realize a piss poor rifle shot like yourself can only snipe at folks with real ability. Just like you did with Ventorino before he kicked your sorry no talent azz in your little head to head shooting match .

Also, I never said I outshoot Calderdone at a match. I have never even mentioned the man's name on this forum until now. If you can find a post on this form where I said I outshot Calderone -I would sure like for you to post a link to it. wink

As to your liberal educated azz- I could outshoot you any day of the week in a BPCR registered match- with a used Pedersoli sidehammer. And that is a stone cold fact.

So, why don't you take your Sharps hating, wolf loving ass and go [bleep] yourself. wink



Last edited by jim62; 02/09/12.

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Originally Posted by Paul39
Ha! You're too kind. Those condition changes skunked us all.

Shooting those little bitty buffalo silhouettes at 200 meters with .22 single shots was a kick. If a guy did that regularly he might learn to judge conditions and shoot halfway decent.

Thanks for a great time down in the border country.

Starting tomorrow I'm going to have a go with the .30-30 in my first lever silhouette match. Nothing like a state championship for your first such endeavor. Heard tell that a certain lady went 40 for 40 in that game.

Paul


Paul don't get to having such a good time down there that you forget to come shoot Alliance in a couple months. laugh
Glad to hear your snowbirding adventure is going well.


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I guess the Sharps action is preferred to the Browning High Wall.


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Originally Posted by E Blair
I guess the Sharps action is preferred to the Browning High Wall.


That just depends on ones personal tastes.
Myself I prefer the 74 sharps rifles, but have a fair amount of high requard for the 1885 winchesters, no matter who makes them.
Shiloh IMHO makes the best of the 74's.
The Miroku built 1885 Browning/Winchesters are extremely well made and dependable guns.


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Originally Posted by E Blair
I guess the Sharps action is preferred to the Browning High Wall.


No not at all. The Sharps is a beautiful rifle that shoots very well. The Browning Highwall is a not quite so beautiful rifle that just at least as well.

Originally Posted by little jim
As to your liberal educated azz- I could outshoot you any day of the week in a BPCR registered match- with a used Pedersoli sidehammer. And that is a stone cold fact.

Now, little jim, I'd be happy to see try to outshoot me at Raton. I'd be more than happy, in fact, I've already offered up a challenge and you ran and hid from that. So, I'll be there. I just might have to beat you with a Sharps though. Mine just being a junker 1877 Sharps though. Or maybe a Highwall - which would you prefer. You can pick.

By the way, I know who you are, and I'm happy to tell anyone else that cares. It doesn't look good though when someone googles your name now does it? I mean really, it gets repetitious.

That also means, I know your scores from those days of yesteryear when you shot more chickens than Garbe - you also got your clock your clock cleaned by the time the match was over. You tend to leave those parts out. wink

You are a good enough shot to have about a 50:50 chance to beat me... See ya there sucker.



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Originally Posted by E Blair
I guess the Sharps action is preferred to the Browning High Wall.


As Ranch13 said, much of that is personal taste.

Or what you can afford to pay.

For pure match use, the '74 Sharps rifles do have a slower locktime. Some folks won't shoot them in a match because they feel that costs them points.

The problem with any of the Japanese made "1885" rifles is half of the mechanism is NOT an original 1885 rifle at all. Yes. the lever breechblock and basic receiver configuration is the same. but the entire main spring/sear/ trigger mechanism is different. The Japanese actions do not take down very easily for maintenance like the origionals. You cannot put set triggers in a Miroku made gun. And the trigger issues are definitely there- both in safely attainable pull weights and the quality of the parts.

That is the main reason why I said you cannot put them in the same catagory as a C Sharps or Shiloh made rifle. If you want an 1885 rifle and can spend the extra $$, by ALL MEANS get an 1885 made by C Sharps. It's a near exact replica of an Early flatside 1885 High Wall rifle.

Last edited by jim62; 02/09/12.

To all gunmaker critics-
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.."- Teddy Roosevelt
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