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#7172521 - 12/12/12 Load Manual Velocities
snuzem Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/10
Posts: 158
Loc: MS Gulf Coast
Hi
I'm trying to work up some loads for a couple of rifles and can't reach my load manuals(Nosler) velocities. My barrel length is the same and the components are the same. However, I am not using one of the more expensive chronographs,just an entry level Chrony. I don't know if that can make a difference or not. My 6.5-284 is reading about 100 fps slower than the manuals velocities. My 30-06 is about the same. Am I chasing my tail trying to reach these velocities?
Thanks
Scott

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#7172641 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
tikkanut Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/30/01
Posts: 5138
Loc: Rural Podunk Utah....
Every barrel is an individual...none the same....

Nosler or Hornady's test barrel is different than yours...

Loads listed are for reference only....your results may differ...

you may be able to increase max charge a grain or so over...

you may not...twist/groove/bbl length/bullet style/elevation/air

temp/components all play a role...Chrony accurate ?

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#7172661 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
Ringman Online   content
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/03
Posts: 17299
Loc: G P,OR
snuzem,

My .454 runs about 100 feet per second behind others I read about. Like the man says, barrels vary.
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"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter

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#7172681 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
jwall Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 09/06/10
Posts: 5053
Loc: Southern Arkansas
FIRST - I am NO authority.

Many have experienced what you are now. It's frustrating and there possible reasons for the differences between book published vels & real time vel.

Personally, I ONLY believe what the chrono says.

I'm old dog & old school enough to be very skeptical of published loads.

I use them as a "guideline" not the gospel of reloading.

Good Luck
Jerry
_________________________
jwall

aka - 3100 guy.

There is no aftermarket FIX for operator error. jw


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#7172765 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: jwall]
antelope_sniper Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 11/29/11
Posts: 8761
Loc: Colorado
Snuzem, that's why the Chronograph is called the "de-liar". It takes the fiction out of all the published velocities. As you are already discovering, the books are not all correct. If they were, you wouldn't need a chronograph. Back when we started chronographing in the 80's some of the published loads were off by 300 FPS. Now that chrony's are common the published data has significantly improved, but often your results will still be different.
_________________________
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Go quiet or full tilt, just don't get caught in the middle of the stupids. DD

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#7172820 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
bigsqueeze Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/04/09
Posts: 6355
Loc: So Cal
Originally Posted By: snuzem
Hi
I'm trying to work up some loads for a couple of rifles and can't reach my load manuals(Nosler) velocities. My barrel length is the same and the components are the same. However, I am not using one of the more expensive chronographs,just an entry level Chrony. I don't know if that can make a difference or not. My 6.5-284 is reading about 100 fps slower than the manuals velocities. My 30-06 is about the same. Am I chasing my tail trying to reach these velocities?
Thanks
Scott
..............Yes! 100 fps slower than the Nosler manual is nothing to lose any sleep or "chasing your tail" over.

If your 30-06 is chronying right on or about on par with the book velocities, then it stands to reason that maybe your 6.5-284 bore might be a little slower than were the barrel or barrels chrony`d in the Nosler manual.

It is very likely with probable certainty, that if the same components are used, there will be some 6.5-284 bores out there running even a little slower than yours. If you have any doubts about the chrony you`re using, then for collaboration, borrow a friend`s chrony if possible and see what that one says using the same loads.

You`re always going to have slower bores and faster bores in identical rifles, coming from the same manufacturer, chambered in the same round and when using the identical componentry and powder charges.

Besides the Nosler manual, I`d look around in other manuals to see if they are using the same components and Nosler bullet and look at what book velocities they are running and then average them all out.

Will losing 100 fps from the muzzle make the final result any different when hunting any game you could ever hunt using your 6.5-284 given the same shooting distances?.......Nope!

Most teens and maybe even younger, young adults and adults can throw a major league baseball faster than 100 fps or 68.181 mph.

In the world of 1800, 2000, 2200 mph and greater rifle bullet speeds from the muzzle, losing just over 68 mph is really nothing.

Rather than be concerned with losing 100 fps, concentrate on your accuracy instead. If you`re grouping well then why worry!
_________________________
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#7172897 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: bigsqueeze]
bellydeep Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 12/12/09
Posts: 835
Loc: Montana
In my experience, sometimes you eat the bar, sometimes the bar eats you.

Trust your chrono. Don't sweat it if your load is a little slower than book. Sometimes I match the load books, sometimes I don't, thats just how it goes.
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#7173132 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: bellydeep]
baldhunter Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/05/09
Posts: 1007
Loc: Corpus Christi,Texas
I've always felt Nosler velocities ran a little high for the amount of powder called for in their loads.I trust my chronograph and don't worry too much what the book says.It's only a guide,every rifle is different and powders can vary from lot to lot too.

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#7173246 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: baldhunter]
BobinNH Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 30539
Originally Posted By: baldhunter
.....every rifle is different and powders can vary from lot to lot too.


Bingo!
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#7173317 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: BobinNH]
1OntarioJim Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 08/09/05
Posts: 2847
Loc: N. Shore, L. Ontario
An inexpensive way to check your chronograph is to buy 2 or 3 boxes of .22 rimfire ammo that gives their velocity on the box and check these against your chrono readings.

Jim

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#7175105 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
SAUMHUNTER79 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1702
Loc: WI
That's pretty normal, also, don't sweat velocity too much, velocity and trajectory aren't the same thing, a lot of times one has to add a significant amount of powder to gain much trajectory over a "slower" load.

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#7175312 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: SAUMHUNTER79]
RockyRaab Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 05/23/03
Posts: 14637
Loc: Ogden, Utah
First, the manual IS correct. What they print is exactly what they got.

Second, the major difference between what they got and what you can get is what they shot it in. If they used an instrumented test barrel (to get pressure readings as well as velocity) then that barrel was cut to absolute minimum dimensions. Because it is tighter in all respects, it delivered higher pressures AND higher velocities than a looser sporting barrel will. That's for obvious safety reasons.

So a chronograph reading from your rifle and using your components that registers 100 fps or so less than the "book" number is probably dead smack on.
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Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.


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#7175317 - 12/12/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: baldhunter]
dingo Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 482
Loc: Qld Australia
Originally Posted By: baldhunter
I've always felt Nosler velocities ran a little high for the amount of powder called for in their loads.I trust my chronograph and don't worry too much what the book says.It's only a guide,every rifle is different and powders can vary from lot to lot too.


When using 50gn bullets and Varget in my Rem 700VLS 22/250 I get velocity around 200fps less than the Nosler manuel despite my rifle having a barrel 2" longer than the test barrel.

Some of the velocities in the Nosler manual are "out of this world" in terms of achievability.

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#7175660 - 12/13/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: dingo]
8nbait Online   content
Campfire Regular

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 416
Loc: Meridian, ID
My 6.5 is right on book velocities but my 25-06 is much faster than book velocities. I just trust the chrono. I assume this is normal.

gary

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#7175700 - 12/13/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: 1OntarioJim]
boomtube Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 1491
If we loaded the book maker's components in the book maker's fire arms I bet we'd get the book's speeds. Alas, mine are different. wink

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#7176381 - 12/13/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: boomtube]
snuzem Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/10
Posts: 158
Loc: MS Gulf Coast
Thanks for all the replies. It makes me feel a lot better knowing its not something I'm doing wrong( this time, anyway).
Thanks again
Scott

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#7176878 - 12/13/12 Re: Load Manual Velocities [Re: snuzem]
bobnob17 Online   content
Campfire Regular

Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1033
Loc: NSW Australia
I load Hodgdon/ADI powders usually from the Hodgdon/ADI data. Most of my results are pretty close to the book with the exception of my old 308 which has a barrel that's shot over 10 000 rounds. It gives me about 200fps less than what the books say I should. Probably not surprising. Still groups well though.

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