Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles One man's opinion - Why the M16/AR15 sucks

I have a mini 14 and its had at least a million rounds through it and the barrel shoots as good as the day I bought it, never misfires, produces 1/4 inch groups, and has tremendous knock down power

My Mini-14 shoots minute of barn at 100 yards. My SKS is better at 6 moa. The AR is more accurate than either.

Marines in Iraq were reportedly investigated for all the dead bad guys that had head shots. Someone thought they were executing them. The Marines, with their AR platforms, were just good shots.

Marines in Iraq

Not Found

The requested URL /Interviews/Hate_the_AR15.htm was not found on this server.

The OP was 8 years ago and that link is no longer valid.

I have one friend who killed a Mujahideen at 600 yards with an M4 and another who has killed several out to at least 900 yards with a Mk12. Both prefer 5.56mm to 7.62. The latter leaves him M110 and Mk13 in their case.

Most of the rest of your post was spot on but this is wrong. The military did extensive studies and was never able to find any evidence that twist rate had any effect on lethality.

Tests that I've personally observed always showed a bullet path directly in line with the flight path. 55gr was/is a killer because it always broke at the cannelure and fragmented. M855(green-tip) does the same, usually, but requires more velocity. This is where the problem arises with that ammo and a short M4 barrel.

XM193 55grain nato... only reliably shatters out to 125 yards or so...

Is that what you found in your tests?

The 77grain/smk's upset quickly in flesh due to long length from what I read. They seem to be the answer to all the AR15's historical short comings.

Maybe a little further back, out of an M4. M855 only under a 100yd.

77's I've never tested but I've been told by a reliable source that the cannelure on the Black Hills load does nothing. It fragments reliably without it. I can't vouch for it personally but anecdotal evidence from the wars put that load head and shoulders above anything else out of an AR.

I just bought 1K Nosler Custom Comps and I hope to try a few out on some hogs.

Nosler Custom Comps

????

Have to look that up.

Nosler's cheaper bulk HP accuracy bullet comparable to Sierras.

I bought a thousand of the NCC 77's too, Sierras are impossible to get and the Hornady 75's aren't near as accurate.

Anyway I loaded the NCC's a few years ago and noticed they hit pressure before the Sierras but nothing serious, they just won't take the same max loads. I don't recall if I ever killed anything with the first box I tried but I know the Sierras kill coyotes very well. My guns liked the Sierras better but less than a 1/4" better.

I haven't loaded anything else in several years, I like the 77's.

I will add that ballistic gelatin tests show the Noslers to be slightly more frangible than the Sierras.

Thanks, I appreciate the updated info.

so XM193 out of a 16 inch barrel only shatters at 125 yards or so?

That's what I read in the funny papers...

I have never shot a critter with xm193 so I am not eye witness.

That is real real interesting. If you have some time would you elaborate more on that? I am assuming it is toting the weight day in and day out?

must be the Atlanta Journal funny papers...

You are saying it fragments further out? How far you sayin?

I'd say M4 at that range, more or less, a little farther back with a 16in barrel. I haven't done this enough times to state categorically.

Yes and the ability to carry enough ammunition to last in a firefight with a team of 4-12.