Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire What is the difference between Agnostic and Atheist?

If there is an omnipotent and omniscient God, don't you think He factored the two into his dynamic?

Issac,

So a god that punishes the ignorant is worthy of worship? Someone who doesn't know God, hasn't been introduced to Him, or isn't 'smart enough to know the 'obvious'?

Fear worthy maybe.

Atheist proclaims he knows God is a ruse and does not exist.


An Agnostic admits he does not have the answers. In my case I have a hard time believing in that what I can't see, hear or smell, but also recognize that greater minds then my own throughout history have been believers, so who am I to say?

By definition, your hpothesis means that all thought is determined by electro-chemical processes; material processes of cause and effect, if you will. Materialism (your hypothesis, or belief---the idea that the universe is comprised of nothing more than material causes and their effects) necessarily entails a denial of any such thing as the metaphysical freedom of the mind, freedom of thought that is. This entails the belief that "truth" is entirely illusory. For there to be such a thing as "truth" the mind must be free to distinguish the truth from error and materialism denies that possibility. A mind whose "thoughts" are the mere by-products (effects) of material causes is not free in the metaphysical sense to apprehend anything. Truth, in the materialis universe, is therefore an oxymoron. It is a self-contradiction. Materialists are therefore very much like that very first philosopher---the Cretan who said that all Cretans are liars!

Atheism is a dogmatic position that goes way beyond the evidence and is, in the final analysis, self-refuting.

So a god that punishes the ignorant is worthy of worship?
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No, He's not.

Now,

This is a thought provoking post.

I can see some research on "materialism" in my future.

I have analyzed my own data and found your results to be independently confirmed. ;-{>8

Idaho, for an excellent read, you might consider Phillip Johnson's "Reason in the Balance". There are also some things I could send you (short articles, if I can find them, if you want them). He is a retired Berkely law professor who writes very clearly.

Jordan

So falsifiability is your criterion? I think the beliefs of the most certified Wittensteinian Atheist/empiricis/positivist can be shown to be as utterly dependent upon an act of metaphysical faith as the beliefs of the most fundamental Biblical literalist. Atheists are, virtually by definition, materialists. But materialism denies the possibility of the metaphysical freedom of the mind, which is a necessary condition precedent for intelligible thought about anything. Atheism simply exempts itself from the strictures of its own theory in an act of metaphysical faith that rivals, for sheer credulity, anything seen in fundamentalist Christianity.
Myself, I like my Christianity leveaned with a good does of Aristotelian rationalism. I am out of town for a few days, but I'll take this up when I return on Sunday, if anyone is still interested by then.

I believe that our God is omniscient and omnipotent - and that he has factored in EVERYTHING. But, having those qualities and accomplishing such factoring does not at all mean that God does not make distinctions between such beliefs and behaviors among mankind. I know not nearly enough to make a statement such as yours, and await the explanation of your apparently superior knowledge base.

We are aligned with religion and investing. Not bad.

Mother nature created man,then man created god.

Who created "mother nature"?

The big bang

So that's what Mother Nature called it!!!!!

I will never cease to be astonished at the erudition, intellectual accomplishment, ability to speak/write clearly and definitively, and the wisdom of many, many of the members. Then there are the rest of you poor losers who don't believe in God!


Terry

I think most members on the Fire believe in God we just may not believe in YOUR God.

CCCC,
"I believe that our God is omniscient and omnipotent"

Do you believe that God can smite someone who displeases him? If you don't believe God would smite someone who displeases him is it ok if he gets one of his believers to smite them? A yes or no answer is ok, please don't quote Bible scripture.

Sometimes I wonder what we're really debating in these threads. I read the following recently, a quote by someone who is undoubtedly much smarter than I am, and likely smarter than anyone posting on this thread:

And this coming from someone with a solid scientific education who describes himself as a non-religious person. He grew up in a faith but rejected it and does not practice faith. If an intelligent, non-religious person can see how implausible atheism is, then maybe some of us haven't thought it through. Still, thinking it through to a position of theism would leave one very, very far from being a Christian.

Steve.