Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Mule Deer's Article on Powder Measuring

I think what DF is saying is that it takes the same amount of time to seat a bullet and spin a loaded round on the gauge as it does for a chargemaster to weigh a charge. So if you're checking each round as it's loaded, you're not losing any time.

What lot number was that??

I use the RCBS Chargemaster. The process is:

(I size and tumble in a separate operation. I tumble after I size to remove the lube and clean primer pockets).

* start powder charge
* trim & chamfer on Giraud
* prime
* seat bullet from previous cycle
* Check concentricity
* drop powder in case
* repeat this process

I have to work to keep up with the Chargemaster and I'm within .1 grain every time! There is absolutely no down time.

I load prepped cases in operation blocks:

Prime them all

Charge them all

Seat all the bullets

Spin them all



By switching between operations case to case you may not have down time, but it's a good bet you use more time.

If +/- .1 grain of a Lincoln Log powder like 3031 is what's to be held, then I can "thweigh" charges using my measure and electronic scale. If one is off I don't waste time adjusting it, I return it to the hopper and throw again. Between 2/3 to 3/4 of the charges meet spec as thrown (yes, I've tested it many times), so it's quick.

I did an article for GUNS magazine where I tested how much time various loading methods took. Mathman's guess ir correct: The fastest way to load ammo is to perform each step on all the brass, then go to the next step.

This discussion came up on the Campfire a while back, and somebody was bragging about how he could load 100 rounds of precision rifle ammo an hour using an electronic scale. He was somewhat dismayed when I told him using a powder measure to charge cases in a loading block would easily double that. In fact I've eliminated so many wasted steps in my handloading that I can come close to the per-hour production of a basic progressive press while using a turret press.

Of course a lot of handloaders prefer spending as much time as possible in their loading room. If that's what they prefer, then that's what they should do. But I handload for part of my living, and anything that saves time in the loading room means more time to shoot, write and test other stuff.

There is no way in hell I could do it Clint's way. Size 500 cases, prime 500 case, dump powder in 500 cases, seat bullets in 500 cases.

Yep.

Last spring I loaded several hundred rounds of ammo for EACH of five rifles in .17 Fireball, .17 Remington, .204 Ruger, .221 Fireball and .220 Swift for an extensive prairie dog "field test" of a new line of varmint bullets. I got it all done in three afternoons. I couldn't imagine loading that many rounds without having worked out some form of mass manufacturing--and eliminating useless steps.

I'm so lazy I'll actually decide which way to load, -- turret, progressive, or electronic dispenser -- based on what's in the press.

Yeah, I know, capital L.

I liked it too

I plan to get one... they work without power.

Still for most parts I will continue to weigh

Snake

John, Mathman, and Scott,

I'm at 15 seconds per round plus sizing time which I'd guess adds another 4-5 seconds (at most). I'm totaling 20 seconds per round, 3 rounds per minute, 100 rounds in 33 minutes. That includes sizing, trimming, and chamfering each peice of brass, priming, weighing each charge, seating bullet, and checking run out.

Does it get much faster, especially considering trimming, weighing each charge, and checking for runout?

For the mathematically inclined ...

If you have a "micrometer" adjust powder measure and a fancy calculator or software on your computer that does statistics, linear regression in particular, you can get set so you don't have to use a scale much at all after doing the initial work. What follows works best for loaders who buy large quantities of single powder lot numbers.

Here's what we do with a Redding BR-30 for a new lot of powder. Set the adjustment to 20. Not 20 grains, just the 20 mark on the dial. Fill the hopper with powder and throw some charges to stabilize the powder column. Now throw five charges and weigh them together. Divide by five. Record this average weight.

Adjust the dial to 25. Throw some stabilizing charges, returning them to the hopper. Throw five charges and weigh together. Divide by five. Record the average weight.

Adjust the dial to 30. Throw some stabilizing charges, returning them to the hopper. Throw five charges and weigh together. Divide by five. Record the average weight.

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Adjust the dial to 75. Throw some stabilizing charges, returning them to the hopper. Throw five charges and weigh together. Divide by five. Record the average weight.

So now we have a collection of ordered pairs, each a match between a dial setting and a powder weight. If the powder measure is a good one and our throwing technique checks out, we can plot these ordered pairs on an x-y coordinate system and they should lie very nearly on a line. Here's where the calculator/computer comes in.

Enter the data into a stat package and do a linear regression. The result will be a function relating dial setting to powder weight for that lot of powder. Record this on a reference sheet taped to the powder jug.

I've done this for many jugs of powder, and using the weight-dial function works very well for quickly getting a powder measure adjusted to new charge weights. Of course, once pet loads are established, their measure settings go on a cheat sheet taped on the wall near the powder measure.

ctsmith,

That's pretty good.

Have you ever actually timed how many rounds you can produce in an entire hour or two? I ask because you say you're guessing about sizing time.

I'm pretty sure that's cheating somehow.

John, the sizing time is an educated guess. All the other steps are performed in the time frame of one charge on the Chargemaster which ranges depending on charge weight, but less than 15 seconds for a 308 case. The Giraud really speeds things up.

The Chargemaster is like a timer, it keeps you humping trying to stay ahead of it. There aint no relaxing or beer drinking going on. Its like a sprint, but I'm okay with that. Unlike some, I HATE spending time at the reloading bench.

I will definitely pick up this issue and check out the article.
In late 2004 I did a powder measure test. It was pretty rough but fun and I did learn a bit:
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/409097/1

ctsmith,

Yeah, a lot of time in handloading is used up in case trimming, one reason steeper-shouldered cases are popular for high-volume shooting. The Giraud and similar tools save a lot of time if you have to trim.

If I don't have to trim I can load 250-300 rounds an hour on my Redding T7 turret press. I like it a lot because it will hold up to 3 sets of dies, which a lot of time when loading for different rounds--which I do a lot.

I'm standin' here holdin' my bullschit flag down by my leg, I ain't wavin' it yet, but I'm thinkin' about it. 300rd/hr is decent, un-hurried pace for a Dillon 550, loading rifle, using the Dillon measure.

I don't think calling John out on a statement he made is Kosher. He's not in the habit of making outlandish statements and I, for one, take the man at his word.

That'a lot more than I can say for a whole bunch of Fire contributors, if you get my drift...

DF

I won't give out my address ovah the interweb. Lotsa weirdos out there.

Actually I use a BR-30 and throw all after determining the correct weight on a scale. Ball, SSC and SC powders are pretty damn close starting will the balls. Log powders are pretty much out.

I've found the jerking motion used on the BR-30 is as important as anything else. Double .

I'm not Jewish, but I like Jews, and I have the utmost respect for Mr. Barsness.