Home Forums Hunting & Shooting BPCR Shiloh Sharps #3 weight

Crimson Tide--If you saw this thing shoot, you would tear your underwear reaching for your wallet and credit card to get one. This thing is beyond crazy accurate. I've never had or seen one that shoots like this.

Bill is this a tight chamber gun or std? Are you using barrel sights on it or a vernier/scope feed us a little more info if you will, greasers or ppb's? Magnum man

MM--I have a tight chambered Business Rifle in 45-70 that shoots lights out with barrel sights--a semi buckhorn and a copper penny front blade. That rifle prompted me to get one with the tight chamber that I could put target sights on. I mounted a Parts Unknown (Red River) Mega Soule and a MVA 111 on the front on the new rifle. So this rifle has the tight chamber.

I load a 480 grain paper patched bullet over 71 grains of KIK 2f. Using a blow tube, no wiping, three days ago the rifle put 10 of these in 4 3/8 inches at 500 yards. The temperature was 100.2 F according to my digital thermometer and the humidity was 32%. The gun cleaned up with 4 patches. It will put 5 in 3 1/2 to 3 3/4 inches on a regular basis if I do my part.

The load consists of a Starline case, full length sized, a BR2 primer, and 71 grains of KIK 2f drop tubed. The powder is compressed with a compression die, and a wad cut from a milk carton, then a 3/16 grease cookie followed by another milk carton wad goes in the case. The patched bullet is seated .200 deep in the case and held in place by using a Lyman taper crimp die.

I frankly don't know whether to laugh or cry. Laugh because I have a rifle and load that shoots like this today, or cry because I didn't have it five or ten years ago.

Cool Bill, when you said it was a Montana Roughrider my mind went into overdrive and figured you wanted a LR gun with straighter stock for good cheek weld when the sight was up in the 1.5-2" on the staff.I still like the milkcarton wad at.023" thick but also have been getting excellent service from Minutemaid Lemonade cartons same stuff but at .026", you don't get good lemonade with veg wads.Lotta guys still don't understand or follow the rational of the original style tight chamber so give them a clue here and explain that sizing the new brass only needs to be done once and what your simple loading procedure is.No crying needed but you need to wander north next June and slaughter the infidels at the Q.Need more details also on your patch and bullet for those thinking of getting their feet wet on ppb's. Magnum man

Bob--I have thought about coming back to Quigley, I really have. If I go to another match, it will be the "Q". The problem is time, distance, and money. It is about 3700 miles round trip from here to Forsyth. I will have to be gone at least 9 days, maybe 10 and pull my travel trailer. That means that there will be $1300 to $1400 fixed fuel costs, and that doesn't include anything else. I will be out of pocket three grand to make the trip by the time we eat and do the other things that come up. And I can just about go to Africa again for that kind of money, or send my wife to see her family in the Philippines. When I look at it like that, the Quigley gets put off for another year. Having said that, I really would like to give Quigley another whirl. We'll see.

What we need is a gong match in western Kansas/eastern Co, sometime when the weather is half ways decent. Lord knows that country is flat enough you could have an 88000 yd target and still be able to see it..

I need to come back down and see that new rifle and file my new full buckhorn barrel site in.

Gunner

Give me a shout.

Show nuff, Bill.

Gunner

Man, I wish my S/Sharps would shoot that many rounds without wiping. About three is all I can do with PP bullets. That's why I LOVE the 475gr Parker Hale Greaser, I can shoot ALL DAY!

I know what you mean about the 475 Parker Hale greaser. It is a great bullet that shoots in all of my 45 caliber rifles. This new rifle is especially fond of it.

Bill can probably help you with advice on that,STD chambers are basically designed for grease groove use and become problematic for patch to bore dia ppb use. I've allways thought the " Holy Grail" of ppb use was to have repeat shots with accuracy without blowing or wiping.Pursued it for years and did not satifactorily realize it until getting Shiloh to build me a Business rifle with the chamber cut with Orville Loomers original style tight chamber. A std chamber has a inside case fired dia at the mouth of .460-.462" which releases .458" greasers just fine not a tight fit for a ppb patched to .450" dia.which is also the inside dia of a fire case in the tight chamber. Without a lube wad you have to rely on a multi layer exotic wad stack to seal off burning powder and gases that burn patches and flame cut bullets as well as still having to wipe every shot to maintain bore condition for repeatable accuracy.The right lube wad is the first step it lubricates your fouling and keeps it soft, if you allow your fouling to dry(from barrel heat) you lose your accuracy ,then your mere ability to chamber the next round.My 40-70 with a std type chamber was dallied with for many years of no desirable results using ppb's after using the tight chamber in my 45 2 7/8" I began to see a pattern of why it didn't work as desired. So try this, take 10 fired cases and just deprime and clean them. load them with your chosen primer, charge and card wad, compression, grease cookie, card wad. It's allready for your patched to bore dia . .450" ppb but the case mouth is still .462-.460" size the last 1/4" of case to .450 ID and install ppb or install loose and squeeze with a taper crimper. The fire formed case will provide you with the best inline seating plus having 90% of the bullet in the bore. I believe the tight case fit contributes to removing excess hard fouling in the throat.With the right lube wad and the tight chamber you can shoot long time as Bill stated without blowing and wiping.short of a tight chamber like his or mine you may not get all you want but sizing the mouth after loading a fireform case will help quite a bit. RMC thickwall brass will eliminate sizing as the fired inside dia will be.450". Talk some more with Bill and he will have his own ideas to help you out. A vld inside chamfer and using a 45acp tungsten carbide size die squeeze down the end for starters. good luck Magnum_Man

No real big trick to shooting dirty with a standard chamber, but you do need to do things a wee bit different than a rifle chambered with a copy of an original chamber.
Just need to use a bit bigger bullet, seat a little deeper and use a clean powder , along with a good wad column.

Mag, I've been working with Bill on this all along and I have been blowing after every shot and have tried fire formed and full sized brass. The 500gr brooks mold bullet seems to help quite a bit as well. I the end I'm sure it's still mostly "operator error" on my part!

Much better bullet selections in .45 caliber. I shoot a .45/100 Hartford model. It is heavy at 9 1/2 pounds. I can't imagine hunting with a 12 pound rifle.

Brass is available from reformed .348 Winchester brass which I also shoot.

Really can't imagine why anyone would try to reform 348 Win into 45-100 or AKA 45-2.6". Lets see the rim is to large as well as the base of the casing. Not to mention Bertram and Starline are readily availible as well several brands of 45 Basic brass .ppine, you maybe trolling us a little? Magnum-Man

As usual, beyond your intelligence.

Aw jeeze MM there ya go getting all practical again....
BTW you left out trimming Jamison 110 brass to length.

Gee Ranch, if a guy had Jamison 110 seems like it would be smarter to send the gun back to Shiloh and get reamed into a full sized chamber instead a wasting brass by cutting it down,into something your girl friend could shoot pop cans with.But shoot, there's no accounting for almost westcoasters is there? Magnum Man

Could very well be... I do know they make dang good 45-70 paper patch cases when you shorten them up.