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#6704321 - 07/22/12 05:45 AM Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott
baberuth43 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/20/12
Posts: 12
While looking into a cheap and reliable 458 lott set up, i found several people talking about rechambering the new model 70 in 458 win to 458 lott. The way it read it sounded like an easy job for any gunsmith to perform. My question is however, as the 458 win is quite a bit shorter will the lott have any issues feeding properly when in a hurry to get follow up shots off quickly? Also could anyone perhaps tell me the average cost to have this done?


Edited by baberuth43 (07/22/12 06:01 AM)

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#6704434 - 07/22/12 06:37 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: baberuth43]
Dirtfarmer Offline
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Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
The .458 Win was built around a standard length action, the .458 Lott need a magnum length action. I would think you'd need a mag length box, maybe a magnum bolt stop and ejector. Not sure of the details, as I've never done one.

DF

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#6704528 - 07/22/12 07:11 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
safariman Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
Loc: All over the place! missing Af...
The newer Model 70's are a true Magnum length action. And the Lott is not a bunch longer than the Win. Easy conversion, but better still would be to bump it out to .458 Ackley. Then the Ackley full length uber powerfull ammo, 458Lott or 458Win ammo could be used interchangeably.

For Africa, just have the barrel stamped 458 Magnum. the ariport police don't know the difference.

A simple re chamber job for any of the above is all it takes, maybe with moving/modifying the bolt stop just a hair.

Go for it!


Edited by safariman (07/22/12 07:12 AM)
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#6704561 - 07/22/12 07:23 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
Spanokopitas Offline
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I paid $75.00 to have my .458 rechambered to .458Lott.
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#6704606 - 07/22/12 07:40 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Spanokopitas]
EdM Offline
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Registered: 11/27/02
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Originally Posted By: Spanokopitas

I paid $75.00 to have my .458 rechambered to .458Lott.


Was there anything more required than rechambering to ensure foolproof feeding/extraction?
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#6706416 - 07/22/12 06:48 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: EdM]
safariman Offline
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Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
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Baberuth43, forgot something very improtant....


WELCOME! I hope you you enjoy and benefit form your time here.
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Show me good wood wrapped around a CRF action, chambered in a cartridge that is among the fastest of its caliber, or don't show me at all 'cause you did it all wrong.

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#6706721 - 07/22/12 08:13 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Spanokopitas]
baberuth43 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/20/12
Posts: 12
Originally Posted By: Spanokopitas

I paid $75.00 to have my .458 rechambered to .458Lott.
$75 is not bad at all. You did this on a new model 70? if so how does everything work?

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#6707324 - 07/23/12 06:36 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
Dirtfarmer Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
Mark,

How about feeding from the mag. Are there any issues with the longer round?

DF

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#6707600 - 07/23/12 08:26 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
safariman Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
Loc: All over the place! missing Af...
I cannot see as how there would be since the rounds are so VERY similar. Merely lengthening the OAL of the cartridge 1/8 to 1/4 inch is not going to wreak havoc upon the feeding geometry.

Heck, I even had a relatively short VZ24 MAuser that fed and fired 458LOTT ammo like a champ. With its fiberglass stock and 20 inch bbl it was a recoil KILLER so it stayed in Africa but it worked.
_________________________
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.

Show me good wood wrapped around a CRF action, chambered in a cartridge that is among the fastest of its caliber, or don't show me at all 'cause you did it all wrong.

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#6707649 - 07/23/12 08:45 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
Dirtfarmer Offline
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Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
Originally Posted By: safariman
I cannot see as how there would be since the rounds are so VERY similar. Merely lengthening the OAL of the cartridge 1/8 to 1/4 inch is not going to wreak havoc upon the feeding geometry.

Heck, I even had a relatively short VZ24 MAuser that fed and fired 458LOTT ammo like a champ. With its fiberglass stock and 20 inch bbl it was a recoil KILLER so it stayed in Africa but it worked.


Takes a real "Hoss" to handle one of those, nothing personal, neither implied nor intended... shocked

I guess those young jock, PH types wouldn't even wince... blush

We senior statesmen, seasoned warriors, probably need something a bit less severe... laugh

DF

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#6707668 - 07/23/12 08:49 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: baberuth43]
gunner500 Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 21783
Loc: Oklahoma
BR43, with todays bullets and powders it makes little sense to me to have the added expense of converting a 458WM to a Lott.

I easily run 500 gr bullets to an even 2200 fps in an old tang safety Ruger in 458, havent been to Africa yet, but have shot some BIG cattle with it over the years.

The 500 gr Swift A Frame and 550 gr Woodleigh softs are absolutely devastating on cattle i've hit from 15 to 150 yards.

Either of those bullets first, then a mag full of 500 gr Woodleigh solids and you are way past good to go on any animal that walks.

Gunner

In my humble opinion of course.
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#6707718 - 07/23/12 09:11 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: gunner500]
Dirtfarmer Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
Gunner,

Back when I was in the cattle business, we penned our cows with horses... laugh

DF

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#6707754 - 07/23/12 09:25 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
gunner500 Offline
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Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 21783
Loc: Oklahoma
Originally Posted By: Dirtfarmer
Gunner,

Back when I was in the cattle business, we penned our cows with horses... laugh

DF


LOL DF, Well I dont live out West or Alaska and havent had the time for Africa, I figured a LOOONG time ago a sick, dying, or dead head of cattle would/do make excellent bullet testing media.

I've shot 'em from 150 lbs all the way to over 2200 lbs and at every range or angle a man can think of.

With a tractor and loader, chain, saw, ax, and a big knife, you can get all the bullet testing you could ever wonder about. LOL

Matter of fact, Sharpsguy [BB] down in Texas wants me to call him next time I have to put one down and were gonna cut loose on it with our Sharps Rifles. laugh

Gunner
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#6707756 - 07/23/12 09:26 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
safariman Offline
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Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
Loc: All over the place! missing Af...
I still want to go on one of those Wild Cattle hunts in the Texas riverbed country that Murray Burnham wrote about many years ago. I need to keep my 416 Rigby limbered up and ready.
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LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.

Show me good wood wrapped around a CRF action, chambered in a cartridge that is among the fastest of its caliber, or don't show me at all 'cause you did it all wrong.

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#6707765 - 07/23/12 09:29 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
gunner500 Offline
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Registered: 09/07/09
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Loc: Oklahoma
That sounds like a helluva lot of fun Mark, specially off Horse or Mule back, and how bout a big Water Buffalo hunt in Australia?

That ones on my bucket list too. laugh

Gunner
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#6707895 - 07/23/12 10:26 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: gunner500]
Dirtfarmer Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
I'll have to get my .404J project finished... cool

DF

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#6708318 - 07/23/12 12:59 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
gunner500 Offline
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Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 21783
Loc: Oklahoma
Yes, yes you do whistle LOL

Gunner
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#6708676 - 07/23/12 03:14 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: gunner500]
safariman Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
Loc: All over the place! missing Af...
Originally Posted By: gunner500
That sounds like a helluva lot of fun Mark, specially off Horse or Mule back, and how bout a big Water Buffalo hunt in Australia?

That ones on my bucket list too. laugh

Gunner


Airfare is off of my budget list these days. Water or Cape Buff out of reach BUT, if I can DRIVE somewhere to hunt something that really needs 416 Rigby horsepower.....

Thats the trouble with this danged country, not enough really big game to hunt for! smile

I remember Murray Burnham ending his story on the Texas wild cattle hunting with something like "Leave your pet 243 at home, it probably won't even make him look up at you or flinch"
_________________________
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.

Show me good wood wrapped around a CRF action, chambered in a cartridge that is among the fastest of its caliber, or don't show me at all 'cause you did it all wrong.

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#6708724 - 07/23/12 03:34 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
Dirtfarmer Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/10
Posts: 11391
Loc: Central Louisiana
Originally Posted By: safariman
Originally Posted By: gunner500
That sounds like a helluva lot of fun Mark, specially off Horse or Mule back, and how bout a big Water Buffalo hunt in Australia?

That ones on my bucket list too. laugh

Gunner


Airfare is off of my budget list these days. Water or Cape Buff out of reach BUT, if I can DRIVE somewhere to hunt something that really needs 416 Rigby horsepower.....

Thats the trouble with this danged country, not enough really big game to hunt for! smile

I remember Murray Burnham ending his story on the Texas wild cattle hunting with something like "Leave your pet 243 at home, it probably won't even make him look up at you or flinch"


Guess Murray thought just the suggestion of a .243 would be somthing like taking a knife to a gun fight...! laugh

DF

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#6708749 - 07/23/12 03:43 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
FOsteology Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 7398
Loc: Texas
I have a Win M70 .458WM

With 450gr. North Fork Flat point Solids and 72gr. of AA2230 it'll hammer anything and everything I may ever hunt with less felt recoil than my AHR Lott.

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#6709166 - 07/23/12 06:01 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
GaryVA Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 03/07/05
Posts: 2270
Loc: The Backcountry Mountains
Originally Posted By: safariman
The newer Model 70's are a true Magnum length action.


Are you saying they now use a true magnum length action instead of using the altered standard length action? Did not think this was so, thought it was only in lengths of super short, short and standard.
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#6709245 - 07/23/12 06:26 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: FOsteology]
gunner500 Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 09/07/09
Posts: 21783
Loc: Oklahoma
Originally Posted By: FOsteology
I have a Win M70 .458WM

With 450gr. North Fork Flat point Solids and 72gr. of AA2230 it'll hammer anything and everything I may ever hunt with less felt recoil than my AHR Lott.


Damn right Fost, and I hear they make a Cup Point solid too that penetrates like an expanding solid.
Spose to be bad to the bone. wink

Gunner
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#6709285 - 07/23/12 06:38 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: gunner500]
GF1 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/22/08
Posts: 2598
Not sure about the current actions, but expect they are the same as pre-64 in this respect -- easy to open up a std length M70 to magnum length. Relief of the metal is done at the back, as well as the mag box. Not much trick to it.

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#6709378 - 07/23/12 07:04 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: gunner500]
FOsteology Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 7398
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: gunner500
Originally Posted By: FOsteology
I have a Win M70 .458WM

With 450gr. North Fork Flat point Solids and 72gr. of AA2230 it'll hammer anything and everything I may ever hunt with less felt recoil than my AHR Lott.


Damn right Fost, and I hear they make a Cup Point solid too that penetrates like an expanding solid.
Spose to be bad to the bone. wink

Gunner


Yeppers.

I'm taking a handful of 450gr. NF CPS next month to Zimbabwe. PH has never seen them, and is interested in how well they perform.


Back on topic for the OP:

With the availability of today's premium bullets and powder, there's honestly no real need to convert the .458WM to a Lott.

Unless of course it's just and itch you have to scratch just 'cuz. grin

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#6709988 - 07/23/12 11:56 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: FOsteology]
John_Gregori Offline
Member

Registered: 09/03/10
Posts: 176
Loc: Arizona & California
FOsteology, what velocity are you getting with that load and what length barrel are you using?

Thanks,
John
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#6711613 - 07/24/12 01:33 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: John_Gregori]
FOsteology Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 7398
Loc: Texas
Average 2214fps with 24" barrel.

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#6712286 - 07/24/12 04:58 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: GaryVA]
GaryVA Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 03/07/05
Posts: 2270
Loc: The Backcountry Mountains
Originally Posted By: GaryVA
Originally Posted By: safariman
The newer Model 70's are a true Magnum length action.


Are you saying they now use a true magnum length action instead of using the altered standard length action? Did not think this was so, thought it was only in lengths of super short, short and standard.


I looked into it and I don't believe such an animal exists, they do not manufacture a magnum length action, it's a standard length action that's machined a bit differently to make room, same as the post-64 classics.
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#6712856 - 07/24/12 07:56 PM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: FOsteology]
bearstalker Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 06/22/02
Posts: 9204
Loc: Alaska
Originally Posted By: FOsteology

I'm taking a handful of 450gr. NF CPS next month to Zimbabwe. PH has never seen them, and is interested in how well they perform.


Lucky dog! What species is on the menu? Looking forward to the pics and a loooong report! grin

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#6719964 - 07/27/12 06:09 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: bearstalker]
coyotewacker Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 11/26/10
Posts: 833
Loc: U.P. Mich-Lk. St. Clair
The North Fork bullets are great Big Bore bullets.

I have been working with the Cutting Edge Bullets Non-Con in the Big Bores and cannot believe how they perform. What is great you get a little more velocity from the brass bullet and can use a lighter weight bullet and get more straight penetration.

Why change your 458 WM for a 458 Lott just change bullets to Cutting Edge Non-Com, they give you performance plus.


Edited by coyotewacker (07/27/12 06:10 AM)

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#6720162 - 07/27/12 07:25 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: baberuth43]
ar15a292f Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 05/26/04
Posts: 956
Loc: Indiana
With today's powders and bullets I would just stay with the 458 Winchester Magnum. A Swift or Northfork 450 or 500 grain bullet over some Accurate 2230 powder should be a great combination.

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#6726375 - 07/29/12 09:24 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: Dirtfarmer]
paul375 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 434
Loc: U.K.
I re-chambered a Winchester M70 .458 win to .458 Lott , I got the chamber reamer, pilots, go/no go gauges from Pacific tool and gauge. Its a straigh forward job to do. I didn't need to alter the rails. it fed just fine. I pilar beded the stock, and also fitted two Tally K98 cross boltls which I also bedded. I fitted "The Max" recoil reducer in the butt.
I shortened the barrel to 21"
I am pushing a 450gr TSX@ 2372fps and its very nice to shoot.
I fitted a Leupold 1.25-4x20 and that works well along with quick release mounts. I took the flip up leaf sight off so it just left a single leaf. Its basically a 50yard gun. but I can get a clover leaf at 100yds off the bench. It does hurt from the bench, but standing or off sticks is fine.
I took it to Namibia last year, and sat up a tree with it and shot a Kudu, so if it can be shot from sitting on a branch and not kicking me off, then it carn't be that bad to shoot!
I used it on driven boar in Croatia and it proved very effective, but worked best without the scope.
I was going to go back out to Africa with it on cull BufF , but that fell through, so maybe next year for that.
Every one has their own idea of what they want as a rifle, I had mine,and I built it,and I'm happy with it, but it may not be you have in mind.
If you do go for a Lott then you can still run .458 win mag in it. You can use lighter bullets with reduced loads for hogs and go up to 450 0r 500 for Africa. I would reccomend the 450TSX.




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#6729929 - 07/30/12 11:55 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: paul375]
safariman Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 06/18/05
Posts: 25858
Loc: All over the place! missing Af...
Gorgeous rifle and a fine buiild there, Paul! Damned fine Kudu as well. About 52 inches, I am guessing?
_________________________
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.

Show me good wood wrapped around a CRF action, chambered in a cartridge that is among the fastest of its caliber, or don't show me at all 'cause you did it all wrong.

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#6736032 - 08/01/12 11:09 AM Re: Winchester model 70 458 win -> 458 lott [Re: safariman]
paul375 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 434
Loc: U.K.
Cheers Safariman, I'm happy with it. A few ladies have fired it at the range and they can still function normally! Infact theres a couple of ladies that always ask if the can have a play with it when I get it out.
Not sure about the size of the Kudu as I never measured it.
I never do. But it is nice looking.
All the best,
Paul.

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