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My only question is:
When are you going to publish this?!!! Good grief, that's some serious analysis and a great write-up!


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I just did. I hope you found value in it.

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DIYguy, excellent testing there. We used to do a very similar test for the hunter's ed. students back in the 80's and 90's by having a student stretch a piece of deer hide across a coffee can and letting another push an arrow thru. The Zwicky's were always the easiest to get thru. The old Muzzy's and Razorback 5's were always the hardest to get thru the hide. Often, the hide could not be held tight enough on the can for the three and four bladed heads with tro-car or cone tips to penetrate.
We also did a test for toughness against bone. Shoot them at a concrete block and thru an old stop sign.
At that time nothing beat the heads made by Harry Elburg for strength, Grizzly's in particular. Usually you could pull them out with the pliers, touch up the edge and go hunting with them.
Several Zwicky's survived that test, but less than 50%. Never saw any component type heads pass the concrete or stop sign test.
Maybe you give some of the newer ones a try?
Thanks for posting your results. Looks to me like in spite of the advertising there is not much new in the broadhead world.

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Despite that many new heads hit the market every year and perhaps one ot two remain in production for a couple years. My son and I have about 450 diff heads in our collection. Some are pretty freaking silly looking and as a result did not stand the test of time.

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Very interesting piece DIYguy. As a traditional bow hunter since the 60's I came to some of the same conclusions regarding broad heads you so clearly show. I remember Paul Brunner back in the 80's or 90's doing the same experiment as you with broad heads going through an elk hide and roughly measuring the force needed for the cutting vs. the trocar type. His experiment was not as exquisite as yours but still demonstrated the dramatic difference.

Thus I have used two-bladed Zwickeys for years to good effect and, yes, experienced some "fish hooked" tips from time to time. Now I use three bladed Magnus Snuffers, COC heads but enforced by the strength of a triangulated tip.

Thanks for the posting.

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Great article, DIYguy.

Labor intensive and I appreciate your effort!

I'll continue to use the Muzzy, but will look into honing the Trocar tips as you suggest.

Thanks again.
BT53


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You sure wasted a lot of time doing something that 1. is irrelevent because it's not at bow speed as you mentioned. 2. it's been done 1000 times before with the exact same results. 3. for the guy hinting anything but the biggest game (moose, grizz, etc.) it doesn't matter because a modern bow is going to push any of the broadheads clean through the animal.

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You can really be a pouty little beyotch. Im guessing you got sand in your vaginer again. But thanks for stalking me from forum area to forum area. Its flattering. Now piss off, the adults are talking broadheads. grin

Last edited by DIYguy; 06/25/14.
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Stalking poachers is my joy in life, especially those that blame their father for their poaching.

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Originally Posted by DIYguy
You can really be a pouty little beyotch. Im guessing you got sand in your vaginer again. But thanks for stalking me from forum area to forum area. Its flattering. Now piss off, the adults are talking broadheads. grin


^

This. grin

Last edited by DIYguy; 06/25/14.
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What would be cool is if you shot a lower poundage shorter draw bow with these heads you tested into ballistic gel and see how far each one penetrated and the damage path each head created.


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Agreed but that would be a different evaluation all together. This was only an evaluation of tip design and their ability to penetrate the same medium at the same speed and under the same conditions. Ballistic gel tests are pretty interesting but they have their limitations. The main one being the pinch friction and lack of lubrication. Game animals with all their blood and other fluids are very self lubricating and the tissue opens up when cut. Those two factors are sort of opposite gel. The gel works good with bullets which kill in a different manner than broadheads. Ive often thought a more applicable alternative to gel (for broadheads) would be many stretched panels of rubber (like rubber gloves are made of) one after another with a small spacing between them.

Ive seen guys shooting through many water filled milk jugs lined up in a row to see how many jugs they penetrated.

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Very interesting comparison of tip penetration force.
Thanks for sharing.


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DIYGuy,

You mentioned that you shoot you own head. Can you show us that head and do a test on it? I love this kind of stuff. I have a broadhead design and wish I had the ability to have some made.

Thanks for the test,

Elk Country


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Good stuff there DIY

You mention a few conclusions that I would have a tangential disagreement with...for example you used KE as a factor.

I've seen arrows with appx the same KE, shot from the same bow a 430gr arrow and an 840gr arrow, and the 430 gr arrow failed miserably on penetrating a dead water buffalo.

i've seen the same outcomes but to a lesser degree with heavy animals like elk- the heavy arrow outperforms from the same bow. So what does KE have to do with how well the arrow performs?

KE is only good for comparing the potential energy in various bows IMO

I've shot COC heads for many years- mostly Snuffer ss and hellrazor. I've blown through elk scapulas with these heads and never found the arrow on the other side they blow through so easily[495gr axis]

I think, One of the main factors in BH selection is design. The shorter heads with less taper put a lot of blade compressed against the hide before entering- not good to have a dull head doing your dirty work. I've had this happen with the ST mag heads on elk and hogs that were wallowing-put that in your drill jig and I bet the scale couldn't handle it.

I bet its the same reason we see more failures on animals while using the over the top mech heads- blades compressed against hair/ hide. Anyone that has ever dulled a knife blade that way gets it- and quick- with those slim thin bevel replaceable blades

Last edited by B_Lance; 07/24/14.

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