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Kind, in that context, is synonymous with species. The Old Testament wasn't written in English. Specimens (individuals) of each species (kind) always produce offspring of the same species (kind). No violence is done to the scriptures by scientific knowledge.


Lot's of scientists I read don't agree with you. Is a goat and a sheep the same species? I think they are the same kind because someone successfully read them.


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Now you're playing games with words. You required an example of a thousand-cell species. I provided one.


You are not doing any better using my words than you do using God's Word. I asked for examples of ten celled creatures, hundred celled creatures. There should be trillions of examples of them with intermediates found in scores of strata.

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A second example was also offered, i.e., you when you were a zygote. You didn't limit your requirement to adults. Zygotes are specimens of animals with very few somatic cells. You then, after the fact, introduced the new requirement of adulthood. Still, that leaves the example I provided of the thousand-cell adult species. You keep moving the goalpost.


Give mew a break. You gave an example of an adult. The context of this conversation is adult examples.


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Originally Posted by Ringman
Give mew a break. You gave an example of an adult. The context of this conversation is adult examples.
Yes, I gave you an example of an adult as well. Now you say a thousand somatic cells is too large, while before you included that as an example that you'd find persuasive. You keep moving the goalpost.

That said, it's unlikely that you'd find a multicellular organism with much fewer than a thousand cells, since it's likely that nature quickly settled on larger numbers of cells at the colony phase of the evolution of multicellular life, as complexity is more adaptive than simplicity, and complexity requires more cells.

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Yes, I gave you an example of an adult as well. Now you say a thousand somatic cells is too large, while before you included that as an example that you'd fine persuasive. You keep moving the goalpost.


Where do you get the idea I say a thousand celled creature is too large? That is one of the examples I asked for.

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That said, it's unlikely that you'd find a multicellular organism with much fewer than a thousand cells, since it's likely that nature quickly settled on larger numbers of cells at the colony phase of the evolution of multicellular life, as complexity is more adaptive than simplicity, and complexity requires more cells.


Nature? Nature is a word used to describe a concept. It does not have intelligence to decide anything.

Without passing through the ten celled and hundred celled and anything in between the ten and the thousand celled creature you used, there is no thousand celled creature. The fossil record should be filled with examples of the intermediates.


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Taxonomy is a funny thing since it is always changing and there are always different systems being used at the same time. A friend of mine is still teaching and came down to visit my wife and me. She was working on some tests that had a taxonomic system that I had never seen.

I was lecturing in my Zoology class several years ago when I noticed that the taxonomic system of the new edition of the book was very different from the earlier edition. How embarrassing. So much for class prep. I did a whole lot of reading that night.

One of the major species I studied for a thesis had a name change while I was writing. That was annoying in the days of typewriters.

The Rainbow Trout has had a significant change since I took Ichthyology back in 1973. The taxonomists not only changed the name of the species but also put into a different genus. Several of the other fish I knew back then have different names now.

I spent a good deal of time looking at different textbooks for several classes. One thing that was annoying was that there were often as many as different taxonomic organizations as there were different textbooks. The number of Kingdoms ranged from three or four to about ten.

The Cladistics folks are trying to change all taxonomic categories to conform to their ideas.

Taxonomy is one of the softest parts of a soft science. Those who are still active in the field are constantly trying to make it a better description of what exists in the real world.

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Originally Posted by Notropis
Taxonomy is a funny thing since it is always changing and there are always different systems being used at the same time. A friend of mine is still teaching and came down to visit my wife and me. She was working on some tests that had a taxonomic system that I had never seen.

I was lecturing in my Zoology class several years ago when I noticed that the taxonomic system of the new edition of the book was very different from the earlier edition. How embarrassing. So much for class prep. I did a whole lot of reading that night.

One of the major species I studied for a thesis had a name change while I was writing. That was annoying in the days of typewriters.

The Rainbow Trout has had a significant change since I took Ichthyology back in 1973. The taxonomists not only changed the name of the species but also put into a different genus. Several of the other fish I knew back then have different names now.

I spent a good deal of time looking at different textbooks for several classes. One thing that was annoying was that there were often as many as different taxonomic organizations as there were different textbooks. The number of Kingdoms ranged from three or four to about ten.

The Cladistics folks are trying to change all taxonomic categories to conform to their ideas.

Taxonomy is one of the softest parts of a soft science. Those who are still active in the field are constantly trying to make it a better description of what exists in the real world.
Dawkins discusses this extensively in The Greatest Show On Earth.

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Originally Posted by Ringman
... there is no thousand celled creature.


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Now there is a documentation that a guy who got his GED when he was fifty-one years old can make a mistake. Now show us the creatures with fewer cells than this one. After all your theory depends on their existence.


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Look at rotifers, gastrotrichs, and a few others. Some sponges and corals may also fit your requirements.

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Originally Posted by Notropis
Look at rotifers, gastrotrichs, and a few others. Some sponges and corals may also fit your requirements.


Also Rhombozoa.


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Originally Posted by Take_a_knee
Originally Posted by RockyRaab
My point is that there is zero evidence that we did NOT evolve naturally and in the exact same way as every other life form on this planet.


I have no evidence that you're anything other than a life-long pedophile.


Were I to ever come upon a scene where you were engulfed in flames, I'd immediately seek out a skewer and a bag of marshmallows.

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Originally Posted by Middlefork_Miner


What about Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot??? Every one of them had exposure to Christianity...IIRC, Hitler had even considered becoming a priest when he was a child.


Remember, according to the Bible, God committed genocide more than once, with the Flood in Genesis being an example of almost total Genocide on a global scale..

Given that, I suspect Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot would feel right at home in Heaven and be in good company..

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Originally Posted by Ringman
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Kind, in that context, is synonymous with species. The Old Testament wasn't written in English. Specimens (individuals) of each species (kind) always produce offspring of the same species (kind). No violence is done to the scriptures by scientific knowledge.


Lot's of scientists I read don't agree with you. Is a goat and a sheep the same species? I think they are the same kind because someone successfully read them.
Originally Posted by Ringman
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Kind, in that context, is synonymous with species. The Old Testament wasn't written in English. Specimens (individuals) of each species (kind) always produce offspring of the same species (kind). No violence is done to the scriptures by scientific knowledge.


Lot's of scientists I read don't agree with you. Is a goat and a sheep the same species? I think they are the same kind because someone successfully read them.


NO, Goats and Sheep are not the same species, and cannot normally interbreed.


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Originally Posted by Steve
Originally Posted by Notropis
Look at rotifers, gastrotrichs, and a few others. Some sponges and corals may also fit your requirements.


Also Rhombozoa.


That is a good one.

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Originally Posted by Ringman
Now there is a documentation that a guy who got his GED when he was fifty-one years old can make a mistake. Now show us the creatures with fewer cells than this one. After all your theory depends on their existence.
No it does not. The biological sciences can be characterized as a nonstop series of street signs pointing to evolution. Someone who hasn't studied the biological sciences can be forgiven for not realizing that, though.

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Originally Posted by Pete E
Originally Posted by Middlefork_Miner


What about Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot??? Every one of them had exposure to Christianity...IIRC, Hitler had even considered becoming a priest when he was a child.


Remember, according to the Bible, God committed genocide more than once, with the Flood in Genesis being an example of almost total Genocide on a global scale..

Given that, I suspect Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot would feel right at home in Heaven and be in good company..
When a potter smashes certain of his pots, he's merely exercising discretion. When a customer in his shop does it, he's committing a crime. Very crucial distinction.

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The biological sciences can be characterized as a nonstop series of street signs pointing to evolution.


Why are there so many Ph.D and master's degree scientists who disagree with this opinion?


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Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Very crucial distinction.


I suppose it is when your God has killed more Jews than Hitler..


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Originally Posted by Pete E
Originally Posted by Middlefork_Miner


What about Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot??? Every one of them had exposure to Christianity...IIRC, Hitler had even considered becoming a priest when he was a child.


Remember, according to the Bible, God committed genocide more than once, with the Flood in Genesis being an example of almost total Genocide on a global scale..

Given that, I suspect Hitler, Stalin & Pol Pot would feel right at home in Heaven and be in good company..


IMHO religion is one of the most destructive forces ever created by man.

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Originally Posted by Ringman
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The biological sciences can be characterized as a nonstop series of street signs pointing to evolution.


Why are there so many Ph.D and master's degree scientists who disagree with this opinion?


Take the blinders off and you'll see orders of magnitude of scientists who disagree with yours.


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