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#6456915 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: Formidilosus]
rost495 Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 38335
Loc: La Grange, TX
FA sure does make quiet chambering when hunting a lot easier.

And for the dust storms we ride around in at times... just a bit more peace of mind for chambering rounds when we find a yote/hog etc...

I especially wouldn't pay MORE for a stripped upper with LESS on it...

And no one ever decided to do away with FA on the M1, M1 carbine, AK, SKS, M14 etc....(well that could make initial chambering a bit rough though...)
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#6456966 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: rost495]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
When it was first added to the rifle the FA was an increase in cost of 5%. Now economies of scale favor the FA, but that will change as uppers without FA become more popular.

As to chambering quietly, I can do that without the FA too, but I'm not in the habit of running around with an empty weapon.

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#6457115 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: MontanaMarine]
greentimber Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 08/04/08
Posts: 1872
Loc: TN
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
No.

But I wouldn't have an AR without it.

It's one of those things you never need, until you do.



+1

No reason to not have it. I've seen magazine problems cause stoppages that were easily fixed with the slightest nudge on the FA many many times. Same can happen with a dirty & dry rifle.
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#6457127 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: greentimber]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
I'd be curious to know what magazine issues can be fixed by pushing on the bolt.

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#6457380 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: RyanScott]
ranger1 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/14/03
Posts: 4204
Loc: Central Montana
Bottom line - If you don't like it, then don't buy a rifle that has it. I like to use it to ensure that the bolt is locked in when predator calling. Depends on what you use your AR for I suppose. I see no reason not to have it.

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#6457498 - 04/30/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: ranger1]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
I like not having it because it is seven parts, two springs, a significant number of machining operations, two ounces and it protrudes dramatically from my rifle.

But, that's just me.

FWIW Rainier has been selling 100 of those uppers a month since they brought them out, with the rate increasing dramatically as time went on.

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#6460193 - 05/01/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: XL5]
JustOneGunner Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 03/01/08
Posts: 1798
Loc: Minnesota
Nope. Doesn't hurt anything, but if I got a good deal on a receiver/rifle without an assist I'd jump on it.

If your AR isn't in battery you should be pulling the charging handle, not hitting your FA, anyway.

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#6462384 - 05/01/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: JustOneGunner]
ranger1 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/14/03
Posts: 4204
Loc: Central Montana
When the idea is to not make any noise, racking the charging handle is counter productive.

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#6476750 - 05/06/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: ranger1]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
Originally Posted By: ranger1
When the idea is to not make any noise, racking the charging handle is counter productive.


I can lower the bolt on a live round slowly and get it ready to go without a charging handle. The real question is, why can't you?

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#6476903 - 05/06/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: Ackleyfan]
AKduck Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/25/12
Posts: 457
Loc: KTN, AK
Originally Posted By: Ackleyfan
I see upper recievers some with and some without, are they a must have?


No.
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#6477656 - 05/06/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: RyanScott]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13799
Originally Posted By: RyanScott
Originally Posted By: ranger1
When the idea is to not make any noise, racking the charging handle is counter productive.


I can lower the bolt on a live round slowly and get it ready to go without a charging handle. The real question is, why can't you?


When someone is trying to kill your a$$, the noise isn't an issue.

If you are slowly lowering an AR bolt, and not checking for crossover, you are fundamentally ignorant of how to operate the weapon. Just because stupid schit works most of the time doesn't mean it isn't still stupid.

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#6477978 - 05/06/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: Take_a_knee]
TWR Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/22/06
Posts: 5780
When coyotes start shooting back, I'll take this "schit" more seriously...

In the mean time I load at the truck and I'm pretty sure they heard the truck rolling in anyway. I also know how to load a magazine (push/pull) and have never had one of my guns not pick up a shell.

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#6478635 - 05/06/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: TWR]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
WTF is crossover?

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#6479226 - 05/07/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: RyanScott]
Formidilosus Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 12/08/09
Posts: 1695
Checking the magazine for which side the top round is on, inserting and chambering then removing mag and feeling that the top round is on the opposite side.

It is to ensure that a round has in fact been chambered... Like a press check only different.

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#6479246 - 05/07/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: RyanScott]
TWR Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/22/06
Posts: 5780
I think he's referring to checking the mag to see which side the shell is on and after loading a round, removing said mag to see if the next round is on the other side now. I know the GP is to keep from having to press check but I could be wrong.

Push/pull is quicker and doesn't double the chance of a mag not seating.

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#6479598 - 05/07/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: TWR]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13799
Originally Posted By: TWR
When coyotes start shooting back, I'll take this "schit" more seriously...

In the mean time I load at the truck and I'm pretty sure they heard the truck rolling in anyway. I also know how to load a magazine (push/pull) and have never had one of my guns not pick up a shell.


Just wait 'till them "tactical" coy dogs get after you.

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#6488948 - 05/10/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: Formidilosus]
RyanScott Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 1608
Originally Posted By: Formidilosus
Checking the magazine for which side the top round is on, inserting and chambering then removing mag and feeling that the top round is on the opposite side.

It is to ensure that a round has in fact been chambered... Like a press check only different.


Thats what I do and I call it a press check.

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#6492676 - 05/11/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: RyanScott]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13799
Originally Posted By: RyanScott
Originally Posted By: Formidilosus
Checking the magazine for which side the top round is on, inserting and chambering then removing mag and feeling that the top round is on the opposite side.

It is to ensure that a round has in fact been chambered... Like a press check only different.


Thats what I do and I call it a press check.


Well, it ain't.

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#6493008 - 05/11/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: Take_a_knee]
jimmyp Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 12163
Loc: Georgia
so maybe I am wrong (not being a smart ass) I put the gun on safe, put the mag in, release the bolt while looking at the bolt and watch it chamber a shell. If it looks and sounds like it always does, I figure it will shoot. I have also pulled back on the charging handle and released the bolt slowly, again same sight, slightly different sound. I have not ever had to use a FA but all my carbines have them.

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#6493547 - 05/11/12 Re: Forward assist? [Re: jimmyp]
R20 Offline
New Member

Registered: 04/26/12
Posts: 8
Loc: Graniteville, SC
I've got a 6.8spc AR-15 that was my first build. Built it mainly for a Hog/Deer Rifle. I built it without the forward assist because I didnt really see the use for one(also liked the way it looked). Used A les baer stripped upper for the build. That being said I've got one on my M&P 15, and my 300BLK. If I had the choice though. probably wouldnt have gotten them.

I guess in a combat situation it may be handy. But even when I've had jams I've never used it(no form of tactical training).

Quote:
The forward assist on a rifle is a button found commonly on M16 and AR-15 styled rifles, usually located near the bolt closure, that when hit will push the bolt carrier forward, ensuring that the bolt is locked. In order to ensure that the extractor is clipped around the rim of the shell, the forward assist is usually struck rather than pushed. It is commonly incorporated into standard loading procedure to prepare a weapon for a life threatening situation, or to close the bolt when the weapon is excessively dirty. It can also be used to close a bolt that was gently let down, rather than released under full spring compression, to keep the noise of closing the bolt to a minimum.

The forward assist is generally not necessary as a standard procedure on any weapon with the exception of the British L85A1 version. Having realized the frequency with which the weapon jammed when taken outside of the clean environment of the test range, the forward assist was implemented to save the operator the potential danger of aiming the rifle and pulling the trigger and the rifle not going off because the bolt is not fully forward (a safety arrangement called a "safety sear" stopping the hammer from being released and the weapon firing, because of the dangers of firing with the bolt not fully closed). The design of the L85 makes the forward assist quite awkward as the left supporting arm must come off the hand grip and reach over the top to strike the bolt forward with the left edge of the left hand, much like a "karate chop". A redesign of the L85, known as the A2, alleviated this problem by reducing the number of locking lugs on the bolt and strengthening the recoil spring. However, the "forward-assist" is still often taught simply as a matter of course.


I guess what it comes down to is personal preference. Heck it's cheaper to have one than to order an upper made without the F/A.

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