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He has a pretty good argument on removing the cattle. Nevada law requires someone who wants to keep cattle off of his place, to build a fence. Thus the feds should be required to build a fence around his 160 acres.

I'll bet he has been pretty smart about things in that the cows have always been out there and they started on his place. Up until he actually went and released them from BLM custody, I think he had a really good argument that he was not in violation of the court order.


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Originally Posted by 4100fps
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Originally Posted by 4100fps
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
Quote
He plans to put woman and children in harms way for the cause.


So, if BLM thugs shoot MEN that are not shooting at them, then it's OK? How about the fact that it's not right to fire on the protestors? No matter what sex they are?

We know you are liberal, 4100. You don't have to continually prove your stupidity and ignorance though.


When did "BLM Thugs" shoot at MEN? I missed that.

We know your a right wing fascist. Similar to Hitler. Heil Rockinbar.

When you have nothing you through out insults. Kudo's to you.

Now tripple up on the Tin foil their reading your mind.


Below is what you said.

Quote
He plans to put woman and children in harms way for the cause.


My response didn't say that anyone HAD been shot... I was asking if the BLM had shot at MEN instead of WOMEN it would have been OK?

Damnn, I didn't think I'd have to explain that, even to you... smile


[video:youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=RZd61_9hofE[/video]

I'm with you on your statement that its never right to fire on protesters ever.

You see RB usually peaceful protesters aren't laying down with a sniper rifle pointed at the "FEDS" hiding behind woman. They're usually holding signs up. I saw how peaceful those guys were. (BTW, are "FEDS" communists, from Russia, or China, maybe even Korea? Could they really just be red blooded Americans just as yourself, just doing their job?

The retired Sheriff put the woman and children up front so the world would see them getting shot in the event that some moron from either side accidentally or not fired off the first shot. Real stand up guy.

It shows at what length this right wing group was willing to go to sway public opinion.

In condoning those actions you make any normal conservative look liberal.

Glen Beck is he liberal? He's all for state ownership of the lands on the maps you keep posting up. BUT, he said Bundy is fighting one cause, (wrongly) and the "Patriots" are there for another. Makes the whole lot (and their supporters) look stupid, and ignorant. wink

yeah, i saw that picture too. I also saw the picture of the two blm snipers on the ridgeline. I guess it only works one way. If you ever wanted a representation of what the second amendment was about, maybe this was it. It ain't so easy as if only one side has the firepower.


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there was another article in the arizona azzwipe newspaper today, talking about the san pedro river. Which is a story all in itself. Lots of controversy over it. But in essence the story portrayed a developer wanting to build a 7000 house project and getting approval through the state for the "magical 100year water supply". On the other side a consortium of interests are spending big bucks to capture monsoon rain water to slowly release into the san pedro to stablilize flow. The interesting part to me was the mention for this stabilization project was the center for biological diversity working through the BLM. One of the arguments the developer was using is better him doing it than ordinary people putting in wells. It's the same ol problem, too many people moving in, too little water in an arid environment.

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You know, having a pain in the ass neighbor is the oldest story in the book. In every county in every state in the country you can find at least one simmering feud between neighboring landowners that will involve cows getting out, fences being cut, property lines being ignored/disputed and so on and so forth. Often, they are litigated for years, even decades in stop and start actions. Sometimes, the parties run out of money and reach an uneasy truce. Sometimes, one side or another will actually box the other one in legally speaking so that a true victory can be reached.

That is exactly what you have here. And the more I see about it, I can fully understand that Bundy is a pain in the ass. But the BLM basically said, "Frick all that legal stuff we're going to have to do. We've done enough. We BY GOD are the US BYGOD GOVERNMENT and we're going in there and shut this contrary self-righteous pain in the ass down with overwhelming force."

That is what they did, and in that respect they are no different or more right than that neighbor, who after years of unsatisfying litigation, finds his fence down one day, snaps, and goes and shoots his neighbor.

There has been a lot of talk about the rule of law in this instance. But if the US Government is above the rule of law and does not follow the legal forms and procedures TO THE LETTER and reserves the right to use overwhelming force, then it is no more right than anyone else who boils over with frustration and does something stupid and THERE IS NO RULE OF LAW.

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pretty much i think you said it well. intimidation only works until the other side is not intimidated, then you have no law, you have a range war.
I was talking with someone the other day about ruby ridge. Regardless of what took place and what happened, there was one part i could never get past. The swat guy shooting weaver's dog. For God's sake it was a golden retriever. I live with golden retrievers. They would lick an intruder to death. Overreach is the word i am looking for, just because i can. Which is what i think some of these entities do.
There is another thing i pulled out of the bundy mess. One of the incident commanders in the popo was described as i remember it an asst chief of police for las vegas. Las vegas is quite a ways from the bundy ranch. Who made this guy chief?
When Biden was in the prescott area last year for the memorial for the fallen firefighters they had popo from all over the state doing traffic. Odd to see uniformed motorcycle officers from way south of phx doing street duty in prescott valley. I thought their authority was limited to their jurisdiction? So what is a chandler cop doing traffic 140 miles to the north? Kind of like the las vegas guy playing popo on the arizona/utah/nevada border.

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Without looking it up, I'm pretty sure that Nevada, like most open range states, has a procedure for removing livestock your neighbor refuses to come get. You're going to have to have it fenced, then you're going to have to give them notice, then you get a court order allowing you to remove and impound the livestock, and then finally you can sell it while deducting your costs for feed, transport, and damages said livestock may have caused.

The BLM had won its case in the federal courts it was by all accounts, legally speaking, the lawful owner of the property. It should have fenced in Bundy's 160 acres, noticed him of his trespassing cattle, given him opportunity to get them, then gotten a judgment FROM A STATE COURT allowing them to impound and finally, to sell the cattle. All of that, relatively speaking, could have been done quickly and had they done so, they would be completely in the right legally. And they could have taken the sheriff out there with them.

And you know, in just about every state in the country, the case law on trespassing livestock is just about the oldest case law on the books. It would have been simple.

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Originally Posted by JoeBob
He has a pretty good argument on removing the cattle. Nevada law requires someone who wants to keep cattle off of his place, to build a fence. Thus the feds should be required to build a fence around his 160 acres.

I'll bet he has been pretty smart about things in that the cows have always been out there and they started on his place. Up until he actually went and released them from BLM custody, I think he had a really good argument that he was not in violation of the court order.

Does Nevada's fence out law exclude the federal government? It is my understanding that Utah's does.

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Blaming the cops for the situation is like blaming the enlisted guys for Vietnam.

It is the bastard in Washington (Reid) that should be defeated! I hope that bastard gets defeated next time up!


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Originally Posted by RoninPhx
there was another article in the arizona azzwipe newspaper today, talking about the san pedro river. Which is a story all in itself. Lots of controversy over it. But in essence the story portrayed a developer wanting to build a 7000 house project and getting approval through the state for the "magical 100year water supply". On the other side a consortium of interests are spending big bucks to capture monsoon rain water to slowly release into the san pedro to stablilize flow. The interesting part to me was the mention for this stabilization project was the center for biological diversity working through the BLM. One of the arguments the developer was using is better him doing it than ordinary people putting in wells. It's the same ol problem, too many people moving in, too little water in an arid environment.


These "developers" are on record, both in many meetings and on the local AM radio,......my neighbors and I ( "Those People out East of Moson Road" the preferred vernacular) are, in their eyes anyway, some sort of "problem".

They are powerful, politically astute, and "Well Connected".

The whole scenario can get pretty strange, sometimes, Ron.

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Originally Posted by RoninPhx

yeah, i saw that picture too. I also saw the picture of the two blm snipers on the ridgeline. I guess it only works one way. If you ever wanted a representation of what the second amendment was about, maybe this was it. It ain't so easy as if only one side has the firepower.
When it comes down to it, why isn't the Clark Co. Sheriff pursuing that matter? If there is evidence of people pointing guns at other people for no reason...and their was no reason as these people were peacefully supporting Bundy. Why cannot they be arrested and tried?

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Originally Posted by SoDakota
Blaming the cops for the situation is like blaming the enlisted guys for Vietnam.

It is the bastard in Washington (Reid) that should be defeated! I hope that bastard gets defeated next time up!
No it's not. This has nothing to do with Vietnam and we don't need sorry analogies like that one confusing the issue. Reid is giving the orders but somebody has to carry them out. By carrying out the order, you are agreeing with it. If there was nobody that agreed and thus carried the order out, there would be no problem unless Obama and Harry Reid themselves wanted to do it. Comprende?

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Originally Posted by RoninPhx
pretty much i think you said it well. intimidation only works until the other side is not intimidated, then you have no law, you have a range war.
I was talking with someone the other day about ruby ridge. Regardless of what took place and what happened, there was one part i could never get past. The swat guy shooting weaver's dog. For God's sake it was a golden retriever. I live with golden retrievers. They would lick an intruder to death. Overreach is the word i am looking for, just because i can. Which is what i think some of these entities do.
There is another thing i pulled out of the bundy mess. One of the incident commanders in the popo was described as i remember it an asst chief of police for las vegas. Las vegas is quite a ways from the bundy ranch. Who made this guy chief?
When Biden was in the prescott area last year for the memorial for the fallen firefighters they had popo from all over the state doing traffic. Odd to see uniformed motorcycle officers from way south of phx doing street duty in prescott valley. I thought their authority was limited to their jurisdiction? So what is a chandler cop doing traffic 140 miles to the north? Kind of like the las vegas guy playing popo on the arizona/utah/nevada border.
There is no local LE anymore. It is all countywide and statewide and can be Federalized if necessary. There may be a few backwater town Marshalls that aren't in some states, but I doubt there's even that. They haven't done it to Walmart security yet that I know of, but maybe that's the next step.

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Originally Posted by EthanEdwards
Originally Posted by RoninPhx

yeah, i saw that picture too. I also saw the picture of the two blm snipers on the ridgeline. I guess it only works one way. If you ever wanted a representation of what the second amendment was about, maybe this was it. It ain't so easy as if only one side has the firepower.
When it comes down to it, why isn't the Clark Co. Sheriff pursuing that matter?

If there is evidence of people pointing guns at other people for no reason...and their was no reason as these people were peacefully supporting Bundy.

Why cannot they be arrested and tried?

Like this guy?
[Linked Image]


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Originally Posted by EthanEdwards
Originally Posted by RoninPhx

yeah, i saw that picture too. I also saw the picture of the two blm snipers on the ridgeline. I guess it only works one way. If you ever wanted a representation of what the second amendment was about, maybe this was it. It ain't so easy as if only one side has the firepower.
When it comes down to it, why isn't the Clark Co. Sheriff pursuing that matter? If there is evidence of people pointing guns at other people for no reason...and their was no reason as these people were peacefully supporting Bundy. Why cannot they be arrested and tried?
Has any federal agent of any stripe ever been successfully prosecuted for overstepping his powers?

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Qualified immunity and all that.

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Originally Posted by rockinbbar
How about the fact that it's not right to fire on the protestors?



Nixon did it and got by with it at Kent State.


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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by EthanEdwards
Originally Posted by RoninPhx

yeah, i saw that picture too. I also saw the picture of the two blm snipers on the ridgeline. I guess it only works one way. If you ever wanted a representation of what the second amendment was about, maybe this was it. It ain't so easy as if only one side has the firepower.
When it comes down to it, why isn't the Clark Co. Sheriff pursuing that matter? If there is evidence of people pointing guns at other people for no reason...and their was no reason as these people were peacefully supporting Bundy. Why cannot they be arrested and tried?
Has any federal agent of any stripe ever been successfully prosecuted for overstepping his powers?


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Originally Posted by Snyper

Like this guy?
[Linked Image]



That's what you call "a small window of opportunity."


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Originally Posted by Reloder28
Originally Posted by rockinbbar
How about the fact that it's not right to fire on the protestors?



Nixon did it and got by with it at Kent State.

No. Nixon didn't.


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Originally Posted by Reloder28
Originally Posted by Snyper
[Linked Image]


That's what you call "a small window of opportunity."


I really hope you are thinking that you're funny, but you're not.

That is a photo of tyranny in action.


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