Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting looking for good .308 bullet for elk

I am wanting a good bullet to drop elk with. I have some 190gr berger vld hunting bullets but haven't used them on game. I will be taken 2 rifles and if possible would like to use same bullet in both rifles. Will be using 308, 30-06, 300wm, & or 300rum. Not sure that 308 will get much velocity but if it would handle the heavy bullets it would be less weight. Please give thoughts and opinions. Never been on an elk hunt and don't want to mess it up if given the chance for the shot. I would also like to be able to have a bullet that will stay stable out to 600-800 yds. Thanks James

If you are talking 600-800 yards, what's going to matter most is how your rifle likes the bullet. Were it me, I'd be loading something like a TTSX in 150-168gr weight and focusing on hitting stuff inside of 450yds.

I like the 165/180 NAB or NP myself. Not sure about 6-800 yards with the 308 on elk but under 400, git ur dun!

The 150 gr. TTSX or Partition will work great on elk out of your 308 Winchester or your 30-06. But I suggest getting much closer than 600 to 800 yds. whatever you use.

If you are going to be shooting out to 600+ yards then I would suggest using your 300WM. I use a 308 as a backup gun or for Dark Timber where I plan on having shots under 300 yards. I use 180g NP in my 308 and 200g AB's in my 300 WM. I would use NP's in both but my 300 doesn't shoot the NP's as well as the AB's and visa-versa for the 308. Just shoot your bullet of choice in both rifles and see which bullet performs the best in both rifles. (If you don't what to take two different rounds.) Good luck on your hunt.

My cousin, now deceased, lived in several of the western states for many years. He killed 22 elk, almost all bulls other than a few cows on cow tags, using his pre-'64 Winchester 70 Featherweight in .308 Win.

He did not reload. I asked him once about what ammo he used? He said, "Winchester, Remington, whatever was on sale at the gun store, so long as it was 180 grains." He had no trouble putting those elk on the ground. (I don't know how many Mule deer, he killed but he also killed a couple of Black bears, and one Idaho Shiras bull moose, same rifle, same load.)

I know he never took any of those 600-800 yards shots... but he was an excellent hunter, stayed in good shape, and practiced shooting for accuracy. Got closer to the elk. Meat in his freezer.

Good luck on your hunt.

L.W.

155 gr. Scenar

rug.-165 Nosler PT loaded as fast as you can push it-Muddy

You know that a 600 - 800 yard shot at elk is extremely unlikely right?

Seasoned hunters with years, even decades of experience have taken many elk, never shooting anywhere near that far...

I'd imagine that even here on the Campfire, land of inflated egos, that relatively few will claim to have much experience with that sort of long range elk shooting. There are some, like Burns, who have made it a science. He ain't normal! (John I mean that with all due respect, and a grin on my face)

Seems like you've got several different .30 cal rifles at your disposal. I'd tend to take whichever one, or two, rifles you shoot better, and still carries easily. For bullets, there's a host of 165 - 200 gr hunting bullets avail that will do a mighty fine job on elk. Personally I've been a fan of the Nosler Partition for a very long time.

Now, my elk killing experience is limited, but I suspect you'll be hearing something similar from those guys who make a practice of filling their elk tags year after year.

Best of luck on the hunt!

Regards, Guy

I have a very good friend who shoots a lot on a 1000 yard range.I have known him for years, always told me to shoot Bergers. This year when I was at his house he changed his tune, said they shot good but not to happy with how they worked on game. I would suggest reading the web sight terminal ballistics research to study 800 yard kills on 600 pound plus cervidae. I am not only amazed at being able to shoot that far, but how the heck do you find where they were standing when you shot at em?

Works for me and my rifle over a stiff charge of Varget.

Rugerdiggs
I would strongly recommend that since you are planning on shooting at 600 to 800 yards, and apparently haven't done any shooting at 600 to 800 yards, I would strongly recommend a full metal jacket bullet. That way, those elk that you manage to get the odd shot into might al least have a long shot at surviving. I realize there will be little or no blood trail, but, what the hell, you don't sound like the kind of guy that is going to waste much time looking for an elk that doesn't drop in it's tracks. After all, if you want to shoot an elk at 600 to 800 yards, all you have to do is buy a rifle and then ask people on 24 hour campfire what bullet to use, right?
"Drop an elk?" Give me a freeking break!

165 grain Nosler Accubond!

I've shot a bunch of elk over the last 45 years. My all time longest was a lasered 350 yds. Even with the scope cranked up to 9x, it looked like a rabbit out there. It's going to take a lot more than 9x to bring in an elk at 600. If you can't get closer than 6 to 800, you need stalking skills a lot more than you need a long range bullet.

I have shot a few elk with the 308 (165 & 180 Noslers) and none at longer ranges. I tend to side with Royce on this one given the info and phrasing in the original post. BUT, let's just say you really want to and think you can make this work...

Find a 3/4 MOA (preferably better) load with the 190 VLD (try Re17) and put 100+ rounds down range each month between now and October, the majority from field positions from 200-600 yards - and if your equipment and skill allow you to be near 100% first shot hits at 600 in multiple weather conditions then, if your conscience lets you go afield and consider shooting an elk at 600... take a deep breath, know in your mind that you are capable... and then GET CLOSER.

There are a couple of guys on here that kill coyotes at twice that distance when conditions are right. But they probably have over a $100,000 invested in practice and equipment, and who the hell knows how many hours of practice.
IF you could find a bullet with a BC of 0.6 and drive it at 3000 fps, it would take it about 0.9 seconds to reach 700 yards. Add lock time, reaction time, etc, that means from the time you have committed to taking the shot and the trigger pull can't be stopped, until the bullet reaches 700 yards, is going to be over one full second. That gives the elk time to move, and since all the elk I have ever seen were moving forward, that means that bullet will likely end up in their guts.
Also, for each 3 mph that your estimate of wind is off, you are going to be 8 inches in error horizontally. Also, if that elk moves between the time you put your rangefinder down and pick up the rifle, you are going to be 9 inches off in elevation for every 25 yards the range estimate is in error. Throw in some scope parallax and a little mirage and you have some real problems. We haven't even talked about the difficulties due to finding a position in the field that even comes close to approximating bench rest stability. And then, how about changes in point of impact due to elevation and hand position changes from how the rifle was held during sight in from the bench versus firled positions?
At the risk of repeating myslf, I know there are people on this site and elsewhere that can shoot more ethically at 800 yards and farther than most can at 200 yards. I have absolutely no beef with them. But, I doubt if that what is this post is dealing with.

What state you hunting in?

I am in the camp of opinions here that believe you need to get closer. Hone those stalking skills. I have killed a few elk, the farthest was 340 yards as measured on the laser. The rest were all under 150. My fondest memory is of the bull that I stalked up a draw and shot at about 65 yards.

I have played with shooting out to 700 yards, lots of little things out of your control and they REALLY start to show up past 400 yards. I would feel comfortable shooting 450 if conditions are right, beyond that the animal would very likely get a pass from me.

I am rather fond of Nosler Partitions but there are other good choices.

600-800 yards? Not out of the questions but don't count on it. Since 1982 when I started hunting Colorado elk I've only missed hunting one or two years. For the first 30 years my longest shot was 350 yards. In 2012 I took my elk at 400 and in 2013 it was at 487 yards. No one else in my parties have gone over 400 yards and most elk - by far - have been under 300. My closest shot opportunity was one I passed on at about 25 feet but I took another at ~25 yards a few seconds later. Practice at long ranges but be well prepared for under 400 and make sure whatever bullet you use will hold up at close range (high velocity impacts) as well.

If loading a .308 Win and a .300 RUM with the same bullet, my choice would be based on bullet construction and proven performance. From my personal on-game and water jug experience, it would come down to one of these - a Barnes TTSX or a North Fork SS.

My hunting buddies and I have yet to recover a Barnes TTSX or MRX (no longer available but the predecessor o the TTSX) from antelope, deer or elk. I've driven 168g TTSX lengthwise through very close range with a .30-06 and 180g MRX lengthwise though deer at about 350 yards. My 400 yard elk kill was with this bullet on a broadside and it also exited. Based on the close range results on antelope, they expand very quickly but keep driving through, as demonstrated with the deer and elk. Water jug tests have also demonstrated they hold up well and are one of the best penetrators. We've found game drops very quickly, either straight down or within a few steps. My elk at 400 yards went about 15 feet and that was the third longest run. The longest was with an antelope that went maybe 25 yards after being shot with a 100g TTSX from my .257 Roberts. Another antelope, hit at around 300 yards with a 168g TTSX from a .30-06 went maybe 10 yards.

North Fork SS have been a favorite of mine since 2002. I've used them in a 7mm RM (140g and 160g) .30-06 (165g), .300WM (180g) and .45-70 (350g) to take elk and deer. Without exception they have held together and penetrated well, even after hitting bone. North Fork bullets have also proven very accurate in every rifle I've tried them in. My 20+ year-old (at the time) 7mm RM shot a 3-shot .262" center-to-center group with North Fork SS bullets. In my .45-70 they yielded load with an Extreme Spread of under 5fps in several 5-shot trials with under 10fps common. Mike Brady, the developer of these bullets, tested my handloads for pressure and said they were the most consistent loads he had ever seen. These bullets have two downsides - 1) they are rather pricey, and 2) they don't have as high a B.C. as many other hunting bullets. That said, the B.C.s are high enough they've never caused me problems and are not something I would worry about inside 600 yards with a bolt gun, the limit of my practice. As to the incremental cost difference, I find the proven performance to be more valuable than the money I could save. Most of your extra expense will be in load development but even that can be done for less than the cost of a good box of factory ammo. For practice I use loads that shoot to a similar POI, switching to a few North Fork loads just before hunting season. In the field the difference in cost, if saved up for several years, might buy me a cheap glass of wine with my dinner out. As with the Barnes, game has dropped very quickly. Three of the elk and all of the deer have gone down where they stood. One of those elk got back up and stumbled a couple feet so I shot it again, an unnecessary shot but one I took as a matter of my shoot-until-they-are-down policy. My elk at 282 yards with my .300WM and a 180g North Fork went maybe 25 yards, but it was dead on its feet with two holes through the lungs.

Here's a photo of three North Fork bullets I've recovered.




From left to right:

.30-06, 165g North Fork @ 2800fps, 500yds from dirt, 145.0g retained
.30-06, 165g North Fork @ 2800fps, ~25yds from cow elk, 133.2g retained
7mm 140g North Fork @ 3200fps, ~150yds from buck mule deer, 131.2g retained

The .30-06/165g bullet recovered from the cow elk Broke both front legs and a rib. Pretty good performance if you ask me.

The 7mmRM/140g bullet hit the buck mulie in the right rear ham and was recovered from up against the sternum. Again, excellent penetration.

We've never recovered a Barnes MRX or TTSX from game, so no pictures of them. The ones I've recovered from water jugs have been outstanding penetrators.

Good luck whatever you choose. I'd probably take the .308Win and .300WM with 168g TTSX or 165g North Forks and I wouldn't look back.

Elk are heavier boned, thicker muscled than deer. Given the range of 600-800 yards possible I would feel better served with the 300 wm, and with a chit ton of practice.

In reality, I am guessing around 300-400 yards would be more realistic for a shot given at an elk. My own personal druthers would be the 06' for a minimum period.

I am lost on the fad of using match bullets on game.... A hunter would be just or as better served for hunting such large game with a accubond, swift sirocco.

Speaking for the .308 only, I have killed several elk with the 180gr Sierra round nose. Don't have a lot of comment, I shot them, put the bullet where it needed to go and they fell over. My memory is not all that good but as I recall of the over 40 elk I have killed, only three were past about 150 yards.
I hunt timber or small pockets. Those that hunt later seasons in the sage brush have different experiences.

For someone who has never hunted elk before, I'd sure limit my shots a lot closer than 500-600 yards

So you want a good bullet that will drop elk regardless of range or velocity out to 800 yards? just so long as it's a .308, right?

hmmmmm. maybe you need to start your search a little differently.
pick one rifle you have that you carry well and shoot better than the rest. find what bullet it likes, I would start with the 180 partition or accubond, maybe the BT. then I would practice with it out to 600 yards until I was 10 for 10 at random yardages out to that far, practice practice practice as often as you can before your hunt. then when your time comes to hunt, keep your shots under 400 yards.

I never practice just to my max hunting distance. I practice well beyond that.

The most probable way you "will mess this up" will be because you miss a standing or slowly moving Elk @ less than 100 yards.

2ND most possible way is that you will only get 3 seconds to mount, aim and fire at a moving Elk @ less than 50 yards and you won't do all three in time.

Use the quickest to mount, fastest to aim-and-fire rifle that you have. failing that: use the one you shoot the best.

PS: Many decades ago I killed 5 nice Bulls in a row with a .308 Win Model 88 using 180 grain Rem factory ammo. It was excellent for that work because it was (relatively) short and fast with more than adequate power.

be prepared for a 4 to six foot drop,at the ranges you are talking about..

Thanks for the input fellows. I hope to get one in bow range but want to be able to close the deal with a long ethical shot also if that's all I have. I have shot my 308's to 800 with no problem with some 175's and CFE 223 but wouldn't shoot that far on an elk with it. If I take my 308 it will be for shorter work. The reason I ask this was in hopes to get a bullet with good terminal ballistics at ling range with muzzle velocities of 2700-3100fps (depending on bullet weight and cartridge used) on an elk size animal. Around here we only have small game, such as whitetail that are on average 130# dressed for a mature buck, lots of coyote's and hogs. Shooting long range is probably one of my favorite past times just below spending time with my kids. I shoot my 223's a lot from 400-600 yards with 69gr sierra's with a straight 10x scope. We use 5" balloons and sometimes go to 700 with a gallon jug filled with water and red dye. I have a custom 300wsm that jim see that owned center shot rifles that I have taken to 1000 with 178gr amax and some AA4350 and a SS 20x scope. Also another custom 6.5X284 I bought here from wifowler that shoots lights out and have put a 6shot group in 1.3" at 309yds. I don't believe in unethical shots, had a buck 2 years ago that I was almost 100% sure he was at 850yds as I have shot at plates at same place he was but my leupold range finder wouldn't come on so I passed ( I have a leica 1600B now) . If the animal is not setting still or if I have doubt I will pass. I wanted to get opinions on the bullet so I can start getting my load and start practice now. I have nothing to prove to the na sayers on here but thanks to all the positive comments.

shootin elk in the next county is funny,i live in eastern oregon in the desert, long shots like that just dont much happen.my cousins do in wyoming shootin speed goats though.there might be a few tommy tacicals but not many locals

You've gotten an earful over the distance already so let me get to what you actually asked. Go with the RUM or Win Mag & 200gr Accubond. Practice your ass off with that rifle until you are more than proficient, but so you shoot as second nature. You MUST practice in field positions, conditions, and at angles. Much has to do with the area, but you can expect big elevation changes from day to day. Getting in shape starting now will help you when it's time to control your breathing. Most commonly, as others have mentioned, are short quick shots at moving animals. If you can consistantly make shot's on hogs or coyotes out to 600 and practice beyond that you will be fine as long as you can respect the wind.

Long shot's have to be done when you have time to make the shot, which requires not only ranging but reading wind. The wind and the animal moving are what makes it difficult.

I passed an opportunity last year at a amazing bull because of distance. It's the first one I've passed up on distance alone since I started elk hunting in '83. My favorite has been a 250gr .338 bullet out of a quick pointing easy carrying rifle. There are places I carry a .308W with 180's because it is a 16" barrel with a 1.5x scope that is the quickest to shouler that I'm comfortable making longer shots with if need be. As of yet, I've never shot it beyond 150yd or so at an animal. My closest was tweleve steps.

190 LRAB

nosler partition or acubomb or barnes ttsx all work very well.you also dont need a magnum for elk,a 308 or 30-06 or 7mm-08 is enuff.but what ever caliber you use practice is what will fill your tag.find what your rifle likes for bullets and loads,not whats popular.it dont take alot of speed and size to kill,shot placement and penetration is everything.i want to see a pic of ya with that elk this winter

Is that a hunting bullet? Thanks James

Get in shape, figure out how to find elk on public ground.

Those should be your priorities as a first time elk hunter.

Fuggin' crickets..

I hope to f-u-c-k the OP isn't coming to Montana.

Exactly!!!

How did you know, believe I will bring my Barrett with 660gr fmj

Wow! A Barrett!!

Really?

Wow. I shoot clay pigeons at 600 using 9x scopes. It's hard, but it can be done. (A 14x makes it much easier.)

Elk at 600 are still big targets at 9x.

Yep. I wear them out at 300 using my little Mark AR scope which tops out at 3.9x magnification.

sounds like a bunch of guys arguing who has the biggest dick.

You're projecting. Other guys' dicks are prominent in your thought processes.

pretty accurate description of most threads on this forum.

especially those well outside hunting season.... when we really have nothing better to do than argue.

rugerdiggs,

I can't think of a good-quality .308 caliber bullet that won't work. Nothing living is long for the world sans its heart and/or lungs. What destroys it/them is immaterial. That it/they are destroyed is. Put a bullet where it needs to be and get ready for a whole lot of messy work.

I am assuming you haven't hunted the Rockies, and you're hoping to hunt elk in the Rockies. There are some essential factors you ought to consider. Being in great shape where you live might not be good shape at 10,000'.

Where air is thin an breathing labored, you will know every ounce you're carrying.

Shooting at walking big game that's 200 yards away at 10,000' is infinitely more difficult than hitting a target 500 yards from a bench rest.

Time of year will probably be the variable that determines shot distance. You might want to try for a rut hunt.

My advice: take your lightest rifle that you feel confident using.

No big game animal is going to know whether it gave up its ghost to a .308 Win or a .300 RUM. But you'll know because of the weight you'll be carrying.

I will use my 40 year old Model 700 in .270 Win this year on a Rocky Mountain elk hunt in a hard-to-draw area. I have a 7MM Rem Mag, which, when the cartridge was introduced, was the definitive long range elk cartridge, but my rifle that fires it is a lot heavier.

Keep in mind that long before elk and other big game animals became much more difficult to kill, our North American hunting forefathers were knocking the heck outta deer, elk, moose, and everything else with surplus rifles chambered for 7x57, '06, .303 British, and 8x57, along with .30-30 Win, a cartridge that just will no longer kill any big game animals ;-)

Best of luck to you.

Yes if you can find them. Took me 3 months to find 2 boxes of 100.

Get yourself some 168 grain Barnes TTSX and you'll be set.

150 ABs will do it.

A single .30-06/150g AB combo worked on this one, at 262 yards. Although the shot felt good I thought I had missed because when I recovered from the recoil I saw an elk walking away. Thought about shooting it a second time, then thought better of it and went looking. Found my elk on the ground where it had been standing.

Glad I didn't take a second shot to put down what I thought was a possibly/probably wounded elk...

I hope to be hunting south of Carbondale CO, looks elevation goes from 7500ish to 10,000+ in a hurry in places. May have found some 200gr accubonds, if I do I will see what kind of accuracy I can ring out of them with my 30-06 and 300wm. My 30-06 is the twin to "Coyote Hunter" mine is wearing a burris, his may be also. Its a fairly light rig and has harvested many whitetail. I have a 300wm in the same gun and in a sendero, will see how they like them also. The sendero I have are not mountain gun material but if we are on horseback maybe. Thanks for all the input.

rugerdiggs -

It sounds like we have matching sets of twins with the .300WM and .30-06.

Left to right:
.338WM, Burris Fullfield II 3-9x w/ Ballistic Plex reticle
.300WM, Burris Fullfield II 3-9x w/ Ballistic Plex reticle
.30-06, Burris Fullfield II 4.5-14x w/ Ballistic Plex reticle



The blued .300WM is a factory configuration. Apparently no one wanted it and I got it NIB on closeout at Sportsmans Warehouse in 2003 - I couldn't pass up on the $375 price. The stainless .30-06 was made in 2001 and I got it in 2010. It was gently used and came in a laminate stock, which I replaced (but kept). That one cost me $480. (My wife liked the stainless/laminate look and twisted my arm. ) The .338WM started out as a naked action manufactured in 1994 that I purchased in 2009 or 2010. It received a barrel Cariboujack wasn't using and a new boat-paddle stock purchased from gunpartscorp.com. Between the three rifles they've taken 5 elk in 5 hunting trips.

In 2010 I took the .300WM and .30-06 to the range for a final scope check. After a couple shots each at 100 yards I went to the long range where I proceeded to kill 5 clay pigeons at 600 yards with 2 shots from one and 3 shots with the other. (After which I quit while I was ahead.) The elk in my post above was from a few days later.

If only they were more accurate...

Bullets used for the elk were:

.338WM, 225g Nosler AccuBond (2 elk)
.300WM, 180g North Fork SS and 180g Barnes MRX (2 elk)
.30-06, 150g Nosler AccuBond (1 elk)

Prior to the shot I was a little leery of using the 150g AccuBond. Needlessly so - it was a bang-thud.

Good luck on your hunt.

Ok, I will ask.

Why the 150AB? Why the 150 over the 165 or 180? Higher muzzle velocity over weight and sectional density?

I get the 180 lower muzzle velocity but is the 150 that much better than the 165? Serious question.

Nice looking guns, I almost had a 338wm in the skeleton stock but I let it get away. But I have them in 22mag, 223, 22-250, 260, 7mag, 308, 30-06, and 300wm. Nearly all of them are wearing burris scopes as well.

I think the 165gr bullets are what kinda put the 308 on the big game map. A little more lead than the 150's and a little more velocity than the 180's. Really good match of bullet and cartridge. powdr

That was always my thinking too. A smartly loaded 165 partition has accounted for a lot of meat on my family's table.

I have seen a few recommendations in different threads for the 150AB as a great all around 308 bullet to include elk hunting even from respected men like Mule Deer. Got me thinking what I was missing. I could see the 150AB as perfectly adequate for cow elk but does the recommendation stand for a big bull?

I hear the follow up to come.. "That its all about shot placement!"
Well I am a well-practiced ethical hunter not a sniper. So what makes the 150AB better suited for the 308 over the 165 or 180 if conventional wisdom guides one to start at 165+?

A perfectly reasonable question and the answer is "None of the above".

Instead it was a matter of chamber dimensions and the need for easy visual identification of the ammo. The stainless MKII boat-paddle .30-06 was my 3rd .30-06. An older M77 and a Rem M700 were already in the safe. They both had long throats and I had developed long COL 165g North Fork and 168g Barnes TTSX ammo that could be used in either. Along comes the stainless MKII. It had a shorter throat and wouldn't accept the loads I was using in the other .30-06 rifles.

I developed a shorter COL 150g Ballistic Tip load and switched to AccuBonds shortly before for an upcoming antelope hunt where two nephews would be using the rifle. Those loads worked well and the rifle and load went along on an elk hunt a month later with the boat-paddle .300WM as my deer back-up/deer rifle. The .30-06 was lighter and it ended up being my primary rifle instead of my back-up. The elk shown in my post above was the result.

Both the BT and AB loads were visually very different than my NF and Barnes loads, which was important to me. They worked in all three .30-06s but were the only loads I could use in the stainless boat-paddle. Following elk season I had the throat reamed on the stainless and can now safely use the same loads in all three rifles.





As noted above, it was the differences in chamber dimensions and the need for easy visual identification that lead to the development of my 150g BT practice and AB hunting loads. This year I find myself in a similar situation with my 4th .30-06, a Ruger American Dad gave me last summer. It is also short throated and won't accept my 165g North Fork or 168g Barnes loads.

As a result I am developing custom loads for it. It can use the short COL 150g BT and AB loads I have on the shelf but I'm working up new loads specifically for it that will also work in the other rifles - just as I once did for the Remington M700. In addition I have some 180g Ballistic SilverTip (because standard BTs were not available) loads waiting to be tested. If they work I would switch to 180g AccuBonds and verify ballistics before going hunting. Last night I purchased 100 blemished 180g Partitions from SPS. Once they come I will work up a load for the American using them.

Dad gave me 4 boxes of Federal 165g Sierra GameKing s with the rifle as well as 1 box of Federal 165g Trophy Bonded. The GameKings failed to impress in water jug tests or in the accuracy department and won't be going hunting. One box of Trophy Bonded doesn't allow much practice and -- since I don't plan to buy any more -- they aren't likely candidates, either. At this point I'm really hoping the 180's work well. If they do, the AccuBonds or Partitions will be my choice for elk this year.

Coyote- Thanks for that. I get the needs you had to fill. Seems to provide success. It was not my intention to call you out. Just that two posts in a row advocating the 150AB got me thinking if I could make a better mousetrap.

No offense taken. I tend to be a wordy SOB. A big part of my professional life has been written and verbal communication where I have to analyze options and advocate solutions that cost tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars. Guess its in my nature.

IMHO then that's what you should bring.I'd load a 165 NPT to about 2900 fps,and practice a lot out to 400-500 yards. In all likelihood you will kill at half that distance or less but you never know.There are other good 165's that will do as well.

I have seen this combo work on elk a number of times with no drama,and have even handed it to one novice elk hunter who had never killed an animal with a rifle;he polished off a nice bull with a single shot at 300 yards.

Your Ruger will be light to carry and you have confidence in it, which is far more important than other considerations.

Thanks BobinNH

I will do lots of practice, I believe I just found 3 boxes of 180 accubonds. If the deal goes through maybe the 30-06 will shoot them well. I ran a quick drop chart on Gseven and if I can get 2650 at the muzzle and sighted in at 250yds it should give me 3.3" high at 100, 2.6" high at 200, 4.4" low at 300 ( first hash down is 304yds) 2nd hash is 390yds, and 4th is right at 475yds. I have low profile target turrets on one of my burris scopes that is not in use, will put it on there and that way I will also have the capability of dialing my scope also. This is "IF" all goes as planned

Get closer. Use whatever shoots accurately in your rifle. We all have our preferences and go-to bullets but the truth of the matter is you've got to hit the vitals. Any bullet/load that get you on target in the vitals will work.

Good luck, sounds like you have some solid options. 2650 with a 180AB in any 30-06 should be an easy day. Between that and your 300 Win Mag, you'll be in great standing. Once elk get in your blood you'll be back and continuing to refine your rigs.

Nice. Ive killed three with a .308- longest was 225. Favorite bullet right now is the 150 ttsx at 2850. Wouldn't take a shot past 400 though.

kman has a 308 bullet test posted in Hunting Rifles. Pretty good info in the post IMO

Getting closer is the ideal but not always practical or even possible.

Most states, if not all, require expanding bullets for elk. A bullet that doesn�t expand may well fail to do the job even though it passes through the vitals. When I was first testing Barnes X bullets (160g in a 7mm RM) I found their performance to be very erratic. A coyote at 100 yards dropped instantly on a broadside to the chest yet I never found the entrance or exit holes. Then an antelope took two to the chest at a slight angle, range 300 yards. It stopped after the first and after the second laid down, head up high, as if sunning itself. Some 20 minutes later I had worked my way around the hill and had a ~75 yard shot. The antelope struggled to its feet and started to walk away at an angle. The third XLC hit a rib, messed up the heart and put the unfortunate critter out of its misery. The wound tracks for the first two bullets showed little or no sign of expansion. The third caused a lot more damage, whether because the bullet expanded or by flying rib fragments I can�t say. All bullets exited.

At one time I was experimenting using my .22-250 with FMJ�s on coyotes. Even with well-placed hits the results were far from satisfactory. As a result I went back to expanding bullets.

Even getting expanding bullets to the vitals with a well-placed hit can be problematic if the bullet is not suited to the task and impact velocity. I�ve seen the dust fly when an elk was hit broadside with a .243, only to have the elk lost after it wandered off. (In fact, I believe I�ve seen more elk wounded and lost to .243�s than with all other cartridges combined, which is one reason I have no interest in using them on elk.)

Then there is the problem of shots gone awry and situations where you must take a bad angle or let a possibly wounded elk get away. In those situations my preference is to have a bullet that will hold together, expand reliably and penetrate deeply. Bullets do not behave the same in these situations with some providing what I want much more reliably than others. Those are the kind that I take elk hunting. Light or thin-skinned cup-and-core bullets at high velocity need not apply.

180 grain NP has worked well for me on elk in my 30.06 and 300 Win Mag. I would probably use a 165 grain NP in the 308 Win. Other bullets will work for sure but the NP is hard to beat on big critters.

My youngest son was drawn for a cow elk tag this year. He'll be using his good old .30-06, a 6x Leupold, and 165 gr Nosler Partitions. It's a combo he's familiar with, and good with.

If the elk is out at 800 yards, we'll get closer.

That should work. Good luck to your son!

Very good information thanks, do you have a favorite .30 cal bullet for elk?

Believe I have settled on using a 300wsm that is being built if its back in time to get some field time with it. I have 3 boxes of 180gr accubonds to try.

rugerdiggs -

This year I plan to use a 180g AccuBond and a .30-06. The main thing I want is a bullet that won't come apart at close range (high velocity) yet will expand reliably at the longest ranges I'm willing to take a shot. (I practice to 600 but have never taken elk past 487.)

North Fork are my favorite overall based on results in multiple calibers and weights, including 165g/.30-06 and 180g/.300WM. Trophy Bonded and A-Frame bullets should perform about the same. Beyond that, the Barnes MRX (no longer available) and TTSX have worked well in 165g and 180g weights. I wouldn't lose any sleep using Partitions based on the experiences of others I've hunted with.

By far the most important factor is putting the bullet in the right place. Do that and it won't matter much what you use.

Best of luck on your hunt.

Wellllll, I am no expert by any means, but I know that a shot at that distance without a A LOT of practice from a very stable position is way beyond my comfort level. I have only hunted for about 21 years in CO and my son has went with me since he was 8. When we were hunting the winter range near Maybell for cows, he was fine. I waited until he was 17 to take him to the hills. For him, I had him start with a .308 win and 250 was max distance and then to a 300 wsm, and now he shoots a 270 wsm. When I let him shoot, we started at the bench, when we finished he was shooting off sticks or a saw horse. Usually we shot at least 100 times. I never shot an elk from my stomach or a bench. I wanted him to be ready, because you don't always have a lot of time or second chance. My hunting buddy's late father was old school and had wisdom beyond my belief. His best advice was, don't shoot one unless he is big enough or small enough. Truer words have never been spoken for anyone that packs one out! I was fortunate to hunt with a native, and always acclimated for at least 2 days.

The stalk IS the hunt.

My elk bullet is the same as my deer/pronghorn bullet........5 sates and 2 continents

It was also my PG Africa bullet with 10 animals

30-06 150 grn Accubond

The longest shot in my records being 341

200 grain Sierra spitzer boattail from an '06. Accurate in my rifle, and when I do my part couldn't ask for more. Had a string of 5 cow elk that took a combined total of 3 steps. No bullets recovered. What more could one want?

Here is what I found. If your hunting Elk in open country A very long shot is 400yrds. Beyond that the wind, bad rest, heart rate, heavy breathing, time to get on target, Elk moving all kill your ability to make a clean shot. I have a few Elk rifles. The 308, 30-06 class are fine 200yrd Elk rifles. They start lacking energy beyond that. 7mm rem Mag with 160-175gr bullets are fine for that rare 400yrd shot. Then there is what I carry most days when Elk hunting. 300 win mag loaded with 200gr Partitions at 2900fps. Good from 50yrds to 500yrds and a bit beyond if you have spent the time practicing. If you think hunting Elk is all about long shots, You need to hunt Elk more. Several times I have set up on nice Bulls at over 500yrds. Just because you can see them in your scope, Have ranged them with the range finder, doesn't mean you should shoot. Imagine you just climbed a 7000' ridge, Spot a Nice bull across the canyon or out on a spur ridge. Wind is blowing about 30mph, temp is 15deg up from zero when you started the day. You just spent 3hr hunting up the mountain. You get set up, sitting with your shooting sticks. Dig out the range finder and you keep getting reading on the bull. 535yrd then 615yrds, 585yrds, 615yrds. The deep cold and wind is screwing with the reading, your shaking from the excitement, The battery is cold. Bull is calm, has not seen you. You wait for a shot, look for a line of travel you can get closer. Longer you wait, the colder you get. The worse the sight picture looks. Wind is still gusting past 30mph. That is Elk hunting. Not some fantasy written in a hunting rag.

Sounds like you need a new range finder, fresher batteries or steadier hands. You might also want to switch loads in your .30-06 if you think they are lacking past 200 yards.


While a .300WM provides more energy and velocity than a .30-06, the difference is not nearly as great as the 300 yards you suggest. Take your .300WM/200g Partition at 2900fps. At 500 yards it is doing about 2186fps and delivers 2121fpe. A .30-06/180g AB at 2800fps is still doing 2310fps with 2133fpe at 360 yards. At 500 yards that same .30-06 load retains 2134fps and 1820fpe, which is comparable to many .30-30 loads at the muzzle. When the day comes that I can�t take an elk cleanly at 500 yards with a .30-06 the day has come for me to quit hunting them as the problem isn�t with the cartridge.

I agree elk hunting is not all about long shots. In 33 years of elk hunting I�ve never taken or seen an elk taken where a .30-06 or .308 Win would not have sufficed, and that includes my two longest kills at 400 and 487 yards. (I used a .300WM and .338WM on those shots, respectfully.) Both were standing broadside shots across to the next ridge from a sitting position. I would guess the vast majority of elk are taken at ranges well under 300 yards. Of the 13 elk I�ve taken since 2000, all but three were inside that range.

As to the weather, yes, it can be cold. It can also be short sleeve weather, depending on where and when you hunt.

Good post.
For someone to try to convince you that you aren't shooting at long enough range is simply looking for an excuse to spout off.
Guessing you probably don't need someone from another part of the country to tell you about your weather.

I'll PM the address for the check. I assume your buying all the new gear you think I need. PS: I'm a few elk ahead you, but have been hunting since before 2000.

Alamosa �
I�m guessing you didn�t read my post closely enough. Nowhere and in no way did I suggest baltz526 wasn�t �shooting at long enough range�. That concept doesn�t even begin to compute.

The only mentions of range in my post were with specific regard to cartridge capability, to agree that �elk hunting is not all about long shots� and to state that all but three of my elk since 2000 have been taken under 300 yards. (In fact, all but those three have been taken under 300 yards since I started in 1982.)

What I took issue with was that a .30-06 is a �fine 200yrd� elk rifle but starts �lacking energy beyond that�. baltz526 contends a .300WM is good to �500yrds and a bit beyond� but ignores the fact that a .30-06 can provide the same energy at 360 yards that his vaunted .300WM load does at 500. Wouldn�t that make a .30-06 at least an adequate 360 yard cartridge by his own yardstick?

I also pointed out that at 500 yards a .30-06 can deliver the same energy as many .30-30 loads do at the muzzle. Does anyone seriously suggest a .30-30 is inadequate for elk at muzzle contact distances? Certainly not I.

baltz526 describes one possible scenario and flatly states �That is Elk hunting. Not some fantasy written in a hunting rag.� While I have no idea what his hunts are like, no one I know has climbed 7000� up a ridge to hunt and if he is referring to 7000� above sea level, hell � you might be going downhill to get to that altitude. As to the weather, I can only think of maybe 3 years since 1982 when the weather was particularly nasty. Often we wish temps would drop to sub-freezing to keep the ground from thawing and turning into mud. Many years the ground has been completely dry with crunchy leaves and we found ourselves hoping for snow to quiet things down. We�ve learned to dress in layers because clear skies, bright sun and normal exertion can leave you sweating. It isn�t at all uncommon for us to �find the perfect aspen tree�, drop our packs, then lean back and take a snooze while basking in the warm sunlight. baltz526� description of an elk hunt may be based on an actual experience, as are many articles written in �hunting rags�, or it may be � and I suspect is - a composite which would make it a �fantasy�. In any case many hunters experience vastly different weather conditions than what he describes, including those who write about it in hunting rags. That isn�t elk hunting �fantasy�, it�s a fact.

A few examples, starting with 2003:


2005:


2006, hunting buddy�s elk. Mine is down on hillside in background.


2007, elk down on left:


2009:


2010, son-in-laws elk is down on far peak (382 yards or close thereto):


2011, with mud�:
[img]http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/IMG_13584.JPG[/img]

2012:
[img]http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/IMG_057511.JPG[/img]

2013, more mud under the snow, freezing temps would have been welcome:
[img]http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/20131107_085507.jpg[/img]

Yep, looks like a few easy country hunts you got there. We have too few Elk to get many easy ones

This is Colorado, with 52 mountains over 14,000 feet and many more reaching above treeline. Elk are where you find them. I spent years hunting high but found it isn't always necessary. They all come down for the winter.

This is elk hunting in Colorado. Easy? Not really, as the 75% of hunters that go home empty-handed every year will attest.

Nice looking animals,

I ran across a deal on 3 boxes of 190gr long range accubonds and in hopes they shoot, if not I have some 180's that should. Now just the hurry up and wait game on waiting for my rifle to be finished and get it in my hands. And trying to decide which optics to have ready to put on it.

Necked down to .243, with 100 grain Premium bullets of course.

Over-emphasis on armament, IMHO.

What the OP really needs is what I had about 10 years ago. An elk hunt made easy...

A friend who lives in the area handed me a map marked "elk here" at 11,000 feet on the contour line, and gave me his brother willing to "guide". (These guys are annually successful on elk as bow-hunters).

i.e. " we will go about 3 miles up this FS trail to the big boulder, then turn left and go up-slope. Can't miss it".

We didn't. A .260 with 140 gr. factory loads at 150 yards did DRT on the cow. 10,500 elevation, up from 7500 at trailhead)


OK - Robert did go with me, spotted the elk, and did most of the dragging 1500 feet elevation wise down this rocky dry watercourse (we pitched her over a couple 20' dry water falls on the way) until we hit an impassable deadfall, where we dressed and quartered her. 75 feet from the trail, 2 miles from the trailhead. Damn, I hate those long packs to a decent trail out... Especially since I'd been living at 12 feet above sea level. And forgot my knife at the gas- heated cabin we'd stayed in at trail head... But Robert had two knives. He shared.

I'm thinking I might go back this fall- at 65, I'm only 10 years older, and Robert is only 15 lbs heavier... (I'm not). He and my brother couldn't catch chit for salmon or halibut up here in Kenai last week...

I'm thinking he needs the exercise to loose that belly fat.. A guy's gotta look out for his buddies...

Great story, las! Elk hunting is addictive.

In regard to the thread, I'm looking for a good elk for my .308 bullet.

Neck that Barrett down to .243 with a Premium 100 gr bullet, and yer good to go..

Or, one could learn to hunt, in preference to lobbing them out there...where practicable.

I have to admit, with a known, laser-ranged finding, and the 17 inch bbled '06, or the feather-weight 700TI bbled Rem 725 in .260, I'm ok out to 400 yards with a solid rest.. Not happy, just OK. (The last 9 caribou have gone 200, mostly 350 and out...some with the below, - tho lucky range sans range-finder guess don't hurt none either...)

I'll push the much customized 10 lb Mauser 98 in '06 with 27 inch heavy barrel to 500, ditto the (mostly) factory standard Ruger .338 WM. (I've ranged both to 700 - and I'm not going there - not on animals.

If the Leopold 800si range finder isn't reading it, I'm not shooting at it (it's good to 550 or so, under field conditions)... But then the ATV or snow machine is packing the Mauser wt., it's not a hiking rifle - and I'm not hiking more than 5 or 6 miles per day with the also 10 lb .338. (When one comes upon 10 lbs of steaming brown bear poo in heavy cover, it's a mite more comforting than that short-barreled '06, tho likely not much more effective if the fit hits the Shan... and either kills moose quite effectively).

As JJHack says, there's about 100 things can happen at long range. Only one is good.

With skill, practice, and time to set up the shot, one can cut the odds at long range somewhat. Until Murphy shows up. And the SOB will, at the most inconvenient of times.

My idea of the perfect shot is powder burns on the hide, but one must of course be prepared for something beyond that.... YMMV as to where that is.

My best shot to date was with the .338, pushing a hand loaded 275 gr Speer GS on a spike moose at 16 yards.... head, on, just under the chin into the spine. Damned near took his head off.... A bit of over-kill, perhaps.....

las -

I have to admit to a certain amount of jealousy regarding you guys that live in AK and get to hunt moose - at least until I think about the pack out. An elk is enough for me. Somehow I keep managing to shoot them when I'm alone and have to pack them out by myself. Gets harder every year.

Really enjoyed your descriptions and can empathize with a multi-mile pack on elk. Some years ago my hunting buddy and I took three elk down on a mountain top. No horses, ATVs or even a game cart. We could see my truck three miles away and 1,000 feet down. Thank God for cold temps that year. We hung the meat, packed out the straps and filets and spent three additional days hiking back up to the top and boning and packing out the meat. Lesson learned, we won't be doing that again! The average pack for my last six elk is 390 yards, the longest being 1100 yards last year and the shortest, in 2007, being 0 yards (i.e. drive up and lift into the truck bed).

No wonder I find antelope hunting more and more appealing. $34 each for WY does, up to 4 tags, easy packs even without a cart, generally good weather and oh, so tasty!

YES

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