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Originally Posted by Poconojack
The Whelen is a fake....


That I wouldn't doubt for a second.First tip off for me is "professionally refurbished". If that Whelen carbine had factory documentation it would be worth about $20,000.No one ould be selling it for $3k if it were real,refinished or not.



But some odd stuff came through the Winchester Custom shop.Then as now, there were lots of rifle nuts who were never satisfied with anything standard;seemed the custom shop would build what you wanted.

Mentioned this before, but over a decade ago I walked into a high end gun store and saw a pre war standard grade in 405 Winchester with factory documentation. It was one of two and no one knew where the second one was.I was still skeptical but looked it up in Rule,and it is footnoted somewhere in there.

For awhile I owned an original Super Grade 264 standard weight that I bought cheap because no one thought it was real, but only because it was not supposed to have been made(they never cataloged a SG 264 WM). But the guy who owned it was just a NH gun buyer who owned it a long time,and had no incentive to fabricate a phony. He was also dead when I bought it.I suspected it was a CS rifle.

Then, sure enough, I saw a picture of one in Whittaker's book.So you never know what they cranked out on request.It's what makes collecting interesting but it's all too treacherous for me.

Last edited by BobinNH; 07/24/14.



The 280 Remington is overbore.

The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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BobNH, I bet that is one of those'I wish I still had' Winchesters! I have been told by an old 'BIG' hardware store owner that the Winchester sales rep could get darn near anything you wanted done. very best winpoor

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Bob, SG's are easy to "fake" by just changing out the stock and floorplate. IMO if it's "fake" it's still worth about $1000 more than if it was a standard grade because the stock and floorplate can just as easily be changed back to original and the SG parts can be sold for about $1000. I have a 250/3000 SG carbine that is impossible to determine if it's an original SG or not but I still don't consider it a cheap gun, I consider it worth about $1000 more than standard carbine.

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Also remember that there are many different eras of stocks so if you know what you're looking at you can't just throw any pre-war SG stock on a standard as there are several different Pre-war SG stock patterns. a 1940 rifle with a late 40's SG stock is a dead give away.

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True, i'm in Alaska and relatively young to be into guns as much as I am. Most of the guys around here are 15 to 20 years my senior, but I still see people selling winchesters who have no idea weather they have a gem, or a piece of junk and it doesn't matter in their opinion because all pre 64 are worth at least 1000 according to them. The guy I was talking about who owns a whelen, has a mid fifths serial number with a early 60's stock pattern, it was right before the change and they started shrinking the checkering pattern, and I believe using either impressed checking or machine cut checking, but I don't remember its been a while since I have cracked Mr Rule's book. Someone asked a question a few posts back and about if it was the 35 Remington or 358 winchester was recalled. I think it was 35 Remington because it has that weird rebated rim and short case which caused extracting problems if memory serves.


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AK I don't remember anything on 35 Rem recall but I know the 358's were recalled. Did they even make enough 35 Rem to worry about a recall? I'm guessing well under 100 were made in 35 Rem in all variations.

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In Rule's book I believe he has photos of a Winchester M54 9X57MM that was rechambered to 35 Whelen by the custom shop.

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Originally Posted by reelman
Bob, SG's are easy to "fake" by just changing out the stock and floorplate. IMO if it's "fake" it's still worth about $1000 more than if it was a standard grade because the stock and floorplate can just as easily be changed back to original and the SG parts can be sold for about $1000. I have a 250/3000 SG carbine that is impossible to determine if it's an original SG or not but I still don't consider it a cheap gun, I consider it worth about $1000 more than standard carbine.


reelman like I said collecting is too treacherous for me smile.

I have picked up a couple of "users" recently that are clean and functional,and those are the one's that make me happy.

Winchester Poor, yes that is one of many I wished I had kept....it was stupid accurate!




The 280 Remington is overbore.

The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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I'm like Bob. I stay away from the real "treacherous" ones. I enjoy the hell out of the "shooters" I have in the collection. The way I see it is, anything really rare, better have documentation to back it up or there's a good chance it's not original..


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