Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles .223 and deer bullets

I have read several reports of deer being shot with .223 and big game bullets leaving little to no blood trail. After my seven year old killed one on Saturday with a 50 grain TTSX and deer left no blood trail it got me to thinking. I think he will hunt with the 223 at least one more year and then I have a younger son that will use it also so I am thinking I will need to change bullets and/or caliber to see blood trails.

Do the heavier (65+ grain) bullets leave a better blood trail on average from the 223?

Do .224 bullets work better with more speed say from a 22-250, 220 swift, etc. ?

Or all they all about the same?

Dink

I could show pics of about my last 6 223 kills. I never needed to blood trail any of them.

Everything from a$$ shots to neck shots.

Maybe somebody else can better answer. Blood tails have never been an issue, as of yet....

Just three days ago I saw two examples of very light blood trails from well hit deer. Plenty of gun was used too, 7mm mag with 160 grain bullets. Through and through shots.

Too heavy of a bullet that won't expand will do that. I never understand why people run a bullet constructed for elk or moose on deer, or vice versa.

If your not shooting for bone then shot placement needs to be slightly lower with the 22's and the blood trails tend to be more like those with broadheads.

I wouldn't know anything about this.....

I saw the deer being dressed. The bullets thoroughly tore up the innards, so even though the bullets weren't recovered there is no reason for me to believe they didn't expand.

Range and shock can do that, even if there wasn't any expansion. A 140 out of the 7 would have been a better choice.

Dink I've never killed anything with a .223 but I do have some anecdotal stories for you. Make of them what you will.

A acquaintance of mine many moons ago decided to go from black powder muzzle loaders back to modern arms. He settled on the Ruger Mini-14 in .223. He asked me what type of bullets he should use. I responded that his caliber choice was crazy but if he had to use that caliber full metal jackets were the only thing use. He shot a antelope with FMJ several times before the antelope died. No blood trail and extremely hard to find but he did find the antelope. He switched to 55 grain soft points on his next kill which was a Muley buck shoot through the neck. One shoot and dead right there. The big difference between the FMJ and the soft point was the FMJ went in and out leaving two small holes and no blood trail whereas the soft point exploded inside of the deer like a hand grenade had gone off. No exit hole and no blood trail but there was no need for one as the deer died right where it had been shot. The next target was a very large black bear. Same outcome. One shot in the boiler plate as the bear stood up on its hind legs at about 75 yards, the bear let out a woof fell over backwards and died right there. 55 grain soft point, no exit hole, the insides looked like a hand grenade had gone off.

Hunted with an old mountain man type who hunted with the only rifle he had an original Remington factory rifle in 22-250 who hunted everything from prairie dogs to grizzlies (when it was legal) with elk his favorite meat. 55 to 60 grain bullets with same results.

I've worked with retired professional hunters for the Feds that used .220 Swifts and .22-250's to hunt everything including grizzlies. They all used 55 to 60 grain bullets at high speed that fragmented like a grenade inside of the animal. No blood trails but there really wasn't a need for one. All animals were DRT or a few feet from where they were shot.

All the anecdotal evidence I've heard or seen has suggested to me a .224 caliber in the 55 to 60 grain soft point range driven at very high velocities and that fragment will get the job done. But if one wants a blood trail to follow than big bullets that leave a big hole hole going in and hopefully an even bigger hole coming out is the way to go.

I've shot one deer with a 55 gr bullet 185 yards in the head went down right there didn't need a blood trail . I use any gun between an mostly a 270 shoot for head don"t need blood trail. when you shoot at target where do you shoot at an what your group at 200 yards enough said

I don't follow your logic. If the innards are thoroughly messed up via "range and shock" or by an expanding bullet passing through, they're still thoroughly messed up. So why no big blood trail from the two holes, given the carnage between them?

The bullets were Partitions which have soft front ends deliberately made to readily expand and cause tissue disruption. Ranges were inside 250 yards, so the bullets weren't below the speed threshold for expansion.

I prefer the 154 grain Hornady for my 7 mags, but I sincerely doubt these Partitions didn't open.

I've been thinking on .223 bullets quite a bit lately. I've taken several deer with the 62 TSX. I've only shot shoulders and they've gone down right there, a few have kicked a bit but there was no tracking. I've no complaints about the bullet. There was also precious little blood left at the scene of the crime.

I put a .223AI together for my kids to use but the oldest (9) hasn't shot anything with it yet. He's pretty good on paper but I've been thinking about the blood trail if he shoots for the lungs. Line of sight after the shot on a running deer is very short where we hunt...without a blood trail it could get tough. It has made me consider a more violent bullet to the lungs....

I guess I should lung shoot one with the 62TSX for R&D to see for myself.

My bud's dad "Pappy" used to call the 7mmRM the "worst SOB deer rifle there is". And that is because they would "pencil through at high speed with little shock and often produce runners" (in his words).....

I have a nice supply of 70TSXs yet.

BUT, I picked up at least 400 or more Win 64gr. PowerPoints. When TSXs do run out, I have no problem running the Winnys at deer......

On the whole expansion thing, I can't believe the old myths and beliefs still exist. Hunting bullets will typically do all the expanding they are going to do in the first 3-4 inches( Bergers seem to be an exception).
They do not fail to expand or 'pencil on through'
Velocity has a lot to do with it, bigger, heavier, slower bullets don't leave the really messy wound channels ultra fast bullets do. But at high speeds you can put a hole through a critter big enough to fit your gun in with a solid. At low speeds the same bullet makes a little hole. It didn't expand either time.
Even the monolithic bullets expand fully in the first few inches.....

Got a nice .222 listed in the classifieds if that would interest you for deer.

Got two of them...

Don't be ridiculous.

You can't use a 222 on deer.

That would be a good thing then, since my broadheads let blood out like a firehose.

I honestly have a hard time telling which kills better. I've used 223s to a 480 Ruger, and everything in between. They all work very well.

The largest bloodtrail I've seen to date was produced by a 444 Marlin @ 50yds. via a 270gr Speer Gold Dot (Deep Curl). There was blood for 6 feet on both sides of trail the 5.5 yr. old doe ran down before dropping. Golf ball sized entrance hole, baseball sized exit hole.

I will say I have seen some pretty dramatic stuff with the big bores. Where it looked like the invisible man spin kicked the deer and knocked it sideways, upon impact. Literally knocking them off their feet. BUT, dead is dead, and the smaller calibers, at higher speed with good bullets, have never failed to produce dead deer.....