Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Muzzleloaders lets talk about this new mdl 700 ultimate mzldr

Im a 100% muzzleloading newbie, i do like the idea of long range accuracy with a muzzleloader. on my wisconsin farm i frequently see some absolute slammers during the muzzleloader season out in my foodplots. To reach them in these deer id need a muzzleloader capable of a 250 yard shot. Are there any other muzzle loaders that are capable of this kind of accuracy? What do you guys think of the price, i see i can get a kit for 1299 shipped that included a leupold scope with graduated drop compensating. Im particularly interested in the primer system them use, looks like a 44 mag case with a large rifle primer in it.

no one familiar with these? Remington is touting 300+yard capability out of them with 200gr of pyrodex pellets

have fun holding onto it with 200gr of powder. Should leave a nice kiss mark across shooters faces when they shoulder it quickly for a fast take aim and fire, shot.

I'm sure the Remington is up to it but a lot of muzzleloaders are capable of making a 250 yd kill, and with less than 200 grains of powder. However all of them, including the Remington, require load development (the right bullet/powder combo) and much practice to be consistent at that range. Personally I'd concentrate on the hunting aspect & try to get a closer shot....part of the reason for the season.



JMO YMMV

There are better options. Why does anyone need a "bolt action" on a muzzleloader? What purpose does it serve? On second thought, shooting a 200 grain load, you'll probably need all the extra metal in there you can get......

I have not looked into the new Rem ML a ton, but I do know that you can get accurately out to 300 yards in a few different ways, many of them more affordable and easier on the shoulder.

I got interested in the "long range" muzzleloading about 7 or 8 years ago. At that time it meant dropping my irons for a scope, finding the most aerodynamic bullet I could and shooting it a lot to get consistent drops. Since then I have gotten more intentional using scopes with dials, BH209 or smokeless (where applicable) and better bullet selection and even more practice. I don't believe I ever used more than two powder pellets or 105gr or so of BH209 in this pursuit.

Here is a doe taken 4 or 5 seasons ago with your average Encore ML with two pellets, simple scope and 250gr SST @ 246 yards.


Or, more recently, a smokeless conversion Encore, with CDS scope and confirmed drops. Felt good out to 300 or so (with good rest and conditions).


While the Rem is flashy, I would rather shoot more with less powder and in a rifle that was not quite as pricey.
Just as with CF rifles - practice and placement are key once you get out to "long range" with there muzzleloaders.

Before paying that much for the new Remington, look at a smokeless muzzleloader. The amount of crud from four pellets has to be a real mess, not to mention the recoil. I have several friends who have Savage smokeless muzzleloaders in one form or another and several others have Remington first generation muzzleloaders that have been converted to .45 caliber smokeless. A friend of mine does several conversions per year as a sideline.

$1300 can build you a 45cal smokeless that will send a 275gr bullet down range at over 2500fps with ease and there is no need for a sabot.

Why would you want a form 4473 smoker for that price when you can build one that can use a huge variety of powders AND has a match grade custom barrel?

Pacnor, Brux or McGowen barrels will typically shoot circles around a factory Rem barrel.

If you already have a Rem700 CF, Stevens 200 or a Savage 11 SA the cost is little more than the barrel and bolt head. You could even convert one to a Krieger barrel with a LRMP module ignition for about that price at Hankins rifle. It even retains the factory bolt head if its based on the 308Win case.

How does a 275gr bullet at 3000fps sound vs that pellet burner?

Is that last sentence a typo??

I'd prefer a .270/.308, and save my shoulder.

Nope, a Hankins with Rem 700 CF action and Krieger 45cal barrel will shoot a Parker 275gr bullet at 3000fps with 78gr of 4198. He uses his own LRMP module and breach plug design.

http://www.hankinscustomrifles.com/rifles.html



He no longer uses a Knight breach plug and nipple. Its a custom breach plug with a tungsten bushing. They last for many hundreds of shots before the bushing wears out. I know of one with over 400 rounds though it and its still within spec.

Cool video, notice how easy they load http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ksRm9DLXKM

I have been shooting the original Ultimate Muzzleloader for years and just set up a Remington for a friend last week.

Let's look at price. My friend paid about $800. Check Gunbroker.

We have only shot the new Remington out to 100 yds using 4 50gr Pyrodex pellets and a 250gr Horn SST (use the black high pressure sabots). Groups are running a little over 1".

The priming system is what really makes this work. I use Fed 215 Match primers. I believe this is what makes clean up so easy. Everything gets burned. No need to pull a breech plug. Just a couple of damp patches with Butch's Bore Shine for ML and you are done.

I have read some posts speculating about the use of loose powder vs pellets in the UML. When I first got mine I chronographed 4- 50gr 777 pellets vs 200gr (by volume)777 loose powder. The pellets were yielding a little under 2300fps with a 300 gr SST, the loose powder 1800fps. I suspect the difference is caused by the pellets having the hole for the flash to travel through, thus igniting the full powder column nearly at once vs the long column of loose powder being ignited from the bottom.

Regarding the long range accuracy, last weekend checked my zero for the upcoming season. I put 2 shots 2" apart at 300 yds. Close enough.

I like my original UML and I believe the Remington will work out well. Easy and effective priming system, very easy to clean, accurate and dependable.

405wcf

Very strange, my Knights got at least 1800fps with just 110gr of Triple7 loose.

It appears the data is flawed.

The Ultimate is not even made to handle BH209 powder. Ask the owner of Ultimate Firearms. No way in hell i would pay that kind of money for a rifle that will flame cut its plug just from using BH209.

I can have one built for less that will shoot pellets and a huge variety of powders with LRMPs. Ill take a Krieger or Brux barrel over a Lothar Walther anyday.

Or you can buy a new in box smokeless already built by Savage for $1379.00...

http://www.gunsinternational.com/detail.cfm?gun_id=100479569&pop_up=1

Savage99F358

I paid less than that for all of mine including my Savage 45cal with a Pacnor 45 barrel. Not one Savage MLII even cost me over $600.

What they are asking does not mean that is what they will get. There are several on Dougs board already to go with lots of addons.

You can almost buy a NULA M209 for that and save about 4lbs in weight.

All I can say to that is "Holy Mackeral Andy....."

I havent gone over 70gr of H4198 in mine simply because it wackems just fine and im not a huge fan of anymore recoil. I dont have a muzzle brake on mine either.

An ML with a muzzle brake?? Dayum.

Yeah, quite a few guys get them and it does tame the recoil. I shoot both sabots and sabotless though and to me, its a little bit easier to load without a brake. Sure they can be removed and replaced with a collar but its obnoxiously loud with them installed. Its just not worth the extra cost to me.

How much does a Hankin muzzleloader cost??? I have an Encore I am happy enough with but smokeless has always interesred me.